[led05]

Originally Posted by Sam_Skunkman

And in the wine industry why do you think all growers use virus free certified grape vines? No one grows wine from seed plants. Same with strawberries and other crops.
I agree that seeds are handy for breeding and finding new elite clones to mass produce. But in the future most Cannabis in the West may well be TC.
-SamS

Long lived Perennial vs an Annual, quite different animals... Strawberries, really?

I agree TC will play a larger & larger role but the more seeds, the more new creations and diversity... Canna vs grape suitability regions have a huge difference too, so many varieties of canna growing everywhere around earth, inside and out, grapes not so much ��

You as much as anyone knows the uniqueness of this plant, lets not turn it into another AG commodity like strawberries or corn which are extremely simple by comparison

[Sam_Skunkman]

I think you are mixing up production and how the plant will be bred in the future.
The plants will be grown from TC virus free certified clones, the new clones will be bred with seeds like grape vines and strawberries get their new clones.

I love seeds, I love male Cannabis plants, but I can see the future....
-SamS

[led05]

Originally Posted by Sam_Skunkman

I think you are mixing up production and how the plant will be bred in the future.
The plants will be grown from TC virus free certified clones, the new clones will be bred with seeds like grape vines and strawberries get their new clones.

I love seeds, I love male Cannabis plants, but I can see the future....
-SamS

Good points, just don’t want to see this plant go the way of most all AG products, significant narrowing of selections into only a select few.., we’ve already seen far too much of this the past 3 decades, let’s diverge not narrow

[beta]

Originally Posted by led05

Good points, just don’t want to see this plant go the way of most all AG products, significant narrowing of selections into only a select few.., we’ve already seen far too much of this the past 3 decades, let’s diverge not narrow

If you think legal cannabis will be anything other than another agricultural product, you're gonna have a bad time.

[led05]

Originally Posted by beta

If you think legal cannabis will be anything other than another agricultural product, you're gonna have a bad time.

I don’t for a second, why I’ve been hoarding seeds for decades, I do this for many species of plants... for example, there used to be thousands of varieties of apples grown in good ol America., a fraction of that nowadays, somewhat a resurgence going on but most of those old great varieties origins came from seed and cross pollination, naturally, accidentally ....

once the masses start relying on TC, it’s already too late... to trust AG business to maintain lines for the good and not focus purely on profit is ignorance, expect narrowing to continue big time, get worse.... it always amazes me how one day folks preach diversity, as soon as $$$ is on the line for them their attitude shifts, pure capitalistic focus., we are only human after all

[beta]

It's not either / or. Nobody will ever prohibit you from germinating seeds and looking for your own phenos. TC is simply the -best- way to produce reliable, pathogen free cuttings on an enormous scale. It will be adopted because it works better than anything else.

Fun fact about apples - They are highly heterozygous, meaning that 99%+ of the apple seeds you will start are gonna suck - No flavor, poor yield, etc. It's very difficult to breed apples for specific traits, that's why people tend to grow clones of the rare unique individuals that have popped up over time.

People choose technology because it works. Results matter.

[led05]

Originally Posted by beta

It's not either / or. Nobody will ever prohibit you from germinating seeds and looking for your own phenos. TC is simply the -best- way to produce reliable, pathogen free cuttings on an enormous scale. It will be adopted because it works better than anything else.

Fun fact about apples - They are highly heterozygous, meaning that 99%+ of the apple seeds you will start are gonna suck - No flavor, poor yield, etc. It's very difficult to breed apples for specific traits, that's why people tend to grow clones of the rare unique individuals that have popped up over time.

People choose technology because it works. Results matter.

I'm currently prohibited from germinating and looking for my own phenos as we write right now...? !!

if folks were using TC 300 years ago, we'd have 15 apple varieties vs. the thousands we have avail today.... I think we're arguing apples to oranges here

good post btw, I mostly agree with you, playing dev advocate here some

[Stickybred420]

im pretty sure theres already canna companies utilizing this tech. and they have been for a minute or two. check out big foot clones

[Sam_Skunkman]

Originally Posted by led05

I don’t for a second, why I’ve been hoarding seeds for decades, I do this for many species of plants... for example, there used to be thousands of varieties of apples grown in good ol America., a fraction of that nowadays, somewhat a resurgence going on but most of those old great varieties origins came from seed and cross pollination, naturally, accidentally ....

once the masses start relying on TC, it’s already too late... to trust AG business to maintain lines for the good and not focus purely on profit is ignorance, expect narrowing to continue big time, get worse.... it always amazes me how one day folks preach diversity, as soon as $$$ is on the line for them their attitude shifts, pure capitalistic focus., we are only human after all

I hope you are not saving apple seeds, that is generally a waste of time unless you are planting tens of thousands looking for a new clone to keep. Apple seeds are heterozygous and no one grows apple seeds for apple crops, when Johnny appleseed gave out and sold apple seeds and trees they were not for eating apples they were used for cider, still a good idea, I love trees.
Nothing wrong with TC, it is just another tech that can be used.
Apples need to be maintained as a tree or by TC, you can't maintain apple varieties by seeds....
-SamS

[led05]

Originally Posted by Sam_Skunkman

I hope you are not saving apple seeds, that is generally a waste of time unless you are planting tens of thousands looking for a new clone to keep. Apple seeds are heterozygous and no one grows apple seeds for apple crops, when Johnny appleseed gave out and sold apple seeds and trees they were not for eating apples they were used for cider, still a good idea, I love trees.
Nothing wrong with TC, it is just another tech that can be used.
Apples need to be maintained as a tree or by TC, you can't maintain apple varieties by seeds....
-SamS

I have 15+ varieties of apples, 10 are cider based on stock at least a couple of hundred years old.... Apple seeds, nope - scions grafted on root stock, most developed at Cornell, I'm in apple country out here and it makes sense to use that base root stock, damn cold here in winter !

I agree TC is a great tech, inevitable and already widely in use, especially in other AG space. I'm just simple stating that historically when the mass relies on a few to develop or maintain their AG products (which is exactly what TC lends itself to), it narrows immensely and before we know it, our choices and variability are diminished or gone and the only option left is to buy the crap or grow your own from hopefully still a wide pool of avail seed stock, or what you've been hoarding yourself....

The good & bad of advancement....