Meet THC-O, a hemp-derived compound three times stronger than THC

[G.O. Joe]

PS: When I ran it through our gas chromatograph, the THC-O-A (?) peak was to the left of the THC peakl

Not surprising, d9 acetate being much less polar without the free phenol. d8 acetate is even less polar.

Ketene reacts with acetone to make acetic anhydride.

Or acetone does not react with ketene. That patent is old news, Ac2O via acetic acid plus ketene from acetone having already been patented in 1922. Ketene production has several issues and is only suitable on a very large or very small scale. The chlorine mentioned earlier refers to patents from 1908 which are more convenient, and would likely be preferred in Afghanistan and Burma if it was actually difficult to get Chinese Ac2O there.

If anyone is wondering about smoking something with residual acetone also producing ketene, the yield of ketene from acetone without air at 600-750 C is small and the amount of residual acetone would also be small.

 

[Swamp Thang]

If anyone is wondering about smoking something with residual acetone also producing ketene, the yield of ketene from acetone without air at 600-750 C is small and the amount of residual acetone would also be small.

Yes sir I would be worried about ingesting exotic chemicals. I tend to err on the side of caution, generally speaking.

 

[Gry]

The Japanese were producing Ac2O in large amounts by the thirties.

 

[G.O. Joe]

Yes sir I would be worried about ingesting exotic chemicals. I tend to err on the side of caution, generally speaking.

There is however nothing exotic about acetone. You're exhaling some right now. It's in your blood because your body is making it.

Don't forget to worry about the bananas loaded with benzene, the rice packed with arsenic, and tea chock full of aluminum. And the terps! You've gotta love known carcinogen pot terpenes like pulegone.

 

[Gray Wolf]

It's doubtful that it's even possible for an acetate to be more potent, because it's likely that the acetate has to be metabolized to a free phenol to have any activity.

I didn't find it more potent, but it arrived almost instantly, suggesting it passed the blood brain barrier rapidly and whatever metabolizing was required happened almost instantly. So fast that the most common word out of the test subjects' mouth was, "Wow", and the second most common statement was, "That wasn't at all like I thought it would be.".

No.

Acids rearrange cannabinoids. Don't mix them with acids unless you want them to rearrange to a mixture of unknown composition. A limited amount of published work on acid reaction with d9 exists, particularly with heat and without alcohol. The reaction with tosic acid is known, and tosic acid is comparable to sulfuric acid.

I'm unaware of any literature where an acid is added to acetic anhydride and a cannabinoid, and the only time I've seen a base not added since the 50's is when the Cannabis Alchemy procedure using neat Ac2O is sort of followed and sort of analyzed (Science & Justice 1996; 36: 195-197).

The result of mixing acid with a cannabinoid will vary with temperature, concentration, time, and solvent. Predictable results will only happen when a procedure's product is fully analyzed and repeated exactly!

d8 is a common end product because it's more stable. Cannabinoids also rearrange with strong bases. These aren't a reaction of cannabinoids really, it's a reaction of terpenes. d9 and CBD can be seen as substituted limonenes. These rearrangements are as easy and complex in cannabinoids as in terpenes.

My idea of THC acetate came from reading D Gold, but Pharmer Joe was the one who came up with our formula, based on the formula for making aspirin from salicyclic acid. I called and asked him what the H2SO4 was for since we were starting with D-9 THC and he noted that it was a small amount and was a catalyst, not for isomerizing.

Whatever it makes was uniformly declared good stuff by us'n and all the students who tried it. As I noted it shifted the GC peak to the left but we had no GC standard that would identify it.

Better washing and drying is better. If you've mixed some of your Ac2O with water and shaken some, you've seen that it's not as reactive as it's made out to be. Takes a few minutes for the layer to disappear, depending on how much water is added. I'm not sure how much base treatment the ester can handle but in general I've noticed that esters have some resistance to hydrolysis with unheated base.

We continued to repeatedly wash with brine past when it was neutral, with little effect on shelf life.

I was able to get hold of the Ketene paper author Robert Strongin, who said that the experiments were run at 378C and the e-pens were run at 10 watts, which is right in the range of concern.

Propitiously he's promised to supply more information regarding their procedures, and has given me permission to share it on GWL blog site and here. More when I get the additional information:

Whether you are comfortable with Pharmer Joe's formula or not, it is a matter of record that it works well, but that leaves the question of whether it could work better with a different acid, though both issues are moot if the end result is another rash of pneumonia deaths.

I've seen movements to block D-8 Acetate as a way to get around current THC laws, but not yet for health concerns, so I sent the FDA special agent who contacted me regarding Vitamin E acetate an e-mail inquiring if they were currently looking at cannabis acetates and have yet to get a reply. I'll share it when I do:

 

[Swamp Thang]

There is however nothing exotic about acetone. You're exhaling some right now. It's in your blood because your body is making it.

Don't forget to worry about the bananas loaded with benzene, the rice packed with arsenic, and tea chock full of aluminum. And the terps! You've gotta love known carcinogen pot terpenes like pulegone.

In addition to cultivating weed for personal consumption using purely organic methods, I grow my own bananas, acerolas, oranges, and borojoa out here on the Equator while studiously avoiding the use of agro-chemicals, so unless benzene is a naturally occurring chemical in any of those fruit varieties, I wouldn't expect to encounter a significant concentration of it in my normal backwoods diet. That said, my knowledge about the other additives you mentioned is limited though I imagine that even trace amounts of arsenic in any food item would have devastating and immediate effects on one's health.

All the same, this old dog remains unwilling to learn new tricks when it comes to entrusting my life to the product of science lab experiments conducted on cannabis when my good old-fashioned organically cultivated and cured bud checks all the boxes. Please forgive both my wariness on this subject of "improving" cannabis buds and the morbid curiosity that compels me to read every insight shared on this topic. My inquiring mind demands to know hehe.

 

[Gray Wolf]

Prof Robert Strongin came through. Here is both the study and the addendum with the scans: Vape temperature was 378C and the e-pen was set at 10-watts.

 

[Gray Wolf]

I did get a response from the FDA special agent, who thanked me and passed it up the chain. More when/if I hear more:

 

[Petrochemical]

May i get insight on thc -v ?

 

[goingrey]

May i get insight on thc -v ?

THCV is a naturally occurring but relatively rare cannabinoid with a lot of claimed medical benefits. It is said to be an appetite suppressant, neuroprotective, anti-inflammatory, analgesic, and a bone growth stimulator. Despite what was believed just a few years ago, it is not intoxicating.

 

[Petrochemical]

I should grow out these novarine seeds then...anything beneficial like that needs to be grown

 

[maddygobi]

Well, it is still poorly researched and unstable. I would not take the risk to take it in any form because I cannot be sure how my body will react to it.
I would not recommend it to anyone because experiments are sometimes not worth it. There are plenty of delta 8 products near you that you can use and stay relatively safe if you know your tolerance level and measure. You can use this one in many forms, but my favorite is vaping. It’s not as strong as smoking, but I still get somewhat high.
Also, it is legal in my state, and I don’t have to worry about the issues with the police constantly.

 

[Gray Wolf]

8.15 Danger Will Robinson! Danger, Danger!

 

[Gry]

My understanding is that where we once had the JWH series, there are now a number of replacements for them some of which are
far stronger. Wonder if that is what is being sold in gas stations and the quick stop type places.
One of the more tragic things I recall having heard is that young military recruits use the stuff because it does not show in the piss tests.

 

[Swamp Thang]

My understanding is that where we once had the JWH series, there are now a number of replacements for them some of which are
far stronger. Wonder if that is what is being sold in gas stations and the quick stop type places.
One of the more tragic things I recall having heard is that young military recruits use the stuff because it does not show in the piss tests.

Artificially manufactured THC is highly addictive and leaves users prone to psychosis. This is about as far removed from natural cannabis as is cocaine hydrochloride power from coca leaves. Too much of a good thing, or too great a concentration ingested, can be fatal. Oh, how I pine for the good old days when buds were grown organically, and neither spiked with chemicals nor "refined" to improve on perfection.

 

[ChrisWalter]

The comparisons to conventional THC and its psychedelic effects make it quite fascinating. Your post provides a comprehensive overview of THC-O's history, including its initial study by the US military and its recent rise in production.

 

[armedoldhippy]

i was gifted some THC-O a while back, and tried it almost immediately afterwards. it had a decent buzz as i recall, but...like all substitutes, it lacks the "soul" of real weed.