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Old 09-14-2006, 11:05 PM #1
motaco
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Revival of the Ultimate Sativa Thread

Welcome to the Revival of the Ultimate Sativa Thread!

If you've never seen us before this is the sativa growers community thread. Where growers and smokers from around the world come to talk about their favorite sativas. From old classics like Oaxacan, Panama Red, and Acapulco Gold to the new dutch sativa hybrids. Plus bagseed sativas from all over the world. We have them all here.

My name is motaco, and I am the creator of this thread. But we owe the wealth of information and all of the pictures in this thread to those who help contribute to it. And that is the general point of it. This is a place where the community can join together to pool all it's general knowledge about sativas, and their role in our smoking culture into a collective data base, and talk to one another.

I don't want it to seem like I'm the sole author of this thread. Far from it. This is a community thread where we rely on each other for info. I may have started it but I am just the editor for lack of a better word. Feel free to correct me on info, add to segments, tell stories from travels, etc. This thread belongs to you as much as me. A bit like wikipedia.

So I'm gonna start things off proper with a picture of Chamans tropical sativas, to get everyone in the mood. Two of my favorite sativa pics of all time. (shoulda been pic of the month )

** PS-** Many years ago I had a change in living situation that has stopped me from being able to grow anymore. So almost all of these pics aren't mine, they have been contributed by members or found on the internet. If you see one that is yours or you just know is mislabeled please pm me so I can fix it.



This is the thread dedicated to all sativa growers and lovers to post anything they want. hybrids, pure, landrace, whatever. Just reminisce about old strains.


NEW UPDATE!! ULTIMATE SATIVA GROW THREAD now in growers forums. With all the interest sparked over sativas I was asked to start a grow thread so that the threads are more coordinated and information can flow more efficient if the threads take specific paths. So I'd like the RUST to stay about different strains, and what the stones are like. Sativa stories and pictures, general sativa conversation and stuff like its always been. And direct more of the grow questions and strain reccomendations to the new grow thread. Linked here.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....77#post1209877

And don't forget to preserve your rare and exotic sativa leaves for identification; a forward step on sativa conservation. It might be all thats left one day. My thread on preserving leaves.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....36#post1021636




TO ALL UN REGISTERED READERS
So you've scrolled through this thing and you still don't have anything to say? What are you doing? join up! We are a community based on sativa lovers and growers and we need as big of a community as possible. It's how we learn from each other.

Just growing brickweed bagseeds you collected over the years and think nobody is interested? Man we love seeing other countries export. I got several mexican bagseed lines I saved because I loved them. We are not pot snobs here. All are welcome. Just an old timer that's smoked it all and got the cough to prove it? Those old stories about chocolate thai, acapulco gold, panama red. they are priceless come share them with others that remember them. Especially if you've got old scanned pics! we love them!

thirty year old santa marta colombian gold. grown by indians. (thanks desiderata)



Thanks to 4 seasons you can also take a trip down memory lane in the "Vintage Cannabis Photography" thread.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=135579

***NEW LINK***
Predates the smokers explosion of the jazz scene during prohibition. An incredibly informative link about medical marijuana and it's uses in America.

https://antiquecannabisbook.com/


70s Era "Growers Guide"

Well lets get this started the old fashioned way. Just like the old thread here are some exerpts of legends and grow pioneers Ed Rosenthal and Mel Frank. They were some of the best authors on the subjects at the time, and should be required reading for sativa heads.


Marijuana grown in the United States is usually one of two main types: indica or sativa. Indica plants originated in the Hindu-Kush valleys in central Asia, which is located between the 25-35 latitudes. The weather there is changeable. One year there may be drought, the next it might be cloudy, wet, rainy or sunny. For the population to survive, the plant group needs to have individuals which survive and thrive under different conditions. Thus, in any season, no matter what the weather, some plants will do well and some will do poorly.

Indica was probably developed by hash users for resin content, not for flower smoking. The resin was removed from the plant. An indication of indica's development is the seeds, which remain enclosed and stick to the resin. Since they are very hrd to disconnect from the plant, they require human help. Wild plants readily drop seeds once they mature.


Plants from the same line from equatorial areas are usually fairly uniform. These include Colombians and central Africans. Plants from higher latitudes of the same line sometimes have very different characteristics. These include Southern Africans, Northern Mexicans, and indicas. The plants look different from each other and have different maturities and potency. The ratio of THC (the ingredient which is psychoactive) to CBD (its precursor, which often leaves the smoker feeling disoriented, sleepy, drugged or confused) also varies.


High latitude sativas have the same general characteristics: they tend to mature early, have compact short branches and wide, short leaves which are dark green, sometimes tinged purple.


Indica buds are usually tight, heavy, wide and thick rather than long. They smell "stinky", "skunky", or "pungent" and their smoke is thick - a small toke can induce coughing. The best indicas have a relaxing "social high" which allow one to sense and feel the environment but do not lead to thinking about or analyzing the experience.


Cannabis sativa plants are found throughout the world. Potent varieties such as Colombian, Panamanian, Mexican, Nigerian, Congolese, Indian and Thai are found in equatorial zones. These plants require a long time to mature and ordinarily grow in areas where they have a long season. They are usually very potent, containing large quanities of THC and virtually no CBD. They have long, medium-thick buds when they are grown in full equatorial sun, but under artificial light or even under the temperate sun, the buds tend to run (not fill out completely). The buds usually smell sweet or tangy and the smoke is smooth, sometimes deceptively so.


The THC to CBD ratio of sativa plants gets lower as the plants are found further from the equator. Jamaican and Central Mexican varieties are found at the 15-20th latitudes. At the 30th latitude, varieties such as Southern African and Northern Mexican are variable and may contain equal amounts of THC and CBD, giving the smoker and buzzy, confusing high. These plants are used mostly for hybridizing. Plants found above the 30th latitude usually have low levels of THC, with high levels of CBD and are considered hemp.


If indica and sativa varieties are considered opposite ends of a spectrum, most plants fall in between the spectrum. Because of marijuana and hemp's long symbiotic relationship with humans, seeds are constantly procured or traded so that virtually all populations have been mixed with foreign plants at one time or another.


Even in traditional marijuana-growing countries, the marijuana is often the result of several cross lines. Jamaican ganja, for example, is probably the result of crosses between hemp, which the English cultivated for rope, and Indian ganja, which arrived with the Indian immigrants who came to the country. The term for marijuana in Jamaic in ganja, the same as in India. The traditional Jamaican term for the best weed is Kali, named for the Indian killer goddess.

here is some info from mj botany.

a) Colombia - (0 to 10 north latitude)

Colombian Cannabis originally could be divided into two basic strains: one from the low-altitude humid coastal areas along the Atlantic near Panama, and the other from the more arid mountain areas inland from Santa Marta. More recently, new areas of cultivation in the interior plateau of southern central Colombia and the highland valleys stretching southward from the Atlantic coast have become the primary areas of commercial export Cannabis cultivation. Until recent years high quality Cannabis was available through the black market from both coastal and highland Colombia. Cannabis was introduced to Colombia just over 100 years ago, and its cultivation is deeply rooted in tradition. Cultivation techniques often involve transplanting of selected seedlings and other individual attention. The production of "la mona amarilla" or gold buds is achieved by girdling or removing a strip of bark from the main stem of a nearly mature plant, thereby restricting the flow of water, nutrients, and plant products. Over several days the leaves dry up and fall off as the flowers slowly die and turn yellow. This produces the highly prized "Colombian gold" so prevalent in the early to middle 1970s (Partridge 1973). Trade names such as "punta roja" (red tips [pistils] ), "Cali Hills," "choco," "lowland," "Santa Marta gold," and "purple" give us some idea of the color of older varieties and the location of cultivation.

In response to an incredible demand by America for Cannabis, and the fairly effective control of Mexican Cannabis importation and cultivation through tightening border security and the use of Paraquat, Colombian farmers have geared up their operations. Most of the marijuana smoked in America is imported from Colombia. This also means that the largest number of seeds available for domes tic cultivation also originate in Colombia. Cannabis agri-business has squeezed out all but a few small areas where labor-intensive cultivation of high quality drug Cannabis such as "Ia mona amarilla" can continue. The fine marijuana of Colombia was often seedless, but commercial grades are nearly always well seeded. As a rule today, the more remote highland areas are the centers of commercial agriculture and few of the small farmers remain. It is thought that some highland farmers must still grow fine Cannabis, and occasional connoisseur crops surface. The older seeds from the legendary Colombian strains are now highly prized by breeders. In the heyday of "Colombian gold" this fine cerebral marijuana was grown high in the mountains. Humid lowland marijuana was characterized by stringy, brown, fibrous floral clusters of sedative narcotic high. Now highland marijuana has become the commercial product and is characterized by leafy brown floral clusters and sedative effect. Many of the unfavorable characteristics of imported Colombian Cannabis result from hurried commercial agricultural techniques combined with poor curing and storage. Colombian seeds still contain genes favoring vigorous growth and high THC production. Colombian strains also contain high levels of CBD and CBN, which could account for sedative highs and result from poor curing and storage techniques. Domestic Colombian strains usually lack CBD and CBN. The commercial Cannabis market has brought about the eradication of some local strains by hybridizing with commercial strains.


Colombian strains appear as relatively highly branched conical plants with a long upright central stem, horizontal limbs and relatively short internodes. The leaves are characterized by highly serrated slender leaflets (7-11) in a nearly complete to overlapping circular array of varying shades of medium green. Colombian strains usually flower late in temperate regions of the northern hemisphere and may fail to mature flowers in colder climates. These strains favor the long equatorial growing seasons and often seem insensitive to the rapidly decreasing daylength during autumn in temperate latitudes. Because of the horizontal branching pattern of Colombian strains and their long growth cycle, pistillate plants tend to produce many flowering clusters along the entire length of the stem back to the central stalk. The small flowers tend to produce small, round, dark, mottled, and brown seeds. Imported and domestic Colombian Cannabis often tend to be more sedative in psychoactivity than other strains. This may be caused by the synergistic effect of THC with higher levels of CBD or CBN. Poor curing techniques on the part of Colombian farmers, such as sun drying in huge piles resembling com post heaps, may form CBN as a degradation product of THC. Colombian strains tend to make excellent hybrids with more rapidly maturing strains such as those from Central and North America.


b) Congo - (5 north to 5 south latitude)


Most seeds are collected from shipments of commercial grade seeded floral clusters appearing in Europe.
d) India Centra1 Southern - Kerala, Mysore, and Madras regions (10 to 20 north latitude)


Ganja (or flowering Cannabis tops) has been grown in India for hundreds of years. These strains are usually grown in a seedless fashion and are cured, dried, and smoked as marijuana instead of being converted to hashish as in many Central Asian areas. This makes them of considerable interest to domestic Cannabis cultivators wishing to reap the benefits of years of selective breeding for fine ganja by Indian farmers. Many Europeans and Americans now live in these areas of India and ganja strains are finding their way into domestic American Cannabis crops.


Ganja strains are often tall and broad with a central stalk up to 12 feet tall and spreading highly-branched limbs. The leaves are medium green and made up of 7 to 11 leaf lets of moderate size and serration arranged in a circular array. The frond-like limbs of ganja strains result from extensive compound branching so that by the time floral clusters form they grow from tertiary or quaternary limbs. This promotes a high yield of floral clusters which in ganja strains tend to be small, slender, and curved. Seeds are usually small and dark. Many spicy aromas and tastes occur in Indian ganja strains and they are extremely resinous and psychoactive. Medicinal Cannabis of the late 1800s and early 1900s was usually Indian ganja.


e) Jamaica - (18 north latitude)


Jamaican strains were not uncommon in the late 1960s and early 1970s but they are much rarer today. Both green and brown varieties are grown in Jamaica. The top-of-the-line seedless smoke is known as the "lamb's bread" and is rarely seen outside Jamaica. Most purported Jamaican strains appear stringy and brown much like low land or commercial Colombian strains. Jamaica's close proximity to Colombia and its position along the routes of marijuana smuggling from Colombia to Florida make it likely that Colombian varieties now predominate in Jamaica even if these varieties were not responsible for the original Jamaican strains. Jamaican strains resemble Colombian strains in leaf shape, seed type and general morphology but they tend to be a little taller, thinner, and lighter green. Jamaican strains produce a psychoactive effect of a particularly clear and cerebral nature, unlike many Colombian strains. Some strains may also have come to Jamaica from the Caribbean coast of Mexico, and this may account for the introduction of cerebral green strains.


f) Kenya - Kisumu (5 north to 5 south latitude)


Strains from this area have thin leaves and vary in color from light to dark green. They are characterized by cerebral psychoactivity and sweet taste. Hermaphrodites are common.

h) Malawi, Africa - (10 to 15 south latitude)


Malawi is a small country in eastern central Africa bordering Lake Nyasa. Over the past few years Cannabis from Malawi has appeared wrapped in bark and rolled tightly, approximately four ounces at a time. The nearly seedless flowers are spicy in taste and powerfully psycho active. Enthusiastic American and European Cannabis cultivators immediately planted the new strain and it has be come incorporated into several domestic hybrid strains. They appear as a dark green, large plant of medium height and strong limb growth. The leaves are dark green with coarsely serrated, large, slender leaflets arranged in a narrow, drooping, hand-like array. The leaves usually lack serrations on the distal (tip portion) 20% of each leaflet. The mature floral clusters are sometimes airy, resulting from long internodes, and are made up of large calyxes and relatively few leaves. The large calyxes are very sweet and resinous, as well as extremely psychoactive. Seeds are large, shortened, flattened, and ovoid in shape with a dark grey or reddish brown, mottled perianth or seed coat. The caruncle or point of attachment at the base of the seed is uncommonly deep and usually is surrounded by a sharp edged lip. Some individuals turn a very light yellow green in the flowering clusters as they mature under exposed conditions. Although they mature relatively late, they do seem to have met with acceptance in Great Britain and North America as drug strains. Seeds of many strains appear in small batches of low-quality African marijuana easily available in Amsterdam and other European cities. Phenotypes vary considerably, however, many are similar in appearance to strains from Thailand.


i) Mexico - (15 to 27 north latitude)


Mexico had long been the major source of marijuana smoked in America until recent years. Efforts by the border patrols to stop the flow of Mexican marijuana into the United States were only minimally effective and many varieties of high quality Mexican drug Cannabis were continually available. Many of the hybrid strains grown domestic ally today originated in the mountains of Mexico. In recent years, however, the Mexican government (with monetary backing by the United States) began an intensive pro gram to eradicate Cannabis through the aerial spraying of herbicides such as Paraquat. Their program was effective, and high quality Mexican Cannabis is now rarely available. It is ironic that the NIMH (National Institute of Mental Health) is using domestic Mexican Cannabis strains grown in Mississippi as the pharmaceutical research product for chemotherapy and glaucoma patients. In the prime of Mexican marijuana cultivation from the early 1960s to the middle 1970s, strains or "brands" of Cannabis were usually affixed with the name of the state or area where they were grown. Hence names like "Chiapan," "Guerreran," "Nayarit," "Michoacan," "Oaxacan," and "Sinaloan" have geo graphic origins behind their common names and mean something to this very day. All of these areas are Pacific coastal states extending in order from Sinaloa in the north at 27; through Nayarit, Jalisco, Michoacan, Guerrero, and Oaxaca; to Chiapas in the south at 15 - All of these states stretch from the coast into the mountains where Cannabis is grown.


Strains from Michoacan, Guerrero, and Oaxaca were the most common and a few comments may be ventured about each and about Mexican strains in general.


Mexican strains are thought of as tall, upright plants of moderate to large size with light to dark green, large leaves. The leaves are made up of long, medium width, moderately serrated leaflets arranged in a circular array. The plants mature relatively early in comparison to strains from Colombia or Thailand and produce many long floral clusters with a high calyx-to-leaf ratio and highly cerebral psychoactivity. Michoacan strains tend to have very slender leaves and a very high calyx-to-leaf ratio as do Guerreran strains, but Oaxacan strains tend to be broader-leafed, often with leafier floral clusters. Oaxacan strains are generally the largest and grow vigorously, while Michoacan strains are smaller and more delicate. Guerreran strains are often short and develop long, upright lower limbs. Seeds from most Mexican strains are fairly large, ovoid, and slightly flattened with a light colored grey or brown, unmottled perianth. Smaller, darker, more mottled seeds have appeared in Mexican marijuana during recent years. This may indicate that hybridization is taking place in Mexico, possibly with introduced seed from the largest seed source in the world, Colombia. No commercial seeded Cannabis crops are free from hybridization and great variation may occur in the offspring. More recently, large amounts of hybrid domestic seed have been introduced into Mexico. It is not uncommon to find Thai and Afghani phenotypes in recent shipments of Cannabis from Mexico.

k) Nepal - (26 to 30 north latitude)


Most Cannabis in Nepal occurs in wild stands high in the Himalayan foothills (up to 3,200 meters [10,000 feet]). Little Cannabis is cultivated, and it is from select wild plants that most Nepalese hashish and marijuana originate. Nepalese plants are usually tall and thin with long, slightly branched limbs. The long, thin flowering tops are very aromatic and reminiscent of the finest fresh "temple ball" and "finger" hashish hand-rubbed from wild plants. Resin production is abundant and psychoactivity is high Few Nepalese strains have appeared in domestic Cannabis crops but they do seem to make strong hybrids with strains from domestic sources and Thailand.
m) South Africa - (22 to 35 south latitude)


Dagga of South Africa is highly acclaimed. Most seeds have been collected from marijuana shipments in Europe. Some are very early-maturing (September in northern latitudes) and sweet smelling. The stretched light green floral clusters and sweet aroma are comparable to Thai strains.


n) Southeast Asia - Cambodia, Laos, Thailand and Vietnam (10 to 20 north latitude)


Since American troops first returned from the war in Vietnam, the Cambodian, Laotian, Thai, and Vietnamese strains have been regarded as some of the very finest in the world. Currently most Southeast Asian Cannabis is produced in northern and eastern Thailand. Until recent times, Cannabis farming has been a cottage industry of the northern mountain areas and each family grew a small garden. The pride of a farmer in his crop was reflected in the high quality and seedless nature of each carefully wrapped Thai stick. Due largely to the craving of Americans for exotic marijuana, Cannabis cultivation has become a big business in Thailand and many farmers are growing large fields of lower quality Cannabis in the eastern lowlands. It is suspected that other Cannabis strains, brought to Thailand to replenish local strains and begin large plantations, may have hybridized with original Thai strains and altered the resultant genetics. Also, wild stands of Cannabis may now be cut and dried for export.


Strains from Thailand are characterized by tall meandering growth of the main stalk and limbs and fairly extensive branching. The leaves are often very large with 9 to 11 long, slender, coarsely serrated leaflets arranged in a drooping hand like array. The Thai refer to them as "alligator tails" and the name is certainly appropriate.


Most Thai strains are very late-maturing and subject to hermaphrodism. It is not understood whether strains from Thailand turn hermaphrodite as a reaction to the extremes of northern temperate weather or if they have a genetically controlled tendency towards hermaphrodism. To the dismay of many cultivators and researchers, Thai strains mature late, flower slowly, and ripen unevenly. Retarded floral development and apparent disregard for changes in photoperiod and weather may have given rise to the story that Cannabis plants in Thailand live and bear flowers for years. Despite these shortcomings, Thai strains are very psychoactive and many hybrid crosses have been made with rapidly maturing strains, such as Mexican and Hindu Kush, in a successful attempt to create early-maturing hybrids of high psychoactivity and characteristic Thai sweet, citrus taste. The calyxes of Thai strains are very large, as are the seeds and other anatomical features, leading to the misconception that strains may be polyploid. No natural polyploidy has been discovered in any strains of Cannabis though no one has ever taken the time to look thoroughly. The seeds are very large, ovoid, slightly flattened, and light brown or tan in color. The perianth is never mottled or striped except at the base. Greenhouses prove to be the best way to mature stubborn Thai strains in temperate climes.


Prohibition Era Ganja and the Rise of Cannabis Use In USA

Special thanks to member "Barnyard" here is a great article from "The Consumers Union Report on Licit and Illicit Drugs" written by Edward M. Brecher and the Editors of Consumer Reports Magazine, 1972.

"It was a change in the laws rather than a change in the drug or in human nature that stimulated the large-scale marketing of marijuana for recreational use in the United States. Not until the Eighteenth Amendment and the Volstead Act of 1920 raised the price of alcoholic beverages and made them less convenient to secure and inferior in quality did a substantial commercial trade in marijuana for recreational use spring up.

Evidence for such a trade comes from New York City, where marijuana "tea pads" were established about 1920. They resembled opium dens or speakeasies except that prices were very low; a man could get high for a quarter on marijuana smoked in the pad, or for even less if he bought the marijuana at the door and took it away to smoke. Most of the marijuana, it was said, was harvested from supplies growing wild on Staten Island or in New Jersey and other nearby states; marijuana and hashish imported from North Africa were more potent and cost more. These tea pads were tolerated by the city, much as alcohol speakeasies were tolerated. By the 1930s there were said to be 500 of them in New York City alone.

In 1926 the New Orleans Item and Morning Tribune, two newspapers under common ownership, published highly sensational exposes of the "menace" of marijuana. They reported that it was coming into New Orleans from Havana, Tampico, and Vera Cruz in large quantities, plus smaller amounts from Texas. "In one day, ten sailors were followed from the time they left their ships until they delivered their respective packages of the drug to a particular block in the Vieux Carre." The sailors, it was said, bought marijuana in the Mexican ports for $10 or $12 per kilogram (2.2 pounds) and sold it in the Vieux Carre for $35 to $50. This was far more profitable than smuggling a comparable weight of whiskey.

Much of the smuggled marijuana was smoked in New Orleans; but some, it was said, was shipped up the Mississippi and "found its way as far north as Cleveland, Ohio, where a well-known physician said it was smoked in one of the exclusive men's clubs."

In New Orleans, the reporters in 1926 laid particular stress on the smoking of marijuana by children. "It was definitely ascertained that school children of 44 schools (only a few of these were high schools) were smoking 'mootas.' Verifications came in by the hundreds from harassed parents, teachers, neighborhood pastors, priests, welfare workers and club women.... The Waif's Home, at this time, was reputedly full of children, both white and colored, who had been brought in under the influence of the drug. Marijuana cigarettes could be bought almost as readily as sandwiches. Their cost was two for a quarter. The children solved the problem of cost by pooling pennies among the members of a group and then passing the cigarettes from one to another, all the puffs being carefully counted."

A Louisiana law passed in 1927, after the newspaper expose, provided a maximum penalty of a $500 fine or six months' imprisonment for possession or sale of marijuana. There followed "a wholesale arrest of more than 150 persons. Approximately one hundred underworld dives, soft drink establishments, night clubs, grocery stores, and private homes were searched in the police raids. Addicts, hardened criminals, gangsters, women of the streets, sailors of all nationalities, bootleggers, boys and girls?? many flashily dressed in silks and furs, others in working clothes all were rounded up in the net which Captain Smith and his squad had set."

The newspaper investigation, the new law, and the heavily publicized police roundups did not, however, accomplish their purpose. On the contrary, according to Commissioner of Public Safety Frank Gomila, during the next few years New Orleans "experienced a crime wave which unquestionably was greatly aggravated by the influence of this drug habit. Payroll and bank guards were doubled, but this did not prevent some of the most spectacular hold-ups in the history of the city. Youngsters known to be 'muggle-heads' fortified themselves with the narcotic and proceeded to shoot down police, bank clerks and casual bystanders. Mr. Eugene Stanley, at that time District Attorney, declared that many of the crimes in New Orleans and the South were thus committed by criminals who relied on the drug to give them a false courage and freedom from restraint. Dr. George Roeling, Coroner, reported that of 450 prisoners investigated, 125 were confirmed users of marihuana. Mr. W. B. Graham, State Narcotic Officer, declared in 1936 that 60 percent of the crimes committed in New Orleans were by marihuana users."

Intensive patrolling of the New Orleans harbor tended to curb imports; but Louisianans were little inconvenienced by the smuggling curbs; they simply began to grow their own marijuana. "The first large growing crop in the city was found in 1930 and its value estimated at $35,000 to $50,000.... In 1936 about 1,200 pounds of bulk weed were seized along with considerable quantities of cigarettes. On one farm, 5-1/2 tons were destroyed and other farms yielded cultivated areas of about 10 acres....

One resident of the city was found growing 100 large plants in his backyard." The net effect of eleven years of vigorous law enforcement was summed up by Commissioner Gomila in 1938: "Cigarettes are hard to get and are selling at 30 to 40 cents apiece, which is a relatively high price and a particularly good indication of the effectiveness of the present control." 11 Marijuana smoking, in short, had become endemic in New Orleans?? and remains endemic today. What years of law enforcement had accomplished was to raise the price from two for 25 cents to 30 cents or 40 cents apiece?? and even this increase might be attributable in part to inflation.

In Colorado, the Denver News launched a similar series of sensational marijuana exposes following the pattern set in New Orleans. Mexican laborers imported to till the Colorado beet-sugar fields, it seems, had found Prohibition alcohol very expensive and so had resorted instead to marijuana, bringing their supplies north with them. A Colorado law against marijuana was duly passed in 1929."
__________________
The point I'm trying to make here... is that there there ain't no point to it. Thats all it is. Because there ain't no point. You didn't ask to come here and you sure can't choose how to leave. You don't know when you're going to go. So don't take this shit serious now. You better have some fun and plenty of it. Because when the shit is over and you ask for a refund its too late. All I can tell you is to keep some sunshine on your face. -Mudbone

Last edited by motaco; 04-30-2013 at 05:15 AM.. Reason: I need no reason!
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Old 09-14-2006, 11:06 PM #2
motaco
Old School Cottonmouth

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Join Date: Jun 2006
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MEXICAN MOTA


Nameless sativa grown out of a dime bag of Mexican brick weed. Took 18 weeks to finish. Pic by OldSchoolFool79



Mexico produces more marijuana than any other country in the entire world. For most of the last century almost every smoker in the US had their very first toke on some Mexican grass. Prior to the 70's Mexican was practically all anyone had. The counterculture explosion had not happened yet, so for the most part exotic foreign strains were unheard of. Prior to the 60s, with the exception of New Orleans, and New York and other jazz hot spots, as well as with hispanics in the south west, marijuana was a rather obscure and mostly unavailable item in most of the country. It wasn't until the poets and Beatniks turned hippies and college students onto marijuana in the 60's that there was a large enough segment of society for it to really be noticed.

As the culture of smokers expanded and a sudden gigantic market for marijuana developed the import came from increasingly distant locales. As hippies traveled and learned more about other people and took interest in other cultures such as Eastern religions, and American Indians and spiritual drug use they became familiar with the potent flower tops sold by Mexican healers and bruha's (witch doctors) at rural markets, and a more knowledgeable smoking culture was beginning.

By the 60's Mexico's political situation was on the verge of a revolution, and the Mexican government was scared that rural peasant farmers were finding ways to finance their ideas with money from the marijuana trade. The Mexican goverment began an intensive crackdown along with US assistance by trying to spray fields with "paraquat", a dangerous herbicide with many health risks. Most of the herb was grown at altitudes too high to reach and very little of it was effective. In reality very little paraquat infested bud made it into the US but it nevertheless did scare many smokers away from Mexican weed. The Mexican government began building more infrastructure and as Mexico got more highways and roads it became easier to police, and discourage marijuana growing. New political incentives also helped bring a dramatic slow down to Mexican marijuana production.

In '69 Nixon escalated the newly declared "War On Drugs" with "Operation Intercept" along the Mexican border. It essentially increased patrols and checkpoint searches which ended the days when smuggling was a simple as filling a van up and driving across the border. Smugglers in turn started hiring private pilots including the newly returned Army and Air Force Vietnam veterans and began filling up old cargo planes with bales of grass and doing night time low altitude border runs. For the next decade these daring pilots would be a primary method of smuggling marijuana into the US. The iconic image of a twin engine smugglers plane would be a emblazoned on a generation of High Times paraphernalia. These smugglers were avoiding the police at the border by using makeshift runways at plantations in the southern Mexican states of Oaxaca, and Guerrero, and landing or making drops in the the southern US. As smugglers increasingly looked further south for better and cheaper pot with less police pressure they eventually found the "Gold Coast" of Colombia.

It was during this time when Mexico was under scruitiny and could no longer produce enough to be the main commerical provider that Colombia began replacing it in the market. So with the smaller corner of the market it had Mexico began to produce larger amounts of the higher quality varieties such as the legendary Highland Oaxaca Gold, and Guerreran instead of low grade commercial strains it had been exporting. Other notables of the time in Mexico were Torreon Violet, Zacatecas Purple, Michoacan, and others. After the momentary lapse of power during the 70s the Mexicans rebounded during the 80s and well into current times Mexico has taken back the commercial market for marijuana from Colombia. On the current market in the US Colombian weed scarcely exists, while Mexican weed makes up about half.


MEXICAN COMMERCIAL WEED

Mexican weed makes up the majority of the marijuana south of the Mason Dixon line. The wide availability, cheap price, bang for the buck, and proximity to Mexico all contribute to preferences, but at the end of the day there are still many folks who wish to have cheap weed to roll up joints, or smoke with friends, make edibles, etc. $20 a gram for high grade marijuana is out of many peoples price range. As well Mexican weed finds its way into rural towns following migrant fruit pickers, and offers marijuana to a market who might otherwise have none.


Today the situation faced by Mexican commercial smokers has changed from the low grade garbage of the 60s. A common phrase to describe lower grades of grass was "more rope than dope" referring to the Mexican genetic heritage of much of its marijuana being of low grade hemp. Till this day good Mexican sativa often has a fantastic hemp fiber strength, but there was also very common strains that were half drug cultivar, and half hemp, left growing mostly unattended. It was picked early, and shipped across as the common commercial weed everyone was used to. It was full of seeds, sticks, even males sometimes. Higher grades of pot that weren't "picked green" were allowed to ripen and left to yellow in the fields were often called "Acapulco Gold" as slang. That was primarily the only available weed on the market before the 70s. Regular green immature commercial weed. Or the yellow leaves and blonde buds of Acapulco Gold. Both of which were fully seeded.

By '85-'90 when Mexico took over the commercial production back from Colombia most of the regional strains were gone. Cartels had begun growing massive plantations of commercial genetics and paid for their protection with bribes, violence, and corruption. A practice which continues to this day. So the name strains are gone but the commercial quality is higher. To compete with other nations products Mexico began using new genetics, trimming their harvest much better, improving growing techniques, and removing most of the males to cut down on seeds. Today's Mexican weed has dramatically improved over what smokers remember from the earliest bags of the 60s. Beginning in the early 80's non native phenos started showing up common in imports. First Colombian commercial types, and then indica/commercial bug made it to mexico as well as many other nations. Skunk and Afghan type plants began to show up and are still common genes in brickweed seeds today. While it diluted the gene pool almost irreparably it also phased out most of the truly low grade hemp varieties from existence.

The product today is usually bricked, and of varying quality due to the amount produced by the country. The majority of it though is being sold between $40 and $120 dollars an ounce based on quality and the region it is sold in. Most of the weed is no longer native Mexican genes. However this does not change the fact that there are still some classic Mexican genetics, though often hybridized, coming across the border. Mexico today has an incredibly diverse gene pool from plants all over the world. Pure, or near pure sativas of various pedigree do still exist in high numbers, especially in the more tropical areas. However indica, and hybrids known as "Krypie" or "Pretendo" or "Pretendica" have been steadily getting a larger percentage of the market.

Sometimes indica is grown in order to fit more crops into a year, or to be finished in less time to avoid detection and eradication. The various strains sometimes called "pretendica" are long flowering indica hybrids acclimatized to Mexicos photo period and are quite commonly found if you grow Mexican bagseed. If flowered from seed they will grow between 2-5 feet and generally finish within 90 days. Yield is usually decent, but quality is often lacking from pretendica. They are usually commercial genetics of relatively low potential. For instance skunk and afghan genetics are quite commonly found in Mexican commercial weed, however there are some good mexican indica hybrids weed as well.

Common low grade Mexican commercial weed. Usually sold for around $50 an ounce in the southern US. aka: Shwag (Shit We All Get), ditch weed, stress, brown frown, etc. Sometimes it was good weed at one point, but after enough decay it turns into dreary, dull, low potency weed that won't get you very high. Very rarely has much potency left to it. Sometimes its garbage weed, sometimes its just old and poorly stored. Often times half of the weight will be in seeds, shake, and sticks.





Common high(er) grade Mexican commercial weed. Priced usually around $100 an ounce. Found more often during the cooler months. Generally still green and fresh. Bricked and lightly seeded but is mostly chunky buds . Sometimes still has trichs, occasionally even smells good if its fresh enough. The high is of varying quality, but can often be deceivingly potent. aka: popcorn, sexy mexi, christmas tree, green regs.



$10 1/8 and a $20 gram of Mexican hashish.




Contrary to popular belief most Mexican IS NOT bad genes. Many things like when it was harvested, shipping methods, what region it is from, how old it is, how long they let it sit before shipping, how well it was dried, how well it was stored including what temperature and bricking, and when it was harvested all have to do with quality of import. It's not one simple answer like "Mexican weed just sucks".

Another common myth is that the cartels grow the weed. The cartels do grow weed but it is a small percentage of what they can export. Most of the weed they own is not grown by them, but rather collected by them and put towards a shipment to eventually be sent in. They are the smugglers. Rural mexican farm families that have been growing the same strains for centuries are the mainstay of the import, and that is not likely to change.



As of '09 the gang wars and drug terrorism has reached a terrible level. All the more reason to grow your own and not fund Drug Trade Organizations and supply them with money. Mexico is controlled by several competing cartels over distribution and territory among other things. Separating the gangs are mountains and deserts, which helps keep the regions marijuana unique. The caribbean coast is famous for the more cerebral neon green marijuana also found in jamaica. The western coast is drier and more prone to indica hybrids.


This particular bud is of a pure sativa from brickweed that I managed to buy on the local market after an unseasonably long winter. I was told it was grown out of regular Mexican "christmas tree".

Christmas Tree Sativa buds




Mexi brick can be pretty when its grown properly.


Smoke report:
Feather weight buds. Single braids of some fox tails measure over two inches. Buzz off a bong rip hits almost instantaneous and sends you reeling. A non expansive smoke, it goes down smooth but comes back out a bit hot. Instant uplifting feeling and you immediately want to pack another hit. First few minutes can be a bit racy, and anxious as the stone comes on. A rising, almost floaty feeling washes over you slowly that replaces the anxiety. The high lasts for a long time. It is a pure and clean sativa buzz, with no trace of indica. There is no body stone. Only a head high that is surprisingly multi dimensional and well rounded. It's a fulfilling stone and you don't feel like you have to mix weeds to make it feel complete. It is a refreshing and upbeat stone. Gives great giggle fits over silly stuff and is a social high that allows for free flowing conversation. The high is clear, and allows for good concentration. It is great for video games, or writing, or other engaging activities. Another great aspect is the high seems to gradually wear off with no heavy burn out. Smells generically fruity. Some of the best and most pure sativa I've gotten to smoke in many years.

"Christmas tree" is slang in the south for the fresh green buds that start coming across when the weather cools down. Human mules will carry 50+ pound loads of ganja on their backs across the border and through unmapped desert paths for days. When the weather is hot they can't smuggle anywhere near as much so by the summer the supply dwindles and the bud is often brown and old.

A citrus smelling type of pretendica from Mexi brick. High was nothing special.





Here is a pic of highland oaxaca. courtesy of oaxaca spice. the pic below it is (I think) the same weed as it appears in schwag. I could be wrong though, we'll have to ask OS when he shows up.





An uglier, darker lowland oaxaca (one of several lowland or coastal oaxacas, this one is called sugarcane). doesn't look that resinous I know, but I'll put this up against TW gram for gram anyday believe it or not. Its a very powerful herb, but not the most euphoric. Very dumbing.



THE GANJA SITUATION IN MEXICO Tienes mota mi amigo?


Weed is usually pretty easy to find in Mexico. By far the easiest and safest way to get it is simply staying in a border town. The US side is much safer, but there are DEA, FBI, CIA, and any number of government agencies all with permanent details in those small towns. So asking around for bud isn't recommended for outsiders. You can find bud very easily by asking around on the Mexican side if you are brave enough, but there are incredible amounts of violence and kidnappings on the Mexican side. Best advise is to buy small amounts from locals like bartenders and taxi drivers to avoid trouble.

Logically you would think that you would want to go to the equatorial regions of Mexico looking for sativas in the native habitat it's being grown in to get the best buds, but the reality is it's very poor people growing pot in very dangerous places. It is however meant to be sold to the US. We are the major consumer and truly if weed is good they want the money it is worth. Not the weed to smoke. Regardless of where it was grown it will probably show up at a major border town. The funny thing about border towns is they are full of good cheap pot. But just a few hunded miles outside of them it goes much higher. They put up roadblocks all over highways out of border towns and it raises the price. But there is often LOTS of pot sitting in houses in border towns awaiting a destination.

Other sources of weed within Mexico are open markets that often sell weed discreetly, but not as easy if you are a tourist and especially white. Another option in rural Mexico is asking around for traditional healers who sometimes keep a few plants in a private garden.


In a final statement I'd like to say that the cartels get the majority of their money from marijuana, and it is through us, not only as competition from American pot growers, but as American pot consumers to try and help end the cartels and the cancer they are to the marijuana community. The plant is not evil in itself, but due to the laws it takes money hungry organized criminal groups to get the majority of it into the country. About 10,000 people have died per year in the last several years in a narrow strip of Mexico along the disputed border territories. Due to the sheer number of users and ease of production marijuana is the most profitable drug for them and provides over half of any given cartels total yearly income. When at all possible try not to buy Mexican pot, and certainly not on a regular basis. Your money directly supports their activities. Somewhere up that line that money ends up back in Mexico. If you do buy mexican grass, buy a good bag, save the seeds, and don't buy it again. If growing is not an option, try to find domestic grass. It costs more, but its worth it.

Mexican weed links:

A mans story about running weed from the legendary "El Bufalo" plots, one of the big Mexican plantations in the early 80s, from the free article archive at Cannabis Culture.
https://cannabisculture.com/v2/articles/4768.html

Mexican Landrace Thread
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=218636

The Mexican Cartel Thread
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=222725

Massive Marijuana Grow in Mexico. Four times larger than El Bufalo.
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=217127

The Highland Oaxaca Gold Thread
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....t=history+haze

130 ton bust
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....ht=mexico+bust

30 tons and a tunnel
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....ht=mexico+bust


JAMAICAN WEED

photo from la mano negra of jamaican sat in spain.


Jamaica is well known for ganja, and for good reason. Supposedly the Jamaican weed growing culture started when escaped slaves ran so far into the mountains that they could no be pursued and lived an isolated existence; growing African and Indian sativas and living off the land.
Regardless of it's origin the popularity in Jamaica is undeniable and far older and more intrisic than most other cultures on this side of the world. In the fifties and even earlier Jamaica was one of very few suppliers of marijuana to the US. During the 60s Jamaican was one of few exotics available along with Acapulco Gold. Since it is an island and thus fairly easy to control around '73 it was used as a test for marijuana eradication and was very successful. Mass crops were targeted and hit hard, and the genes to the famous Lambs Bread or Kali weed was hit hard. Throughout much of the 70's and 80's Jamaican "semi sensi" was an extra exotic on the market, but made no substantial contribution to the total of pot America smoked. Noted more for the size of it's buds than for it's potency in the later years. However in it's heyday the Jamaican sativa was an energetic and spicy smoke. A neon green poker straight plant 3-9 feet high, with light branching towards the top. The smoke was energetic and upbeat, powerfully contemplative, with very little body stone or sedation to it. Supposedly a breed of Indian and African sativas.


Due to its year round photoperiod Jamaica has 3 harvest seasons per year. Two short and one long. It's worth mentioning that if you are going to jamaica in search of sativas. Don't go in winter as you would expect like at a higher latitude. That is actually their conclusion to the shortest season and is full of immature 50 day flowered from seed lolly pop indica buds. the nugs are 5 inches long with a gram on the end of half leaf and you can see the roots at the bottom of the stem. If you want sativas you should go around april when plants have had 4 months to cycle instead of a month and a half. This is the season they grow their larger higher yielding plants that can have a veg cycle. In winter they grow mini super fast indicas to get a quick harvest, but it sucks.


photo from gyspy here at IC



JAMAICAN STRAINS. NOW AND THEN.

In Jamaica when you flower sativas from seed they grow one main cola, and minimal side branching. Jamaicas grow climate causes this to happen naturally. Plants flower at or almost immediately after sprouting. So its no surprise acclimated Jamaican ganja looks like this. Pictures of jamaican patches often look like a little outdoor SOG. Stony weed was referred to as Kali herb (goddess of destruction), and other terms such as "lambs bread" or "breath" (depending who you ask) were also common terms. A common myth is that Jamaican strains smell and taste earthy and smoky. This is not true at all it simply has to do with primitive curing procedures which we'll get into later. Fresh native ganja is usually very sweet, fruity and floral. It should be, because it is mainly from the same dutch stock we are all familiar with.


Today native Jamaicans are harder and harder to find. In the 80's visitors continually brought over dutch genes which were faster and stonier. Since they stay short and are harder to see from helicopters, and finish so quick these small hybrids yielding a few grams to an ounce became what makes up the mainstay of Jamaican ganja today.

The nations growers have simple breeding techniques and accidental open pollination occurs often. It is hard for growers to keep lines pure. Jamaicans were used to 90-120 day sativas that grew tall, were heat and pest resistant, and didn't need much ferts, and yielded 1-4 ounces a piece. Todays average Jam ganja grows between 2-4ft, and flowers for about 70 days, and yields about 1/2-2 ounces. They are much more prone to mold, and require more fertilizer and tending. Although it is not likely to change the market many growers ask for tourists to bring sativa genes back to them. African, South American, etc. Really just any good sativas, they don't care if its kali mist of good mexican bagseed. Common dutch genes they received include several repeating names, such as ice, afghani, northern lights, and purple star, and skunk are common in gardens and replaced sativas. During the one long growing season sativas are better suited but many growers have lost their old lines, because the shorter flowering plants make more money. The more sativa looking lines left on the island appear to be mostly Colombian in origin according to recent visitors. Today the dealers call weed whatever is selling to tourists best. Even Diesel or Trainwreck although that is not what it is. However a handful of strains are there and are sold by name. Blue mountain sativa and a handful of other natives are still kept pure by some rastas supposedly. Although sativas are missed, the growers do appreciate the short, and fast turnover and increased number of harvest the indicas offer and they will now always make up a substantial part of the harvest. At any rate pay attention to the bud, not what it is being called.

THE GANJA SITUATION

Weed is everywhere in Jamaica, but don't be a fool. It is still very illegal. Not many years ago an American college tourist was arrested with one spliff and handcuffed to a bed for days before he was processed, during which time he got sick and had to go to the hospital. But most of the time cops, and judges just like everyone else are just looking for a handout and want you to just leave your money and go home. But American influenced propaganda as well as tactics including road side stops, helicopter patrols, speed boats, and drug dogs are the norm. Despite all this its still everywhere and deep in the culture. However do not assume that everyone there smokes. They don't and many do not appreciate the stereotype, they view asking every Jamaican about weed like going to Colombia and asking everyone about cocaine. Asking the wrong person can get you set up to buy from an undercover just like the states. In Jamaica just like everywhere else smoking weed instead of drinking is considered a low class, criminal class hobby. If you go make sure you pick your hotel wisely. Many resorts and chain hotels do not like pot smokers.

Scoring weed in Jamaica should be a very easy thing to do. Many people come back from Jamaica and say they only have crappy schwag. The truth is no different than anywhere else. They saw you coming from a mile away. If they CAN sell you schwag at regular price than they most likely will. Or just rip you off entirely if you give them the chance. Weed is usually sold on the entire stem so when they are talking to a tourist if they pull out a fistful of 18 inch schwag buds and the guys eyes light up like he's never seen that much weed before in his life than the dealer has got his number already. He's not going to even show him the normal stuff he sells for 30 dollars an ounce if he knows he can sell this year old shit nobody else wants at the same price to this guy.

Another dealer trick is to hand you the weed. Especially if you are in their field. We are used to being able to inspect and smell the herb before you get it. This is not necessarily the case in Jamaica. If its in your possession its yours. They may refuse to take it back and demand the money instead. It is often hard to understand Jamaicans and the tiny island has upwards of 700 murders per year. The last thing you want to do is get into an argument over a few dollars and hear "thieves answer to jah." So if the weed doesn't look like it interests you don't even sniff it. Don't give people a reason to not like you.

But if you stay diligent there is good weed to be found. There are lord only knows how many growers on the island and three harvests a year so if you don't like what you are seeing keep asking. Someone will have good enough quality. Special resorts often keep higher quality for their smoking clientele if all else fails.

For safety its a good idea not to go far from the hotel, don't go to the back of any businesses to get weed, make dealers bring it to you somewhere you feel safe. Don't ask just anyone and everyone for it be specific to someone you know is not a cop and probably is educated about good weed. And taxi drivers have been known to take money from police for dropping off dumb tourists into traps so beware. Don't smoke in public, find a safe spot. Don't buy pre-rolled joints they are probably just shake leaves. Don't give people money to come back. Basically don't do anything you wouldn't do in your home town is a good rule of thumb.



Highliter in jamaica in early 80's




PRICES in JAMAICA vary all over the island but 95% of the tourists going to jamaica are going to Negril or Kingston. Roadside vendors with coconuts and fruit as well as small businesses often sell about a gram for a dollar, with a paper. Street dealers with ounces(guess-timated weight and not including stalks) usually sell them for 30-50 dollars or 200-350 USD for a whole lb. While it is true that herb actually sells for as little as 80usd per pound even for quality weed it is not right to pay that for it. Remember that this is not "the time machine" and Jamaicans are not morlocks there to serve you. They are a slave to a crippled economy and work their asses off to be able to feed their family. They risk their freedom selling weed and you should really think about which one of you truly knows the value of a hard days work before you haggle down an honest man to piles of weed for chump change. I don't know who said it but I'll never forget the words: "The extreme uncertainties of subsisting without working made excesses necessary and brakes definitive. Suicide took many, alcohol and the devil took care of the rest." What this means is if you have the money to go blunting, beer bonging, and tom catting around Jamaican resorts than you've got the kind of money to give some of the most hardworking people you'll ever meet a fair price for his product. It boils my blood when I hear people say they haggled down some dealer to next to nothing like screwing poor people out of money is something you should be impressed with.

But do know that market style bartering is somewhat a part of Jamaican culture. So when you give him what you feel in your heart to be a fair price for what you bought and how much money you have make sure he knows you did not give him that much money because you are a stupid tourist, but instead as a tip.

GROWING AND STORING METHODS

Jamaica has the same kinda helicopter patrols and snitches like the states. For growers to combat this they have done the same thing they do in NorCal. Very few big patches. It's an army of dedicated small growers spread out everywhere and they can't be stopped. When its all put together it makes their country full of weed.

Jamaican growers have resorted to lugging thousands of lbs of soil through jungles and swamps, building raised soil beds in marshes, or planting on steep rocky cliffs with dams under the plants to catch water. Rarely are patches larger than 2 acres, with most of them being about a half an acre. An area is chosen and usually burned of vegetation and stumps, this is in part a problem of the islands deforestation. only 30% of the island is forested now and that is in part due to slash and burn techniques.


The rocky shallow soil is pick axed into holes and amended with quality soil and ferts. Then they build something to collect and store rainwater. Not an easy task and once its done they usually stay at the same spot for many years. Jamaicans are big on organic ferts and frequently use bat guano, blood, various different types of shit and anything else you can imagine. Many of them even use no fertilizer at all.


jamaican admiring his work on a steep hill

Unfortunately despite being adept at grow techniques drying and curing is still a very primitive process for most jamaican growers. Probably less than half of the growers know how to properly dry and store weed for their climate conditions. This is what attributes to a lot of the negative stereotypes about Jamaican weed. Many of the growers simply machete chop the stem at the base above the soil line and just hang upside down. With no leaves removed, full stem and stalk, and the plants hanging closely next to one another in the high humidity it takes FOREVER for plants to dry like this and much is lost to mold. Some noticed they dried faster and without mold if they hung them in open sun, which deteriorates trichomes quickly and turns buds brown, others started drying in sheet metal shacks in the sun which are like an oven. Then they simply store it in bags. Another common technique is to hang buds close to an open fire which is a quick way of drying and attributes to many of the "smoky" sterotypes of Jamaican herb smells.

But there are wise growers that learned and have great kind bud and know how to properly dry and store it in the humid climate. To do so they trim buds into small branches, split the stems for drying, and remove all large leaves. Left in open breezy shady areas the weed dries just fine. After being trimmed to their liking they store by burying in water proof containers like buckets or ice chests. Weed will stay perfect like this well past the next harvest. Many growers live year round with their plants tending them next to their vegetables and tend them everyday, but it doesn't stop the quick deterioration rates of weed in heat, and the ignorance that comes with failed infrastructure, and lack of electricity for anything including AC. So it is no surprise there are alot of dealers looking to sell the cheap over abundant schwag to someone dumb enough to take it. So make sure you choose wisely. Dank is certainly available to be had when a proper grower produced it.

COMMERCIAL JAMAICAN

Unlike the situation in Mexico the Jamaican weed is usually not brought in by cartels. Or if it is they operate under enough privacy that they don't make waves. Jamaican weed import is a tiny fraction of what it once was. the distance and no border makes it alot harder to get shipments in. Mostly only found in Amsterdam coffee shops and other small shipments. Smugglers lining the bottoms of boxes in fishing boats, and shipping containers, usually are freelancing it. Buying it with their own money and smuggling it at their own risk to private markets. They usually choose the weed they want from several growers, whittle it off the giant stems they sell it on, brick it and ship it. But it simply can't come through in the amounts without the organization and dedication of a large cartel.

The entire Caribbean shares most of the same strains and the best spot for collecting Caribbean bagseed in the US would have to be south florida hands down.


wallyduck's photo of jamaican ganja they bought for hashmaking. Don't forget to watch the ICMAG dvd.




photos from gypsy



__________________
The point I'm trying to make here... is that there there ain't no point to it. Thats all it is. Because there ain't no point. You didn't ask to come here and you sure can't choose how to leave. You don't know when you're going to go. So don't take this shit serious now. You better have some fun and plenty of it. Because when the shit is over and you ask for a refund its too late. All I can tell you is to keep some sunshine on your face. -Mudbone

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Old 09-14-2006, 11:06 PM #3
motaco
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AMERICAN SATIVAS


America has a unique and diverse marijuana gene pool. While technically we have no native genes we have been the dominant market for marijuana in the western hemisphere for half a century. Plants from every corner of the globe have been brought to the US for top dollar to feed our cravings for the herb, and some of their offspring have found permanent residence here. Much like the American citizen the American Sativa does not have one look or origin, but is a melting pot of all of the immigrants who have found way to our shores.
By far the most common sativas brought here were the Mexicans and Colombians we began smoking, followed by the Asian grasses brought back with soldiers from war. Despite being the center of the "War On Drugs" the US and Canada has been the fore runner in marijuana culture. Even the coffee shops and seed vendors in Amsterdam owe many of the building blocks of the dutch strains to hybrid seeds shipped in from America.

Regardless of origin of species American growers have played an integral part in marijuana breeding, home growing, and our current marijuana culture. Our quest to take exotic foreign drug cultivars, and hybridize them into strains that could grow in our own climate produced some of the finest cannabis ever seen and changed the way people viewed pot growing forever. When the major foreign smuggling routes were ended by politicians American growers stepped up to the plate and began producing the majority of our smoke right here in America. By the 90's America itself was the top producer of the weed we smoke and the average quality is higher than what was ever previously thought possible. Skilled growers continue to progress every year. It is not uncommon for plants in California to yield over ten pounds per plant and of a quality that costs five grand per pound at resale. Thirty years ago a ten pound pot plant worth fifty thousand dollars would have been a Cheech & Chong joke just like the van made out of grass.

Not only have we won a successful guerilla war against the "War On Drugs", we also took a tremendous chunk of money away from violent drug traffickers and kept millions of dollars in the domestic economy. The most important thing in deciding that victory was spreading the idea that you as an individual were able to grow your own strains of grass customized to your own personal expectations. And that you could grow it cheaply, privately, and without any need to rely on outside suppliers.

Unfortunately American marijuana growing is also what caused the extinction of many sativa strains. Pure sativas can only be grown in a fraction of the US. The deep south, the gulf coast into Florida and Georgia, and out west Texas and on up into California were the only areas where sativa could mature and ripen properly. In the late 70s indica seed stock started being grown in California and a few other states. As people started getting seeds out of their bags with the infusion of indica genetics it allowed almost every state in the entire country to be able to grow marijuana. During the 1980s indica exploded onto the market as entire regions of the country such as Appalachia opened up to growing on a commerial level. The result was many of the pure sativa seed stock lines were hybridized for shorter flowering periods, and often times the pure stock was lost during this era. .


MAJOR US GROW REGIONS AND FLAVORS

CALIFORNIA is first up there on the list. One of the oldest growing regions and still producing the largest portion of the nations marijuana harvest, especially north California. The Emerald Triangle as it is known consists of three counties and the areas in between them where many growers settled became legendary for it's high quality pot. The "hill people" are much less hippy and a lot more country than you might think in this era. When the logging business fell out there it left many blue collar men unemployed and they decided to take up the local and lucrative tradition of pot growing. Due to the perfect weather for growing, and the local law turning a blind eye to something residents had always been doing, the area flourished before the days of helicopter patrols. Strains they favor have been many Thais and south east Asians that soldiers brought back after the war. The Mexicans and genes from south of the border play a crucial role in many of the famous Cali grass strains. But due to the amount of growers in the region and how we like to network there were strains from anywhere and everywhere available in the area. It was "the" place to be during the early growing days and plants from every corner of the earth showed up here.

Today the Emerald Triangle is constantly assaulted by aerial observation and narcs. The area is secluded with many rolling hills, but the days of acres of Humboldt sensimilla are gone. Today small farmers in small towns where everyone knows everybody makes up the community. When all the folks in all the small towns put in their share it keeps NorCal a large producer of the nations finest commercial weed. With the fertile soil and optimal conditions even guerilla grown plants can easily reach 6-12ft tall and yield 1/2 to 2lbs per plant. Mexican cartels operating state side have been known to hide thousands of plants this size among the rolling hills in national parks. The best tip for if your going to Cali in search of sativas is to go to a humid parts of California. The coast where fog settles in for instance insures there will be more people growing sativas than the drier regions further inland.


OLD SCHOOL CALI GRASS

After the "Summer of Love" and all the madness that happened in San Francisco as well as the entire country during the late 60s many people who had gone to Southern California looking for an alternative lifestyle were disgruntled with what they found, as well as with the recent events in the country. They became increasingly focused on self reliance, the back to nature environmentalist movement. Refugees of the hippy generation, and the returning war vets began to buy property in the rural counties in secluded northern California. These new residents were the basis and the genesis of the modern marijuana culture. During the 70s seedless of "sensimilla" buds grown in California became famous for their quality smoke throughout the entire country. For the first time "homegrown" wasn't a term of derision, but a statement of quality. Sensimillia as well as hybrid marijuana became famous in the region and popularized through new magazines like High Times.


Hill folk rarely keep names and its a shame because there are god only knows how many incredible strains nobody has a specific name for that still exist among old timers in the area. Typically about 75% sativa hybrids they vary a ton due to the amount of genetic diversity in the region. Yumboldt, Big Sur Holy, Garlic Bud, Killin Garberville, Mendocino Madness, of course Haze, and endless other strains were created in the area.

THE MODERN CALIFORNIA SCENE

A huge relief for medical patients, as well as the average smoker. With the advent of prop 215 and the giant number of new growers operating under semi legality the Cali scene is rapidly changing in both perception and reality from the hippies and loggers in the hills to the dispensaries. With the view of dispensaries very much in the public eye, even having several reality TV shows, the perception of what Cali grass is has begun to rapidly change. The scene in California is almost unimaginable to long time growers from the area. Constantly changing and confusing laws concerning county regulations, zoning, taxes, and federal or local oversight make it hard to understand, or explain, and are open to constant change at a moments notice leading to arrests, business closures, animals shot, etc. Despite this confusion, or perhaps because of it, a tremendous amount of growers, brokers, dispensaries, seed vendors, and even dealers who offer home delivery and sell weed out of the trunk.of their cars dwell in a quasi legal local system based around medical marijuana. While it is true that medical marijuana is available for sick patients, its also available for any resident willing to get an easily available doctors reccomendation for a myriad of minor ailments. A massive "Green Rush" developed under the widespread grey area and tolerance of marijuana growing. Due to this relative safety much marijuana grown under the guise of "medical" exemption gets sold out of state at vastly inflated prices. Throughout most of the country medical marijuana can be found fairly easily. Strains for export tend to be the common high yielding clones sold at dispensaries, but the sheer number of growers, and wide spread availability due to dispensaries makes California the current epicenter of pot culture, and the most diverse and important area for marijuana growing in the US.

Some typical Northern California import. These are examples of standard quality California outdoor bud that has been available in most major cities in the US since the early 90s. Currently they typically cost around $100 for 7 grams in most regions of the country. They are smuggled in the mail with vacuum sealed freezer bags, or smuggled in cars in oven bags.

No name purple sativa hyrbid


The classic Heavy Duty Fruity. Available since the 80s.


No name afghani type. Super common in the 90s.


snow cap crossed with trainwreck. A modern example of two very common local commercial varieties crossed together.


CALIFORNIA LINKS

"Wholesale pot prices plummet". A thread about what his happening in California.
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=173666

SOUTHERN GROWERS

In the beginning of the home growing days of the late seventies and early eighties the South really stood out. Our heat, and long growing season allowed us to grow the native Colombian, and Mexican genes to harvest before frosts. Especially with the tropical photoperiod of southern Florida plants were producing excellent results and was where some of the first indicas grown in the US took place. Local strains such as Gainesville Green, Roadkill Skunk, and Kryptonite became legends. Good bud in Florida is sometimes still called "Crip" or "Krippie" after Kryptonite weed. However the days of Southern weed are gone. Draconian penalties, and an intolerant culture prevent much from being grown here, and the entire region has some of the worst weed and prices and the country. Most outdoor homegrown you come across is usually mexican brick grown in better circumstances. The exception is Florida's "Black Haze" aka "Piff" or "90 day haze". Cuban DTO's growing haze strains indoors and selling them along the Eastern Seaboard mainly.


HAWAII

HAWAIIAN PAKALOLO PREFACE (special thanks to member "oldhaole")

Hawaiian weed's fame extends to the early days of homegrown. In the late 70's when decent commercial grade Colombian would go for $500 a lb, the top Hawaiian bags would go for more than $2,000 dollars a lb. The 20 degrees north lat islands tropical photoperiod and diverse gene pool produced what was indisputably the finest kind bud of the era. It was primarily south east Asian varieties acclimated to the region,along with bagseed from imported Mexican and Colombian and many of the first hashplants as well. Although the amount of Hawaiian pot was never much in the figure of the amount smoked in the US, it was easily the most sought after and the highest quality.

HAWAIIAN POT SCENE: THEN AND NOW

In the early days weed was plentiful and cheap because there were enough growers and few enough police. The Hawiian soil varies from island to island, due primarly to age and rainfall. The older wetter islands all have high soil PH. The short Winter photoperiod makes it impossible to give plants any real amount of veg time so they flower almost immediately in and yield a really sad average of between 5-30 grams per plant for one of the three seasons. Spring season plants yield more and get to 5 ft, but the buds do not get tight. Total change between longest and shortest day is 2 hrs 25 min. With the slow change of season the long season crop has plenty of time to mature. You could plant as many plants as you wanted. And before the helicopter patrols you could plant giant growing long flowering sativas that would yield well. During that time there was less security in place and no customs for a trip from Hawaii. So smugglers looking for the top grade available often chose the islands.
Each island has microclimates and each has its own little flavor and specialty buds. Some famous strains of the day were Elephant ear, Kona Gold, Buddha stick, Mango, Goldenvoice, Strawberry Guava and many others were plentiful and easily available.

The scene today is changed quite a bit. There are 4 or 5 helicopter patrols a year who make no real arrests but spend all day ruining personal growers illegal stashes. Now with the passing of MMJ, and the BI making posession the lowest legal priority, its not very hard to grow commercial plots of herb in Hawaii, and its mostly personal growers who let off the excess harvests to the island market. Since 9/11 export has become harder. So Hawaii stays in a perpetual state of being in a case of "who you know" more than probably anywhere else because there is constantly a harvest going on, you just need to find it. Since local grown outdoor bud is unreliable with a long dry period over summer, dealers started importing weed. Surprisingly today about half of weed in Hawaii is imported Beaster and even Cali schwag.

There is plenty of local grown bud but since the helicopter harassment the growers have adapted by growing smaller more spread out patches. Also growers on the BI are allowed 21 plants grown on private property due to a county law. Growers on other islands make touch and go plots that produce varying grades of weed and thus they rely on alot of mail out for the high end stuff. Best local high end very rarely makes it out of the growers circle of friends.

What people tell me about hawaii pakalolo prices is pretty much the same thing every time. Incredibly expensive for the tourists and often pretty much free for the locals. Polar extremes. Shitty beaster 1/8s for 40 bucks or more quality for about 60 and 1/8. 400 dollar ounces are not uncommon at all. On the other hand since prices are so high many people grow their own weed. So you may meet a grower with a deal. Like my friend told me when he moved to Hawaii. He was there 2 weeks flat ass broke living out a van and couldn't afford any bud. He was surfing and met some hippy who offered to sell him some. My friend said "thanks man but I gotta save up for rent, I can't afford weed right now." The hippy told him to follow him to the woods. They walked down a trail and he showed him a little patch of herb growing deep in some bushes. They then walked further down and the hippy had a bucket buried. When he opened it up there was a trash bag with about a half a lb of bush weed in it and he gave both of my friends two heaping handfuls each for $10 and told him "Welcome to Hawaii."


As far as finding classic pakalolo nowadays its very rare but does still exist. However the chances of a tourist scoring original Hawaiian genetics from a street deal are very slim. Hawaii has 3 seasons per year, but breeders breed over short season and this means strains change fast. Also a strain will taste different grown 5 miles down the road, or on a different island due to different weather and soil conditions. When first brought to the island hardly any plants do very well. But they get used to it and start thriving and adapting. That is one thing I've spoken to several Hawaiian growers about and they all agree its very hard to keep a stone how you want it there. This can be corrected by keeping and adding to a large seed stash. The weed just keeps adapting to its own unique environment and the strains don't stay the same. So the bud you remembered 30 years ago might have a totally different effect today. However the flip side to this is good news. It means new Hawaiian strains are being created all the time as they adjust. However they are more and more often having indica genes in them from the same old sources. The new scene has an indica fetish in Hawaii and its not good for native outdoor bud. However the Medical aspect allows 7 plants, and since Sativas yield much more and tend to be more mold resistant than Indicas, Sativas are coming back. The best place to find old school genes is probably the hardest.
Once again its who you know. Hawaii has no cartel. Hundreds of growers, each trying to breed the perfect strain for the area they grow in. This tends to muddy strains fast.

MOLOKAI FROST is one of my most favorite strains off all much less from the islands. I smoked it all up before I got a picture, seems how thats how it goes with the best weed. Molokai frost is like a tropical bubblegum. it smells like some type of super tangy bubblegum that might be named "tropical treat" or something like that. THE softest smoking strain I've ever had and smokes and tastes amazing the day its off the plant. doesn't even really need a cure, its just that delicious. its a lazy sativa, but I love her. so happy.

pic courtesy of zion.



molokai frost by "iceman"



HAWAII LINKS

Finding weed in Hawaii
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=34577

Vibe in Hawaii
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=219619

US STRAINS
America has always been a haven for breeders and growers despite the horrible laws. Far too many strains to name have been developed here but I'll list some of the most important and some of my favorites.



HAZE- the original ultimate sativa. pic courtesy of cedarberry




quotes from several growers about haze via pike

There will end up being countless haze pics in this thread so I'm not going to put one up.

"Purple haze was a strain from positronics .
Which is haze x purple#1 . Before that was no such thing as purple
haze . There was only haze from the haze brothers"

SamS,
What a crock, Positronics did not even have any Haze until I gave it
to them after the mid 1980's. They crossed Haze with a local Pars
Purple outdoor variety that was weak shit pot that had a nice color.
FYI, Purple Haze was sold in the early 1970's by the Haze Brothers
in Santa Cruz, I should know I smoked it back then every day for
years....
BTW, some of the Purple Haze needed cold to turn purple, others did
not need cold and were purple even if never cold. Purple Haze was
pure Original Haze, and the purple color was not dominate, so easy to
lose.
I also like the Silver Blue, and Lime Green Haze better then the
Purple Haze, because they were more up, clear, and energetic in the
high. But the Purple may have been the strongest Haze and got the top
prices. It also looked great.
Did eneyone ever hear the band the Original Haze? Jerry Miller from
the Moby Grape started the group in the 70's after smoking the
Original Haze in Santa Cruz. He loved the Haze and bought a lot!!!

-SamS




joellama,
The question is "i'm pretty sure the haze bros have kept a clone or
two or original haze"

SamS,
First of all neither Haze Brother is still a grower, second they
never made clones or used clones when they were growers. But if you
are pretty sure then you must be right, even though you have never
met the Haze brothers or smoked any of "their" Original Haze, have you?

-SamS



The haze bros. gave birth to the strain that is the real purple haze.
The columbian part of the haze was done by the haze bros. It is this
original columbian pheno that came to be known as the purple haze.
Their original haze was created by using several landraces: mexican,
thai, Indian and columbian. This line was never stabilized by them,
but passed on as seeds and eventually clones. wernard of positronics
fame had two or three of the original clones and made seeds with them
years ago. Among the clones he had, was the purple pheno or purple
haze. nevil and Shantitaba also both posess the original haze
line(haze bros) and are still working with them(although they only
sell hybrids). Purple haze is still out there, either in seeds or
clones. I know several people with seeds via the bros, but haven't
seen the purple clone in several years. But I'm sure there are many
others who hold their clone or seeds very close.


I think alot of the mixup on this strain and doubts have stemmed from
songs and for the fact that many people call any purple weed, purple
haze due to it's hype. Although, this makes it more difficult to
verify for some and a myth like G13, there is still a real purple
haze around.

That being said, there are probably 5000 to 1 hybrids of the haze
around compared to the original. This is for many reasons. easy of
growth and finishing time being the most common. And this has not
really diluted the line, just made it much harder for the average
customer/grower to obtain, as many haven't preserved or sold their
original, never crossed lines.


I also have to say, I find an African haze very hard to believe. I
have grown pure sativas for close to thirty years, many being
African, columbian, and thai. I have never once found an african
sativa that even slightly resembled a pure haze. Don't get me wrong,
I'm not ragging on you or anything, as it's possible you may hold the
only african haze in your garden, and it's never seen
the light of day or by anyone else for that matter. Just my personal
experience. take care

GM

I passed on the Purple Haze from Positronics, but Posi was the source
of my Haze pictured, Positronics "Original Haze". Their "Purple Haze"
was a hybrid i believe w/maybe purple#1?. You'll have to check with
Sam Skunkman as to what the other component in the Purple Haze was,
he was doing the breeding for them at the time. What folks really
want is the pure haze, but they just can't get that song out of their
heads

Best Regards,
Tom

Hello all

it seems all of you are deeply moved by trying to prove some points
here. Maybe I can try and clarify somethings for you.

Nev and Sam worked on several things together at one stage in their
careers. This meant there was shared work in seed and clone form. The
Haze originals and the Skunk lines were two of these . The Haze bros
were their original source of Haze in seed form. However after people
begin working on seed from this point on only their particular
versions of what they gave names to were based on their particular
versions of that line.So of course differences will be manifest in
breeding lines.
While Nev and I and Arjan joined forces Nev did his lines and I did
for the GHSco selling our versions originally under the GHSco name.
While Sam and Dave and others did their thing and in their versions
(selection). The Sensi seed was originally Nev who supplied Ben with
strains to sell in his shops. When Nev finished with Sensi like when
Nev and I finished with GHSco we took our versions of the cup winning
pedigrees away leaving only the strains that were owned jointly by
the seed companies in question. What happened to the Haze and
breeding programs at Sensi and GHSco neither Nev or I can be
responsible for. What is clear is now at Mr Nice Seedbank the
original versions of selected female and male plants that won all
those cups with our old seed companies got a home together. What Sam
and the others did with their versions I and Nev can also not be sure.
So if this helps clear up some of your myths I will be glad as I think
that the proof is in the pudding. Grow out the versions and see for
yourselves if you are still a skeptic...that is always my solution to
curb all the bullshit that is floating in hot air.
All the best Shantibaba

There was also lots of 'Hazes' or 'Haze herb' so everyone might be
right, as it was a generic termingology for being 'hazed' out,
applied to the best herb...imho.

From the 50s there was great Mex and Colombian imports into the US,
mostly small private importers i would assume. From the early 60s the
communes in Cali where trying to grow/acclimatise some of these
import genetics.

Haze was a generic name coined by them for these lines i think.
As the seeds for many of these early grows would have been bag seed
the name would have been chosen to fit, and what a perfect fit the
name 'Haze' is for the Best S.American Sativas..but no one knows the
varieties that went into any of these other lines. As prior to
landraces being collected in the 60/70's there was only really seed
from import, odd seeds here and there from mostly unknown strains.
Collections of specific cultivars collected at source started in the
60s, and KIA4S one of the very first and all time greatest
collectors..

When the returnees from the early Nam excursions came home there was
also Thai experience available, this from the mid to late 50's! Many
of the Cali communes where growing and developing 'Haze' lines to
fuel the rapidly expanding market in Cali. Nam returnees are recorded
as saying they where 'Hazed' in the jungle in Thailand in the late
50s on great Thais. Special Ops returnees, in '56..

The biggest suppliers at the time in Cali where also becoming highly
organised and profficent growers to back up the imports and produce
insitu in Cali..but they where also seeking out and bringing back the
best herb from most corners of the great herb growing regions, South
America and Asia particulary. It must have been a incredibly connisuer
market in Cali at the time. So if the 'Origional Haze' was the best
of these, ever, it must have been just as incredible and legendry as
its described to be, i can believe it to be like a lick of Acid.

Only looks like a couple of these Haze lines have remained in pure
forms. Albeit many times inbred from the origionals. The 'Origional
Haze' marketed and developed by the Haze Bros was indeed the most
famous, maybe because of its BOEL connection, the most expensive ever
and last of the truly great 'Hazes', purely bred to feed that real
old school hippy market who had been brought up on the absolute
finest landrace Sativas from South America and Asia. So it must have
been good.

Thanks to the Haze bros and KIA4s, BOEL etc we have the great
legend of the 'Origional Haze', the one sold in Cali in the 70's
with the posters, tshirts, etc, and proberly the best herb grown
anywhere on earth at the time, but not the only Haze lines there
where. They started breeding their Haze in 69/70 i think.

KIA4S is 100% right as usual, the only 'Origional Haze' there is, is
from the lines of the 'Haze Bros' of Santa Cruz, and thanks to him,
the third Haze brother, its been shared with the world, the legendry
Origional Haze, possibly the best herb grown anywhere on earth, ever!
but not the only Haze.

Just my take on it..

Queijo

LINKS TO HAZE INFO

The True Origins of Haze
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....e+origins+haze

The Best Haze?
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....t=history+haze





APPLE is about as oldschool american as it comes. its supposedly been grown by American Indians outside of New York for 20 years and nobody remembers where it came from. This is one of my favorites, just hits me right. sweet green apples and flowers smell. pleasant up stone that won't take you too far into anxiety, super soft smoke, one of my favs.







BANANA
as far as I know its anyones guess where this next one came from. But its an american favorite. rare and exotic. This is the natural color of these buds. they grow a distinct olive, gold and grey color. The smell is amazing and intangible. like banana nut bread and peppery spices. mellow stony happy high. Thick cigar smelling smoke.


__________________
The point I'm trying to make here... is that there there ain't no point to it. Thats all it is. Because there ain't no point. You didn't ask to come here and you sure can't choose how to leave. You don't know when you're going to go. So don't take this shit serious now. You better have some fun and plenty of it. Because when the shit is over and you ask for a refund its too late. All I can tell you is to keep some sunshine on your face. -Mudbone

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Old 09-14-2006, 11:26 PM #4
Neptune
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I'll be sharing some shots of my Mexican Sativas when they get a bit more interesting, Right now they are just some huge bushes just setting buds. Gona be a lcose race to fight the rain with these up in california!




and here they are from seed.... I selected 5 of the females to grow this year. Next year I will make a better grow with these seeds, I have hundreds.



i

Last edited by Neptune; 09-14-2006 at 11:27 PM..



Old 09-15-2006, 01:00 AM #5
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hi, i remember the ust from the other site and it was awesome, hope this thread gets as big and informative as the old one. whats the plant in the first pic, jingles



Old 09-15-2006, 01:14 AM #6
Closet Funk
CeRtIfIeD OrGaNiC!

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I haven't grown any sativas yet but I got a nice collection of some sativas for sure. Here are some sativas I'll be growing out in the future.

Pure Sativa or Mostly Sativas:

Acapulco Gold x Nepalese (Apple Pie)
Afghan/Haze x Acapulco Gold/Nepalese
Mexican Sativa
Jamaican Sativa
St.Vincent Sativa
Barbados Sativa
Santa Marta Colombian Gold x G13 (Love Potion)
Hawaiian Sativa IBL
C99
Indian Sativa x Ethiopion Sativa

Sativa Hybrids:

Jack Herer x Afghan
Sensi Skunk x Johnny Blaze
AK48
Kali Mist x Bubblegum
Trainwreck x Sour Diesel (Sour Cali)
Trainwreck x Santa Marta Colombian Gold/G13 (Cascadia)
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Old 09-15-2006, 01:17 AM #7
KingRalph
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oh yeah, glad to have this one goin again there was no thread i enjoyed more at OG, it had turned into quite a catalogue of worldy sats!

well just for the record, an old hawaiian from the big island i brought back with me, i called Kona Cherry... because of course she smelled very much of sweet cherries... went over 12 weeks... mixed spectrum lighting and organics to simulate hawaii as best i could...



after a reveg, solely hps an seeded...


the 100% sativa from south africa, Durban Poison, the black licorice treat... was my first HID grow an sat for that matter, been hooked ever since


an of course who can forget Hawyn's Moloka'i Frost! such an enticing minty smell, didn't get to finish these, an lost them as i had to move :( but got a few more seeds to pop, i'm determined to do them up right!



i know bid an a couple others have some incredible flower shots of the moloka'i that i haven't been able to oogle since OG went down... would love to see em again guys!

well those have been my purer sats really hope this thread takes off! many thanks for startin it up again motaco, an with a bang too, love the foxtails, sweet work to chaman an all the equatorial true sat growers peace n green thumbs all
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Old 09-15-2006, 01:47 AM #8
motaco
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COLOMBIAN SECTION

la mano negra colombian black





Primo colombian red rider collected while staying in colombia.



Colombian weed found it's way onto the American market at the beginning of the 70s and towards the end of the 70s it was the dominant herb on the market. Numerous different types from regular commercial brown to a cascade of reds, golds, greens, and purples, but the classic Colombian Gold being the trademark followed by Panama Red. Nicknamed "the smokable quaalude" it's heavier more narcotic effects made it very popular in it's time. There was very little indica bud or hashish around during these times in the US and it was almost all sativas so the tranquilizing stone of Colombian was very exotic.

The earliest days Colombian weed were some of the best. Indians in the mountains who grew personal weed had some of the finest quality of the era. It was some of the very first sensimilla. The males were not initially removed, but the seeds were hand picked out of it for next years crop. They were allowed to fully ripen (hence all the yellow leaves of it's final appearance), and the plants were taken expert care of. When original Colombian Gold hit the market in the early 70's it was some of the finest weed most people had smoked. The problem is very few people got the chance to smoke it. It was very hard to get more than a 1/2 ton at a time of weed this labor intensive.

And so what happened in Colombia is the same repeating story all tokers are familiar with. The same thing that happened in Thailand a decade earlier when soldiers found Thai stick, or in the 90s when "BC bud" turned to "beasters". A small group of people grew amazing pot and it attracted increasingly large buyers. There simply was not enough weed for buyers this large and the growers switch from small intensely cultivated fields of fine genetics, and into large commercial operations based on money. Just like in the early 90's "BC bud" was once generalized as super high quality indoor weed and then by '99 it became thought of for immature low grade outdoor red haired commercial beaster buds. Just as Thai sticks had been replaced with phony inferior commercial sticks, Colombian Gold too would be replaced by massive shipments of "fools gold". A commercial plant that paled in comparison.

As Mexico's infrastructure grew it made the country much easier to control and eradicate marijuana. Large amounts of grass were still coming from Mexico but political pressure forced it into a shadow of it's former self. But by this time the demand for marijuana in American markets began to need an almost industrialized supply. The size and isolation of Colombia, it's lack of infrastructure, open coastline, and most importantly a political culture of corruption was what made Colombia a drug runners mecca during the 70s. Colombia had the ability for key figures to be bribed by growers and smugglers and this allowed the safety net needed for growers to produce literally plantations of pot that produced harvests yearly with multi ton yields. The majority of marijuana sold in the US switched very quickly from Mexican to Colombian commercial. Busts got larger and larger every year, some exceeding twenty tons per cargo ship.

The Colombian drug market expanded incredibly rapidly. When the first smugglers found the Gold Coast they were primarily dealing with Indian tribes who grew small patches grass. Within a few years however major level traffickers got into the game and built entire towns with the sole purpose of smuggling. Hectares of forest were slashed and burned and replanted with neat rows of sativa as far as the eye could see. The Colombians soon found they had tons of commercial brown grass stacked up in canvas tents awaiting a buyer. There was a market, but they just couldn't put enough grass in the back of cargo planes to satisfy the demand, and they didn't have enough trained pilots and runways. They started buying cargo ships and filling the holds with bales of grass. These were the "motherships" and they would take the product close enough to American shores that US smugglers could answer the radio calls, and race out at night to ferry the loads back into the US. Using shrimp boats, yachts, and speed boats they could hide in plain sight, or use backwater swamps to avoid police. Small fishing towns along the east coast and gulf coast became smugglers dens. Small town rednecks who knew the paths through the mazes of swamp canals, or had blood ties to local law enforcement became rich men.

In '78 Jimmy Carter publicly favored a decriminilization of marijuana, but after a scandal involving his drug policy adviser being seen snorting coke at a NORML meeting, and his approval ratings declinging, president Carter could no longer afford to look soft on drugs. Marijuana was an easy target due to the high volumes of product needed to make any money. Tighter enforcement involving the Navy and AWAC (Airborne Warning and Control) systems put an end to high volume loads of smuggler planes and cargo ships, dramatically reducing what it could supply to the market, and eventually making it more trouble than it was worth. This forced American smugglers to look back to Mexico and increasingly to domestic suppliers such as Canada, California, and Appalachia. Marijuana smuggling turned sour for Colombians and they turned to the more lucrative cocaine business, ending the countries significance to US pot smokers for good. By the mid 80's very few shipments of grass were coming from Colombia and the era of "C-bo" was officially over. Today hardly anyone in the states under a certain age group (including myself) has ever smoked Colombian marijuana, the mainstay of an entire decade and generation of smokers.

Group of Colombian pot farmers in their field. Photo credit unknown




Excerpt from a Cannabis Culture article from their free archive. "Pot Smuggled By the Ton".

Growing up on Florida’s Gulf Coast with a childhood steeped in fantasies of swashbuckling pirates, I guess it was natural I’d end up in the smuggling business. My first jobs were unloading bales of Colombian red and gold-bud in 1976 from shrimp boats that hauled about 50,000 pounds. I got paid $5,000 dollars for working all night running bales down the dock and loading them into waiting vans. I got the nickname ‘El Jefe’ from the Colombians on the shrimp boat. No one uses real names in the smuggling world, and my alias meant ‘The Chief’ in Spanish, mocking both my young age and inexperience in the trade. ‘Chipper’ was the guy who put me to work, and my smuggling confreres were nicknamed Coyote, Country, Snake, and The Old Man. You didn’t know their real names but trusted them with your life, money, and future.

I found work in exotic little port towns like Sopchope, Chuckaluski, and Everglade City. The local authorities were always paid off and standing watch, so it didn’t seem too risky. Though bucking bales was certainly hard work, at age 17 I couldn’t imagine a better way to make a living. In the 1960’s and 70’s, smugglers were popular people in the US. All smugglers used their treasure to greatly enrich their coastal communities, whether it was Colombia, Mexico, or Florida smuggling organizations. Violence was very rare, and in the weed smuggling world we took pride in our work. We could never understand the penalties that existed then: two, five, ten years for bringing in tons of great pot. The penalties today in 2006 are insanely worse. Smuggle in a few tons and you get life without parole in much of the US.

Jimmy Carter’s administration went from favoring decriminalization in 1976 to a hard-line prohibitionist war on marijuana trade routes in 1978. Then the US launched an official War on Drugs, and that included marijuana – much to our surprise. Paraquat eradication of Colombian fields, Coast Guard intercepts and Federal prosecutions for many of Florida’s finest law enforcement officials brought an early end to my newfound livelihood.

Shipping Colombian Cannabis. How We Did It:

I set out at midnight with a young man for an historic commercial fishing pier in the little town of Caribou. I freaked out as we pulled down to the dock and went past the local Sheriff and a couple of his deputies, but the kid who had offered me this work quickly explained everything was cool, and outlined my job.

I was to run as fast as I could down the dock to the boat, load up as many bales as possible on a 4-wheel dock cart (hand truck), run it all back down the dock to the parking lot, throw each bale onto a scale, mark gross weight on outside of wrap, record in a ledger and assist “friends” with loading the bales into their vehicles. The boat was an old 140-foot shrimp trawler with Panamanian Registry, bound from Santa Martha, Colombia. The hold of the trawler carried about 50,000 pounds of weed packed in bales with rough dimensions of one meter by 0.7m by 0.7m (approx. 3.5 feet by 2.5ft. by 2.5ft.) and weighing between 40 and 60 pounds each. The pot was mostly what we called good “Mersh”, meaning high quality commercial Colombian (or “C-Bo”). Amongst the load there were also quite a few hidden treasures; bales with pure Oro, Colombian Gold, or Punta Roja – Colombian Red Bud. I had a box cutter to slice open the corner of each bale and check for quality, so I could stash back my favorites. I helped load vehicles ranging from the grand old Lincolns with the big trunks, to a tractor-trailer grain hopper rig. We wedged eight tons of bales into the grain hopper then topped it off with feed grain.

Everything was on “front” (credit). No cash was exchanged at the dock. Friends were simply expected to return in a week or two with the wrap for calculating tare weight and the cash to pay for the net weight. The Colombians, bosses and crew would spend a nice vacation in Florida and wait to get paid. The boss used to boast that it was the only real honest business on earth. Guns were never seen or discussed – this was just a bunch of young hippy boys spreading good weed and sharing a bit of the wealth with some depressed local fishing villages. I worked unloading trawlers up and down the Gulf Coast for more than year in little ports like Steinhatchee, Sopchopee and Chucaluskee. It really seemed a noble calling at the time. We didn’t even think of pot as a drug. That is, until President Carter’s pro-decriminalization administration turned full circle to lump pot as the easiest target in the War on Drugs. This garnered easy establishment points for a failing administration entering the second half of Carter’s term.

Beginning in 1978, US troops started spraying Colombian pot fields with Paraquat; the US Coast Guard began open-seas intercepts; several of Florida’s County Sheriffs were prosecuted federally; and the Colombian shrimp boat trade soon dried up. Though I had been spending money like a drunken sailor, I still had enough left to lick my wounds with an extended vacation in Jamaica. The rest of the boys started flying in DC-6 twin-engine prop planes loaded with bales of C-Bo, which were kicked out of the plane while flying low over the Everglades. Awaiting powerboats would shuttle the bales down the Shark and Harney Rivers for offloading into vehicles.

special thanks to RACO, not only for having the foresight to save this but also the heart to type it back into english for us. Thanks bro. I really mean it.

The Legend of Panama Red"
by Anonymous
(This story is probably mostly a work of fiction, but its been around since the old OG sativa thread and is a neat tale.)

"In this story youīll learn who and how this 12 ton load of Panama Red was smuggled into California.
Have you ever heard the legend of Panama Red?.I mean you have heard of Panama red,havenīt you?
Well,hereīs the true story about a load that came into california,in 1969.
I drove up Highway 1,to Maple Street,in Tam Valley,and turned left.If you know where this is,itīs near to Mill Valley.I went to my connectionīs house to see what what exotic weed had come in..He had Yucatan Green,which was fully filled into white plastic bags.It had a fruity aroma,and you could uncoil the kiwi colored green leaves back into their natural finger and hand shapes.Iīn never seen weed cured this well.It was somehow cured like pliable tobacco leaves.The price was $150 a pound,which was a lot back in those days.Next,a brown grocery sack came out of the closet,which I noticed was full of white plastic bags and the brown grocery bags.From my quick glance I estimated about 10 bags of weed in all.

As the top of the brown bag was unfolded,I immediately smelled the strong aroma of fresh tilled earth,perhaps the smell when you turn over a mulching log,combined with red clay.Then I distinguished another smell.The smell of fresh earth with a strong hashish smell.A handful of the well dried small nugs was pulled out and laid on the stainless steel plate of the triple-beam.I was in wonder as I had never seen any weed that wasnīt green or gold.To my amazement these small buds were a bright rusty color.Not brown like the Columbian Gold I scored a few years later,but you know,a rusty red color.I asked where is this weed from?

My connection told me the story

This is Panama Red.This stuff grows in the mountains north of the Panama Canal.The soil is red to black,with rain all the time.Itīs impossible to get this weed but I have access to about one ton of it.

How much is it for a pound?I asked him.

Itīs 220 a pound.My wad of cash choked in my pocket,as I had thought that the Yucatan Green was expensive.he could read me.He pulled out a paper from his Zig-Zag packet,and rolled a pinhead joint.Then he lit it up,making a yellow flame as the empty paper end burned into the weed.He took the first puff,which sent off two thin intertwined lines of blue gray hashish like smoke,heading towards the ceiling.
If this were possibly,he looked even more euphoric from the one hit,and his eyes rolled back,and closed,as he slowly stabbed the smoking pinner across the table in my direction.As I reached out for it he said in a choked breath while exhaling smoke:
"youīll probably never get weed this good again"

I knew his word was always true.My connection and his group had smuggled hashish from Afghanistan,India and Morocco.heīd been busted for importing hash in the bottom of a crate of snakes.He always had exotic weed and hash.He wouldnīt mess around with the weed I could get from the pilots in my part of the state.The only stuff I could get in my area was Mexican weed which ran from $80 to $120 a brick.We called this weed "reg" for regular.The reg kilos or bricks came wrapped in red,green or blue construction paper and was taped off with masking tape.This was the regular bottom line,non exotic weed that was somewhat harsh to the throat but got you stoned.We resold for $10 a lid,or if you werenīt around back then,a lid is an ounce.

The hash smell of the pinner was overcoming my thoughts as I took a hit of pure heaven.The smoke was so smooth,with a taste just like is unburnt of fresh clean earth and hashish.I thought it tasted like Lebanese Red hash,mixed with fresh earth,as I barely watched the smoke vining itīs way upwards.It was hash without the bite.Then the stone came on as I took my second hit.My senses sudenly kicked into hyper space as I became acutely awared of everything.My hearing,my thinking,my senses were all rocketed into Stonesville,which is a different place for every one of us.Whitin a minute:I realized I was really stoned.I laughed.Shortly after three hits,I started seeiong trails,colors,and realized this weed was a psychedelic high too.Lots of colors and laughs,in a mellow floating state.A weed to bring out your innermost thoughts,to philosophize about the finer points of life and existence,with those of like mind.

In 1969, i bought five pounds of Panama Red, which is the most stony weed I have ever smoked,even to this day.When I got back home,where the local hippies were used to $10 price of an oz. of reg,I knew I couldnīt sell this rusty red weed.First,since it wasnīt green,they wouldnīt believe it was weed.Second,the price would be about four times what they were used to paying for an oz. of reg weed.I kept telling myself nobody was ready for this rusty weed which would send anybody,especially these locals to heaven.I knew that if I rolled pinners,it would take me years to smoke all this exotic weed.I figured out at least 80 joints to an oz,,and I had 80 ozs.,and letīs see,thatīs 6400 joints.I couldnīt take time to do one a day,so I figured maybe 150 a year,and um,it would take me over forty-two years to smoke all of this weed.It would lose itīs potency after one year or two.Then the lightbulb came on.Iīd roll about ten pinners and just give them away.I understood that even my friends could figure out that this was the best weed in the world.After they had smoked the fantastic weed,they would realize how stoned they were,and with the weed rolled up they wouldnīt know it wasnīt green!Great idea!I reached into my pocket again as I arrived at the toll booth on the Golden Gate Bridge entering to San Francisco,stoned out of my mind.

I want you to know something,when I got home,thatīs exactly what I did.I passed out the pinners and asked my friends to just try it and give me their opinions.The questioned me about the small sized joints,and I said:what are you complaining about?itīs for free.Then the phone started ringing with questions like "What was that?,Is that laced with acid?That canīt be ordinary weed,Do you have any more?Then I got to tell the story of Panama Red to them,which if you ever smoked the real thing,I need not to say more.

MEETING THE SMUGGLER

On another score trip north,about one month later,I discovered that my connection had moved to Stinson Beach.You might know where he moved if you ever went there.It was the third house back from the beach.It was on the left,the one with the purple door.When the purple door opened,I gasped as I thought I saw my dad sitting down counting cash on a coffee table.I realized that it really wasnīt my Dad,but the guy was a dead ringer to my Dad.He had a receding conservative haircut,with brown hair,and graying sideburns.Same facial features.My connection introduced him,and for his protection,Iīll just call him Roy.Roy wqs counting out $40,000 cash,another installment for the fronting of his illegal,precious cargo of Panama Red to my connection.This was a lot of money for a weed deal back in 1969,and probably,one of a hundred bags of money picked up by Roy.You figure it out,if he sold his Panama Red for only $120 a pound,times 24,000 pounds he grossed about $2.9 million from his load.Thirty years ago this money had the purchasing power of about 4 times more than it woul buy today.However,I have no idea what Panama Red would cost today,as I never found it again.Iīve had Colombian Gold,but itīs more of a brown tobacco color.Red is a very earthy,and I havenīt ever seen any counterfeit stuff offered.I havenīt even seen the seeds offered.The $40,000 Roy was counting was only a payment for about 300 pounds.Payment for a ton woul be $240,000.Donīt forget he had the money from selling the fish too.

Roy was a very candid person,treating me as if heīd known me his whole life.He explained the Panama Red saga.He bought a surplus submarine chaser,a 90 footer.He sold most of the military gear and paid for the vessel with money left over.It was a typical government deal where millions were spent to build and outfit the ship,and then it was later sold for peanuts.Roy outfitted it as a fishing boat.He got a crew together and went south.He loaded in 12 tons of Panama Red and then he and his crew went fishing
got a small fleet of fishing and sailboats together.This fleet was obviously pre-planned.The fleet was a fleet of smugglers who went under the Golden Gate Bridge out about 25 miles and towards the Farallon Islands,where the panama Red was quickly offloaded onto these smaller boats.One Harbor Master inside the bay was in on it too,so there was little change of anybody getting caught.I canīt tell you if it was day or night,foggy or anything about the conditions,but I do know from other smugglers that they use the worst weather conditions for all of their activities.If itīs hard for them,itīs hard for the cops to catch them.Roy said he retired off this trip,and that he sold his fish,the ship and intended on paying the IRS itīs taxes on the fish,if any were due.Roy told me the city he lived in,and Iīll give you a hint,he lived between San Francisco,and San Jose.If you know him,tell him thanks from me.

I grew some plants from the very small brown seeds.The plants had stalks with alternating green and purple vertical lines.The dark green leaves had purple veins.I got tired of watering them,so I sold the crop where they stood by selling a map with itīs location.My friends nicknamed me Panama Red for waking them up to this high.Thereīs been no more Panama Red,that Iīm aware of.If Iīm wrong,Iīd like to hear your story"

LINKS
alduous colombian
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=30830

chamans tropical grow thread
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....=south+america

potential in south america
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....=south+america

chamans smoke descriptions for some colombians

Colombian Red.

Origin very contraversial, but likes the dryer seasons and higher elevations. This plant starts off very fatt leafed and has tighter nodes which makes you think it's an indica in many ways or a hybird, as it even smells while young too, but will finish to be very if not 100% sativa.

The Reds will grow about 1 to 2 feet tall, sex, and flower only dobleling in size under 12hr conditions and tropical climate if that as too a Gold when starting can finish 3 or 4 times her size easy. the Reds will put out red colors on leaf stems, branches and main stalk too. Leafs are a darker green then the golds and the smell is strong, even with out rubbing or touching. When cutting jeje stand back even...It's a more pugnent, sweeter smell.

Leafs don't revert as much as the golds, but doo to a degree.

It can finish in half the time the Golds but realy do prefer drier climates since can get some mold on their flowers. Very heavy on the tric's as she looks sugar bathed indeed.

High isn't as tripy or energetic as the gold but sets in faster and hits realy hard, thought disorientation is easy...forgetting what you just did, where doing or wanted too do is too easy.

It's taste is awsome, some chocolate even but it's not easy too take in, the smallest hit for some can make me and friends cough. High doesn't climb after smoking but does last for a considrable amount of time and doesn't make you feel hungover after, few to many hits can put you out though as your body goes numb...not like the Golds where you can smoke more anytime and feel higher and alive agian almost make'n you get up and dance'n. Both will give a good luagh as you do the stupidest things...

Easy to clone and revege when young, likes water only when she needs it in comparison with Golds. Very easy to care for, with plenty of branches and great main cola the yields are rewarding.



Colombian Gold, Pure sativa.

Origin is uncertain, since so many stories have been made, but these due best in vallies and lower elevations, along rivers and in humid areas.

Grows very well when started in humid seasons, and under tropical conditions best. A plant that thrives on as much water, sun as she can get while young, resulting higher female ratios and growing vigorously with mold resistance, finishing in time for the dry season.

She can go into flower under 12hr day/nights around 2-3 feet tall but will continue to grow easily even in opposite phylo reaching 6-9feet tall with branches that can come from her lowest point that can be just as long as she is tall. In Containers along with water deprivation maybe a little string, she can be controlled.

Normally very long thin colas, but not always as some will fatten as they like too keep putting out fresh pistils when allowed and cared for, giving impressive long colas, coverring from there tips all the way too the main stalk. Color goes from a very light if not florescent light green to a very dark forest green on mature leafs. When trics appear, normally in later flower these plants sparkle in the sun covered in fine sugar that makes them look almost silver.

Grows in a cone shape, nodes are tight for such pure Sativas and get very woody stems, while still green can be easy to train, or bend.

Leafs appear from single blades then 3 digits 5, 7 and up to 9 digits are common. Very heavy serrations, even double serrated sometimes. When mature leafs will revert from 9 to 7, 6, 5, 3 and finally single blades again. They will then yellow out from the bottom up, from larger to smaller then falling while pistils go from white too pink in majority. In Colder nights the calyxes can turn a wonderful purple even blues.

Smell is very special, mostly only when rubbed or mature but is of a sweet, yet kind of sour diesel pine smell. With long dries and a good cure the buds turn a copper color, hence “Colombian Gold”.

The high is energetic, stimulating mind and body, it's a soaring rocket fuel awaking high that can make some go pale, feel a accelerated heart beat and numbing of the body and brain.

The taste and smoothness make it easy to take a nice long deep hit...but wait to you let it out, thick clouds of white smoke that can bring a few tears out cough'n. Long lasting high that sets in as your starting your joint, that just keeps climb'n take'n you higher and higher even long after you finished, make'n it hard to measure when to stop smoke'n jeje

Realy makes you happy, joyfull and glow as you wish everyone could feel as great as you are. Worth the wait indeed. Can draw for hrs, sit and stare at somthing for hrs...talk for hrs jeje wifes faovrite is you can have sex for hrs too ! friends have always said the same...jeje herbal viagra, some even have called it love potion.


Colombian Creepie

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Colombian Creepie,

Origin, un known for sure, seeds came from comercial bricks also. Plants seemed very much like the Golds, but I noticeds that these would grow to a certian size and then start to tip over on there own, very week looking at first as it's branches don't stiff out seem to never stiffen actually, they bend and curve with the wieght but don't snap.

The Colas have a way of getting very fat as they just stack on more and more, if the plant isn't tied up she would almost look like a vine with tips pointing up searching for light when fully mature.

The high is very special, jejej but hard to calculate. See you smoke now, feel it, but doesn't realy kick in till later. Just creeps up on you...Great laughter, very energetic, even tripy like the Golden, except kinda seems to not want too stop climbing. Easy to want too smoke another right away since you don't feel so high jeje but you'll feel it later definitly. Great to smoke before a movie or work jeje as you'll be alert, social and waiting for a good laugh.

Creepy much like the gold can be hard to calculate when to harvest as they don't seem to want to finish, coka cola bottle fat types.



PARAGUAY

Paraguay is a small land locked South American country bordering Argentina, Bolivia, and Brasil. It is sparsely populated, with many remote parks and preserves where large marijuana plantations can be hidden. It produces over half of all marijuana produced in South America, and is the main supply country to the large smokers market in Brasil. Paraguay is one of South Americas poorest countries where over half of the population lives below the poverty line. Due in part to a weak economy, and the increasing number of large foreign agribusiness taking over peasant farmland, the country has become a center for drug production, smuggling, and money laundering. Many families have turned to guerilla growing ganja on state preserve land to provide income for their family.

Once known for high quality grass the area is now famous for super low grade brickweed. In order to get more money the farmers brick their harvest while it is still wet to get more weight. This is a terrible practice though and causes much of the bricks to rot with molds and mildews. Despite being one of the worlds largest producers, it also produces some of the worlds worst grass.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=131190
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The point I'm trying to make here... is that there there ain't no point to it. Thats all it is. Because there ain't no point. You didn't ask to come here and you sure can't choose how to leave. You don't know when you're going to go. So don't take this shit serious now. You better have some fun and plenty of it. Because when the shit is over and you ask for a refund its too late. All I can tell you is to keep some sunshine on your face. -Mudbone

Last edited by motaco; 02-07-2012 at 02:54 AM..
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Old 09-15-2006, 02:20 AM #9
Raco
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Good idea motaco...
I enjoyed a lot your OG thread
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Old 09-15-2006, 02:27 AM #10
motaco
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raco, now there is a face I wanted to see.

keepin the community up. hadn't talked to you much since I got here but I been seeing you around. good to see you buddy.

one of our very impressive resident sativa growers from spain.

No grow and no pics of any old grows right now even.
I did end up getting a camera so I got some pics of some dry buds I had, and I take pics of the commercial indica I buy out here. But its breaking my bank! You forget how expensive it is to buy bud. I'm not smoking the amount or quality I'm used to. The really good weed I get is all indica and it puts you DOWN!

AFRICAN SECTION hopefully coming soon
INDIA SECTION hopefully coming soon
SE ASIA SECTION hopefully coming soon
links
gypsy thai stick sativa
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.p...ght=thai+ganja

elevator man thai stick test grow
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.p...ght=thai+ganja

thai brick grow
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.p...ght=thai+ganja

thai discussion
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.p...ght=thai+ganja
__________________
The point I'm trying to make here... is that there there ain't no point to it. Thats all it is. Because there ain't no point. You didn't ask to come here and you sure can't choose how to leave. You don't know when you're going to go. So don't take this shit serious now. You better have some fun and plenty of it. Because when the shit is over and you ask for a refund its too late. All I can tell you is to keep some sunshine on your face. -Mudbone

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