[Julian]

Originally Posted by africanherbman1

The reason that they are going out so late is due to the mothers regrowing a little slowly after the last batch of clones I took.

Git it, okay, so it's just scheduling and an anticipated out date...got it....

(lot of people hold onto things to get bigger before going out..,just clarifying...)

Where I live it will barely hit 90 in the beginning of august, and we do get a good bit of rain.

Well, still not nothing....90 a little significance since my rule of thumb is add 10, always, to anything.....

See, the reason I prefer to plant before storms is 2 fold, as stated....you can water less when initially planting, saves the load you have to deal with (water), rain saturates, and, also, usually brings overcast weather and a little cooler following with it (not always, but, helps)...so, between a little water, some crystals, the rain, and overcast......pretty much the smoothest and easiest start they could have (especially when later in season with the weather.....)

I'm planning on prepping the site w/ coco, bags of top soil...cow manure, hen manure, mushroom compost, ect, bat guano, a good organic flowering mixture, and water polymer crystals.

Okay, so, full prep...got it.....Now.....remember...when doing mini's you change your mix a little and you don't really want a veg mix...you want more of a flower...(since of course minimal veg time......sometimes what I do for them is hit em initially (planting) with a heavier (liquid) veg mix....and, a flower will still have some N, plus, of course, people forget soil's not neutral in the first place...will have varied amounts of everything, so, something to keep in mind that people sometimes overlook.... Was just talking about this a lot with someone.....

Last year I harvested the same strain mid october due to small amounts of mold, but the plants were a little bit bigger. I'm guessing that I will have less problems with mold, because the buds will be smaller on the minis.

Ahhhhhh , well, and also, since more out in the open and not always same locations.....you will have more sun, and more circulation

My smallest stuff people say is the best quality.....and, I personally have never had a single problem..(due to full sun and great circulation because more in the open.......so......you got it man .....exactly.......

Note: the bonus of smaller..can be more out in the open.......directly affecting yield and density, etc......product is awesome......I do a lot, sun from dusk till dawn.....

BUT.......

with such increased sun comes increased moisture issues depending where they are...if done in an area with a lot of vegetation?...helps out a little........if done more in the open, like I do em?.....full sun and heat?.......even more so for before the rains and the crystals......but, as said possible.....they get a good start,....they "grab"...and, usually from then on if fairly regular rain they should be fine..(like once a week after "the grab".....)

[Julian]

Some further notes and reminders regarding late plantings....

One should not forget, as above, to go lighter on the veg mix (N specifically)....but, some other things people should be aware of (most know, but sometimes overlook)....

They will not immediately "take" full force, so...one must always remember there is about a week or so when you put them in that they have to a "settle in", or, as I call it "the grab"....So....you have to make allowances for that week or so between them getting settled in and resuming full force...

(Yes, could be less...could be 3 days, could be 6 days.....can always call it a week and be right either way )

Thousands of strains with thousands of triggers, so, unless you have something you work with consistently, kind of hard to pinpoint exact times, exact sizes...sometimes will get a little too large,...sometimes will stay a little too small....

(I've said it many times....12/12 from seed thread is a fairly good glimpse of a wwide variety of strains and situations.....and, also, why I would say you want them out as early as possible (ie: don't hold back vegging, and then put them out and expect small...my lates, from this point on I put out at about 7 days or less...)

Much of the round above (last round, 500 in 40" x 40" pic couple days ago) I am already in the process of starting to send out..,.not even be a week since they broke the surface...and already starting to prep for next round...(although, these are still little early...just an example...)

Other reason is weather, and, if possible, due to size (essentially nothing, a sprout) many can even start them outside and it's not a problem (sightlines, neighbors, etc) Lot of places harsh weather so if can be essentially germed out or in sun, broken in....will help...

You don't want to hold them back if you want them smaller, and, of course, they won't really remain smaller, but, again...this is strain dependent and the real problem faced....(uncertainty of exact trigger dates out...only rough ideas...so, don't want to throw extra size on them on top of that....)

Railroad plots:
Under no circumstances do you want to be seen ( train....engineers, etc) Lot of accidents lately so some policies are now to call it in, shut down track until person located, so...you see a train....make sure you go for cover until well past...

[Julian]

Railroads:
All should also be reminded that many lines (trains, regions) will also spray for weeds and such, so, something to be aware of. My region it's really not applicable (deep dense city, with residential nearby) but I know, and also hear many places they do, so, the site all depends on your location. Likewise, I have plots further away, but also plots extremely close to tracks and train.

Now, also of thought is while some spots might be farther, I actually have some spots I like very, very much that are essentially very close to train stations, and, the reason for this is of course when trains coming up on stations their focus is not on the vegetation surrounding, but the tracks, station, and people....(get it? ) Whereas a longer stretch of nothing the eyes may get a chance to wander, but, of course, if placed right into surrounding vegetation, and, of course always later, not trees, really is not a problem anyway......

Now, regarding privacy.....since the above, (accidents, more aware and cautious) it means less pedestrian traffic than previously...so, that is also a bonus....(Lot of kids used walk, etc, hang out some spots....not as much these days in many places (not all)...so, that helps also regarding privacy...(In 5+ years I have never seen a single person myself in my areas......when I am in more rural areas, I see them all the time, so...something else to be aware of...)

Late Planted:
When getting later I tend to be less firm and tend to start raising lights a little for starts, because of course a little stretch is no problem, because you want a bit so that when you plant you are able to "sink" em...(from medium to first set buried)...to get as much distance as possible between surface of soil and top of medium for moisture issues, and, another thing that I have been starting to do is in addition to any crystals (deeper, mixed in), is I have started mixing finer(finest) lightly in the top couple inches on top of it...Once established, it's not as much of an issue but with a lot of sun, heat, so late in the season, it's always a crucial period when you first plant them....They're small....they have no penetration yet....very vulnerable to surface issues, much more so than earlier planted things and of course multiplied issues by weather. As soon as they grab, and get some penetration, they're usually fine, but, from the start..have to watch em....make sure they're okay (and, of course, you don't want to...you want to see them as little as possible/visit as little as possible......

[InjectTruth]

I feel like what Im looking for is right in front of my face, but I just cant quite see it until someone points it out. PLEASE get some city shots, or any shots, cuz for the life of me, I can only think of about one or two spots, and neither have native soil to dig into (abandoned lots)

[Julian]

Originally Posted by InjectTruth

I feel like what Im looking for is right in front of my face, but I just cant quite see it until someone points it out.

Explain....glad to help out if I can....

PLEASE get some city shots, or any shots, cuz for the life of me, I can only think of about one or two spots, and neither have native soil to dig into (abandoned lots)

Soon as I can get in (can even take one when I run out today from a distance of general location with a zoom)

1.How do you know? Have you actually tried to dig it? Have you seen it? Felt it?
2.What is access, traffic? are they safe? (at this point in season though, of course will be smaller and reduced exposure , so.....makes a lot of difference as far as stealth and security....(I was just doing areas backing a future development...)
3.Can you bring anything in?...
4.Depends what kind of lot it is....if it's a residential lot.....etc, I mean, soil should be halfway decent....

[Pimpslapped]

Originally Posted by Julian

Nah, I had it, I just added some things...(agree..but think how one proceeds and discipline even reduces it further..)

First off, I have to say that you're a machine at posting. It boggles the mind every time I read through this thread (And the indoor). You manage to convey a LOT of information with your posts and they're surprisingly easy to read, in comparison to a lot that give the same level of info.

Discipline is a big factor and one that I don't think I have in sufficient quantities to maintain a large scale commercial career. I also tend to think best with a sounding board, but with this sort of hobby the number of people I can have relevant discussions with for brainstorming are pretty small. (I would LOVE to be able to sit down with another grower or two on the porch with a few spliffs and some drinks to preference and just... talk about growing.)

Originally Posted by Julian

Eh, you'll do what and when you want.....depending on what your after, larger number might not even be necessary...

I think greed is an often misunderstood aspect....think it's more the latter of what you mentioned,...."the game".....addiction to growing...(which most know is an easily acquired habit

I can definitely see the addiction. I could get lost in 'The Game' easily, but I have to make sure that my reach doesn't exceed my grasp. I know that I am not suited to the 'social' aspects of The Game. But finding a trustworthy person to hand off the product to... that's where I run into a big, hard, grafitti splattered brick wall.

So how does one go about choosing a partner/partners? It has to come down to intuition, which isn't always my strong suit when dealing with people. I'm curious as to what sort of responses people will have to this, as it's a subject I have trouble with.

Originally Posted by Julian

I'm personally 100% covered on aerials for any location I do.....don't really have any areas done that are unavailable..(surprisingly.... even for the larger distant one...)

You're a lucky man there. At least in the aerials that I have access to, there are big vague sections (Poor grade satellite photos) all around a few spots I'm interested in perusing.

Good point on storing records electronically. Though a GPS could be handy for truly remote grows with minimal landmarks. I wouldn't store the location in the GPS unit, but tracking to coordinates could be useful. My woodland survival skills have atrophied a good bit over the years spent in cities. Especially on grows that are visited rarely (Low/no maint), since I know the appearance of an area can change drastically over seasons in regards to vegetation (and in many areas you may not have any other reliable landmarks).

Originally Posted by Julian

I personally think harvest is the most labor intensive time in the process.......planting?...eh, spots done and their in fairly quick.....harvest and related can go on for months afterwards ......definitely to me the most serious issue(s)...

Something to keep in mind, definitely. In my mind, it always seems like the initial site prep would involve the most work. It'd be the most physically demanding part, especially if much needs to be hauled out. But it'd still be quick. A days hard work on a plot and you're done... gotta remember that cutting the plants down is only the first stage of harvesting and that the full process takes a fair amount of time.

Originally Posted by Julian

Railroads:
All should also be reminded that many lines (trains, regions) will also spray for weeds and such, so, something to be aware of. My region it's really not applicable (deep dense city, with residential nearby) but I know, and also hear many places they do, so, the site all depends on your location. Likewise, I have plots further away, but also plots extremely close to tracks and train.

Good info there, I never thought about the fact that the rail areas may be getting sprayed. Another bit of info to tuck away and hope I have a chance to benefit from it. Same for hiding from trains. It makes sense that they'd shut the lines down in a lot of cases to avoid potential accidents. Never would have thought of that either. Also a good point on how people tend to focus, I know for a fact that many places/times I could easily walk past a semi-concealed grow and never notice. Also probably a reason for the tree stand grows... Humans very rarely look UP.

Originally Posted by Julian

Explain....glad to help out if I can....

Sounds like IT has the same problem I struggle with. I am still just starting to realize just how wide the options are for potential grow spots. My brain defaults to the secluded woodland hillside. It still takes a bit of a mental shift to see the other possibilities. I would love to see some photos of some of the less 'stereotypical' locations, but even just descriptions helps out a lot.

[dj digigrow]

waiting for these city spot pics... NYC or Chicago? lol just guessing...

anyways my question is on seed stock.. how can I turn a 10 pack into 1000 seeds...??

[Pimpslapped]

Originally Posted by dj digigrow

waiting for these city spot pics... NYC or Chicago? lol just guessing...

anyways my question is on seed stock.. how can I turn a 10 pack into 1000 seeds...??

To get 1000? Not quite sure how many seeds you'll get off each plant, but if you grow out that 10 pack and put a male next to a couple females, let nature take it's course. Depending on where you grow them, how long veg, etc... All those factors should effect the outcome (Bigger plant, outdoors=more seeds, I would assume). But 1 male+2 females should easily net you a few hundred seeds outdoors. You may need to add in a couple more girls to go 1k+, but you should end up with enough out of a 10 pack to go well over 1k.

Hopefuly somebody will chime in and correct me if I'm wrong. My one grow (indoors) so far wasn't one that produced any seeds, but I know when I get heavily seeded buds, just a few seem to net 100+ seeds.

[Julian]

Originally Posted by Pimpslapped

First off, I have to say that you're a machine at posting. It boggles the mind every time I read through this thread (And the indoor). You manage to convey a LOT of information with your posts and they're surprisingly easy to read, in comparison to a lot that give the same level of info.

I feel like one Well thanks man...very nice of you to say.

I've trained a lot of people in this, and, in business, (3 companies/3 industries) over the years, and, sincerely believe anyone can learn anything, anytime, quite easily......but, all depends on how it is explained...the delivery....(I was always a very difficult student......and, the older I get, the more I realize it's because my teachers sucked...)

Discipline is a big factor and one that I don't think I have in sufficient quantities to maintain a large scale commercial career. I also tend to think best with a sounding board, but with this sort of hobby the number of people I can have relevant discussions with for brainstorming are pretty small. (I would LOVE to be able to sit down with another grower or two on the porch with a few spliffs and some drinks to preference and just... talk about growing.)

Well.....discipline......comme rcial?....Forget it for a moment. To a degree the exact same things apply to any grower, anywhere, anytime, indoor or out (the most being security issues), and, of course, when I say "discipline" , I mean basically you do what you have to do, and do not alter that...

(As somewhere above.....most "mistakes" are not truly "mistakes"....If one is fully aware of something, yet, for some reason or another consciously chooses not to adhere to that....well....absolutely no excuse....)

I agree, and sometimes why I take so much pleasure in these discussions...Just talking about things one often in the process will get a lot of new ideas....(I do, all the time....just from these threads......a lot....)

I can definitely see the addiction. I could get lost in 'The Game' easily, but I have to make sure that my reach doesn't exceed my grasp. I know that I am not suited to the 'social' aspects of The Game. But finding a trustworthy person to hand off the product to... that's where I run into a big, hard, grafitti splattered brick wall.

Nah....you sound like your very aware of your abilities and limitations and comfort level......

Self awareness (regarding any aspect of ones self) is under rated, and, I see less and less these days, and, the more time goes on (from anyone, anywhere)....I've grown to greatly respect anyone who is able to turn their power of observation of the world, upon themselves......

I think the world would be a much better (and different ) place if people knew who they are, what they are, what they know, what they don't know, their weaknesses, their limitations, etc.....Most don't, and, to me at least....such people are worthy of respect....

So how does one go about choosing a partner/partners? It has to come down to intuition, which isn't always my strong suit when dealing with people. I'm curious as to what sort of responses people will have to this, as it's a subject I have trouble with.

There was a lot of that in the indoor thread....not sure what's left..

Your intuition my friend is just as strong as the next persons, whether to utilize it or not (note that I said "utilize", not "realize" .....

Forget intuition for a moment......forget it...don't need it...

Who someone is?

It's always right there in front of you.....in what they do...what they say....how they view the world and others...how they treat others.....

How would I screen someone?....

Sit back and have a couple drinks....and talk.....Just talk.....

About what?....

Nothing at all

(a repeat of indoor thread coming, forgive me if repeated but valid...)

You sit, you relax....you talk.....

Do they treat waiter/waitress bad?....Do they get mad because they had to wait a minute?, or do they say "eh, it's busy, their trying the best they can.." (understanding, patience, or lack of.... just displayed......)

Do they bitch about work because the boss is an asshole because he was fired because he fucked the secretary in the utility closet? (which would only be normal, again, lack of understanding, display of having no clue how life works......refusing to take responsibility for their own actions, etc...)

What do they say about their family?....Do they love them despite sometimes disagreeing and being angry with them?...or, have they cut off family for 5 years because they had an argument at Christmas dinner...(Lack of loyalty, questionable values,....very serious.....to me...)

(Of course, the above can be utilized by anyone, anywhere, anytime, for any situation in life......business, romantic relationships, anything...)

Who someone is, is always right in front of you,, displayed in their words and actions.... Most people just..........don't pay attention, and, in the case of romantic relationships?.....they simply might choose not to.....

But it's there

And.....if your not sure?......Well, in my word, a "hesitation" is a clear cut "NO"....

All complicated questions aside.....if one asks themselves: "Can I trust them"...."Are they straight/solid", or any other question and you cannot immediately answer yes?.....

Well, a hesitation is no.

You either then have the option of walking...or, taking a little time to learn more, and clarify your beliefs.....

Same, again, as with anything in life......anything, anyone, anywhere, anytime....

A hesitation means no...

You ask anyone, anything, anytime, anywhere a question in which they wholeheartedly believe, or agree?....Sometimes their "yes" will even come before you are finished asking the question....so....in a hesitation always lies your answer

Some work, some don't (partnerships)....I've done probably hundreds (literally) over the years...some worked, some did not....and, I'll even go further in saying the ones that did not?...well, completely my fault and no one else to blame but myself, because, as above....Everything right in front of me, all the time....

People try to sometimes convince themselves they do not know something, for various reasons..(maybe because you two go back so long, maybe because family, and, you refuse to believe they won't create a problem, because their family, etc.......), but...doesn't change a thing......

They are who they are and they show you exactly who they are in every word and action they take every second of every day.....

The other thing, and, the very basis of partnerships is the entire point is to achieve something greater than you could yourself.....

If not?...absolutely no point to it...(ie: you want to do 100 plants alone, but, with partner, you will do 200 and split 50/50 .....well, as you see.....no point to it......so....)

Most don't favor them, most will have varying opinions, but,...mine is above....

Some work, some don't....the ones that do make up 10 times over for the ones that don't, and, any problems are your own fault.....

I've had things that lasted 2-3 batches and failed, and I've had things that went on to 20 years without ever a single problem....never a single disagreement.....(because of course....there is little that 2 rationale, reasonable, understanding people cannot overcome.....)

That being said, the key is to clearly define every aspect of it from the start, and I think a lot of people create problems (future) from the very beginning by overstating yields......

Your going to pull 100?........Tell them 30!....

Expectations I think are the number one source of creation of problems....followed by the "ME/Mine" syndrome.....discussed at length in indoor thread..

(Alas.....if unable to overcome by discussion...there is no known cure for this affliction )

("mine" syndrome being something very strange seems to come over people during the grow process, more so as harvest nears and things start to fill out......similar to LOTR/Gollum......."my preciousssssssssss"

Sounds funny, but, documented.....it happens, and often........

anyway......

You're a lucky man there. At least in the aerials that I have access to, there are big vague sections (Poor grade satellite photos) all around a few spots I'm interested in perusing.

I am...in many ways....and, am thankful for current situation and areas.........one of best I have ever had the pleasure of having.....makes everything much easier in many ways and essentially everything runs itself...lush vegetation....adequate rainfall...(although harvest season has some incredibly erratic weather which sometimes becomes quite scary....)

Good point on storing records electronically. Though a GPS could be handy for truly remote grows with minimal landmarks. I wouldn't store the location in the GPS unit, but tracking to coordinates could be useful. My woodland survival skills have atrophied a good bit over the years spent in cities. Especially on grows that are visited rarely (Low/no maint), since I know the appearance of an area can change drastically over seasons in regards to vegetation (and in many areas you may not have any other reliable landmarks).

The vegetation can change drastically even over a months time in many places, and, I am sure veterans would readily agree.....

The one thing about having more in plots is really you just need to be able to see one to know the plots there, and can go in and trim.....I know many know the feeling of walking right past things at least once or twice (I do all the time before everything trimmed down )

If not "landmarks" per se, then can also use (I do and have)...estimated measure......meaning.....let's say......."300 steps from here, then straight back to that plot, etc.....

You always want to try and lay them out in a pattern (YOUR pattern....)

For example regarding the above statement...it might be..."okay, so, I went about 300 steps or so and then I went straight left, and, then after I planted than one...I went...whatever....straight west and planted 4 more plots about 200 steps from one another in a straight line......

You always want something you can remember, and, always lay them out most efficiently, or, according to what you desire...(ie: That could be specific strains in specific plots........that could be the M/F's in specific plots, clones in others, (so you don't have to hit multiple plots to sex and pull males, minimal work, etc...) But, that goes back to organization.....planning....I won't say too much because I think this was addressed in previous posts, but....it really is much easier than most think as long as some "system" laid upon it from the start.....

Something to keep in mind, definitely. In my mind, it always seems like the initial site prep would involve the most work. It'd be the most physically demanding part, especially if much needs to be hauled out. But it'd still be quick. A days hard work on a plot and you're done... gotta remember that cutting the plants down is only the first stage of harvesting and that the full process takes a fair amount of time.

Pretty much my point.......anything and everything earlier is for the most part limited in it's duration...(ie: you plant a day, 2, 10, whatever...every weekend...trimming is fairly quick and simple....feeding...etc...)

If your mixing strains and finishing times, as one sees, just cutting alone (and hanging for me) can be almost 2 months in itself...

Real work, real risk comes with harvest.....without a doubt.....

(Same thing can be said for earlier part of year, early veg.....they really don't explode until July....so...anything up till then fairly risk free...or, as reduced as can be.....once they start to gain some size......start of flowering....then is the time when the risk starts growing......no pun intended

Good info there, I never thought about the fact that the rail areas may be getting sprayed. Another bit of info to tuck away and hope I have a chance to benefit from it. Same for hiding from trains. It makes sense that they'd shut the lines down in a lot of cases to avoid potential accidents. Never would have thought of that either. Also a good point on how people tend to focus, I know for a fact that many places/times I could easily walk past a semi-concealed grow and never notice. Also probably a reason for the tree stand grows... Humans very rarely look UP.

Yep......someone reminded me of that (spraying) when I previously was writing on the subject...I always forget because my area it's less of an issue (tight, dense, city, etc)....

Yeah....the shut downs.....in direct relation to increased accidents over the years (people getting hit by trains...)....Terrible tragedy, and, I don't take it lightly (I actually know 2 families that have had such losses,) but, I can't for the life of me figure out how you get hit by something the size of a building.....I just don't get it....You go your whole life not being hit by a friggin car.....then to be hit by a train (essentially the size of a small building...)

I just don't get it

Yeah.....I most prefer the plots closer to stations and crossings....focus is on them...not on surrounding vegetation...(ie: they're looking out for people and cars...not looking at the weeds )

Yep...they'll call it in (either RW or City cops) and close down that section.....

Sounds like IT has the same problem I struggle with. I am still just starting to realize just how wide the options are for potential grow spots. My brain defaults to the secluded woodland hillside. It still takes a bit of a mental shift to see the other possibilities. I would love to see some photos of some of the less 'stereotypical' locations, but even just descriptions helps out a lot.

Because we all have preconceived notions of what something "should be".....this is no different.....

"great spot"...."perfect spot"?.....

You don't need a spot that no human foot has ever touched ....

Just that you believe it will not for a couple months

Your not going to build a house there , just.....use it ....for a while

Later in season you go...the shorter that becomes .....

It's all perception......people always imagine initially larger trees.....can fim/top.....multiple times....can train...can plant late.....

The spot dictates the method....

When I started on that the conversations were something to the effect of:
"nahhh man...you can't do that....there's people everywhere...."

"Where?....I don't see any people in that spot".....

"Nahhh...they'll stick out too much, they'll be too big man".....

"So...I'll top em and keep em shorter.....I'll plant em later....they'll be like 2-3-4 feet...."

"Nahhh man....won't work".......

"Why?....says who?..." , etc, etc......

The problem is simple:
Everyone wants "the perfect spot"......

And while people sit and scratch their heads......looking for that....they pass 100 spots that might not be perfect...but...

They'll do

The spot dictates the approach and method.....not....as most believe, the other way around....(ie: can't grow trees, so, not a good spot, forget it......)

I was telling someone yesterday about my city plots....very nice view of skyline

Growing 101:
You do what you can, when you can, where you can, how you can....


Last time I checked most don't have access to 4,000 acres of dense forest

You work with what you've got, and you alter the method and approach to suit that....

[Julian]

Originally Posted by dj digigrow

waiting for these city spot pics... NYC or Chicago? lol just guessing...

anyways my question is on seed stock.. how can I turn a 10 pack into 1000 seeds...??

Pretty soon...last round going out this week, and, also want them to get a little bigger, because right now hard to see.....(Want bigger so I can try and go as far back as possible and get a shot of many......)The one spot I am hitting next they're basically planted single file over a stretch...worked into landscape......)

10 pack into 1000?



grow out seeds.....sex...let's assume 5 fems out or 10..(could be more or less).....top/fim...grow em out little more....60 days more or less should be able to shave each one down to about 200 each....(my target is always 200 per mom....)

10 seeds, 5 fems, 200 each=1,000. If you grew those out a little and repeated......10,000 within 6 months....

Very simple...(just not quick, and, why I prefer fem beans......beans I have 2 week turn around...no moms, no time......just plant, 2 weeks later more or less, out they go....can't get more simple and efficient that that.....

(I'm sorry....you said into seeds....plant a patch man, do free pollination....done deal....)Options are endless...could also hold males back (indoors) and then hit them a little later in field to target certain mothers....options are endless....(and you'd probably end up with a hell of a lot more than 1,000 (I have my ps city plot with diesel, blockhead, bb/nl and BOG SB....thinking about just leaving those for seed....still haven't decided either way yet though.....but....little too close to other things...so.....then thinking about maybe just pulling all (males) and leaving ONE...(hear diesel is later, and, others are earlier....so....was also thinking along those lines too....)