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Coir and jacks321

Coir-or-die

New member
Second grow using jacks 321, growing under led in straight coir and am hand watering using ro water(18ppm after filters).I keep running into weird leaf issues/deficiencies. I am not adding any calmag due to being told jacks 321 has ample in it for coir (is this wrong) I am using the ratio on thier website 3.79 of part a, 2.52 part b and 0.99 Epson salt. Started the seedling out at 125 ppm ph 5.85 then walked them up by 100 ppm slowly until im at 400 ppm now with a ph of 5.85 ro 6.0. Is my ratio off for coir?? Strain is zamaldelica by ace seeds and strawberry cough
 

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Creeperpark

Well-known member
Mentor
Veteran
You need more cal-mag because using 18ppm RO is way too soft. Bring the water ppm up to about 40 to 90 ppm and see if that helps. Also, make sure you have plenty of breeze over the canopy for calcium transpiration. 😎
 
You need more cal-mag because using 18ppm RO is way too soft. Bring the water ppm up to about 40 to 90 ppm and see if that helps. Also, make sure you have plenty of breeze over the canopy for calcium transpiration. 😎
Do you even know what part B of jacks even is? Lmfao.its CALCIUM NITRATE It's and .99g of Epsom is the MAGNESIUM. no he does NOT NEED MORE CALMAG DUDE. stop talking shit you don't know. That's foolish.

More than likely the leds are too close
 
Ok thank you.
Don't listen to.that guy
Your part b is your calcium. Epsom is your magnesium. You just need to find YOUR proper EC for your specific room. Keep PH in check, and LED lights very far away from the plants for a bit till they bounce back after a good flush. Adding a calmag product is completely pointless and will alter the ratio of the jacks. Not to mention bend you over at the hydro store
 

Legalcdn

Well-known member
Did you buffer the coir? Did it come buffered? Coir will take all the calcium it can if it does not have enough. The first sign of calcium deficiency is a slight twisting of the leaves.

I use jacks also but i always buffer and i use pretty good coir.

Zam is a good strain.
 

LouDog420

Well-known member
Big difference in lighting requirements. HID runs the 321 jacks just fine (~1.5ec), but I also found it beneficial to run calmag.

Under high powered LEDs, I bump ec up to 2.6-3.0, otherwise they'll show deficiencies...

I also add calmag, MKP, and plantprod micro to jack's 321. Si to bump up the ph as needed. You might be able to make it work with part b and epsom, but this is what works for me...


Si+ 642 Jacks + 3ml/gal calmag + 1.0 g/gal MKP + 0.15 g/gal PP micro + 18ml/gal drip clean at 2.6-3.0ec under LED
full


Si+ 321 Jacks + 3ml/gal calmag + 0.5 g/gal MKP + 0.1g/gal PPmicro + 18ml/gal drip clean at 1.5ec under HID
full

full
 
Big difference in lighting requirements. HID runs the 321 jacks just fine (~1.5ec), but I also found it beneficial to run calmag.

Under high powered LEDs, I bump ec up to 2.6-3.0, otherwise they'll show deficiencies...

I also add calmag, MKP, and plantprod micro to jack's 321. Si to bump up the ph as needed. You might be able to make it work with part b and epsom, but this is what works for me...


Si+ 642 Jacks + 3ml/gal calmag + 1.0 g/gal MKP + 0.15 g/gal PP micro + 18ml/gal drip clean at 2.6-3.0ec under LED
full


Si+ 321 Jacks + 3ml/gal calmag + 0.5 g/gal MKP + 0.1g/gal PPmicro + 18ml/gal drip clean at 1.5ec under HID
full

full
Great looking plants. But if you upped your part b/calcium nitrate and added epsom salts that would be exactly the same as your 3 mL calmag. With additional sulfer and Cheaper too.
 

LouDog420

Well-known member
Great looking plants. But if you upped your part b/calcium nitrate and added epsom salts that would be exactly the same as your 3 mL calmag. With additional sulfer and Cheaper too.
It's what works for me.

Feel free to share your formula and plant pics!
 

negative37dBA

Well-known member
Veteran
I use added cal mag for my R/O water when I mix up my Jacks. Yes, you can adjust the ratios or....make your own cal mag and save big $$. You do not have to alter your Jacks formula and can add as needed without the cost. I have gotten on the train of making all my nutes from the pure crystal form. So much cheaper and you have the control.
The LED is a bit of a different beast when it comes to growing. Lots of advantages but some adjustments have to be made from the old school with HID. Reducing light intensity will help. If you have any type of device that can read PPFD or DLI that can be helpful to. Upping leaf temperature has had some good effects as well. Have fun.
Peace, negative.
 

COS

Active member
I'm using jacks 321 with additional 2.3 grams of Epson salt and still get mag def at 1000 ppfd
 
It's what works for me.

Feel free to share your formula and plant pics!
Of course its gonna work. Miracle grow will work too. Some of us old school fellas have yet to post a pic EVER for various reasons.

I started out using jacks when I first started dry nutes. Now I make my own using raw salts to save money and tinker.

Here's my mix veg mix right now with RO water In coco/leds

3.5g calcium nitrate
1g mono potassium phosphate
.5g Masterblend
2.5g epsom
1g magnisum nitrate
.1g MOST micros
ONE ppm iron DTPA
.4g potassium silicate
Fulvic/kelp/aminos

N-179
P-70
K-145
Ca-175
Mg-90


If I remove the one Gram of magnesium nitrate, it's basically an advanced Nutrient sensi clone 4-2-4. I like the added nitrogen till stretch ends tho.

During flower I just up the potassium to 250ish ppm, drop the calcium nitrate to lower nitrogen, then add gypsum to add back calcium. I'm still playing with phosphorus amounts. But so far this mix rocks.

If you run your nutrient numbers, they'll probably be very similar to mine. WITHOUT getting bent over at the hydro store paying for water in those big pretty jugs. That jug of armor Si costs the exact same as a few pounds of dry potassium silicate, which would make 10-15 of those jugs.

What are YOUR nutrient profile ppm numbers???? 😉

I hope this helps you save some money bro. It's always good to learn new things. 1000 ways to skin a cat
 

LouDog420

Well-known member
Of course its gonna work. Miracle grow will work too. Some of us old school fellas have yet to post a pic EVER for various reasons.

I started out using jacks when I first started dry nutes. Now I make my own using raw salts to save money and tinker.

Here's my mix veg mix right now with RO water In coco/leds

3.5g calcium nitrate
1g mono potassium phosphate
.5g Masterblend
2.5g epsom
1g magnisum nitrate
.1g MOST micros
ONE ppm iron DTPA
.4g potassium silicate
Fulvic/kelp/aminos

N-179
P-70
K-145
Ca-175
Mg-90


If I remove the one Gram of magnesium nitrate, it's basically an advanced Nutrient sensi clone 4-2-4. I like the added nitrogen till stretch ends tho.

During flower I just up the potassium to 250ish ppm, drop the calcium nitrate to lower nitrogen, then add gypsum to add back calcium. I'm still playing with phosphorus amounts. But so far this mix rocks.

If you run your nutrient numbers, they'll probably be very similar to mine. WITHOUT getting bent over at the hydro store paying for water in those big pretty jugs. That jug of armor Si costs the exact same as a few pounds of dry potassium silicate, which would make 10-15 of those jugs.

What are YOUR nutrient profile ppm numbers???? 😉

I hope this helps you save some money bro. It's always good to learn new things. 1000 ways to skin a cat

Thanks for sharing the info, very helpful

Rough calcs from an old excel sheet I had, put my current flower mix at:

N - 132
P - 73
K - 225
Ca - 115
Mg - 85

I've been meaning to try the agsil for a bit. Have heard from others running higher calcium and your numbers confirm that. Might have to give it a rework.

Do you run the gypsum through irrigation/emitters without clogs?

A lot of it is convenience, it works, pop in to mix a res and let it run. I hope to have the space to tinker more soon. For those struggling with jacks and without getting too deep into salts, calmag is often a relatively easy off the shelf solution but certainly not the cheapest or most fine tuned.

Thanks for the breakdown!
 

COS

Active member
The problem with calmag well at least for me is it has too much nitrogen and it makes my lower fan leaves look dark and saggy but it dose fix the calmag problems up top
 

RyanR

Active member
Growmore flowering cal-mag has no nitrogen. Why are you guys even bother with the armour si it takes forever to become bioavailable. I feel like it just washes out of coco / wool.
 
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