PH issues with PPK

Ok boys and girls, I don't know if any of you are having any PH spikes with your RO water but out of the RO machine it is reading 7.4 with >10PPM's.
History;
When I first started this PPK venture it was recommended to me to use the RO water and mix equal amounts of Jacks 1/3cup and Calcium nitrate (yara liva)1/3cup into my 44gal brute. I did. All was awesome for about a yr..personal record yields, the whole nine yards. No problems with PH or high PPMs after nute mix.

Lately using my RO water, mixing the nutes and checking the PH, adjusting (with a lot of PHdown) to 5.7-5.8 with PPM s at 700-800, the ph rises to 7.5 within a day. Also raises my PPMs to double the starting PPMs. Yes, 1600-1800
I have no bugs and have all ready drained systems multiple times.
also changed membrane and prefilters on my RO system.


Should I use a stronger "buffer", meaning nute solution? In the hopes that it will bring it down naturally?

I am about to go get some Muriatic acid from Lowes and thought I might ask to see if any one else is experiencing this. If not I am buying stock in GH PHdown.

dude thats crazy. i hope you get it sorted out. the only suggestions i had were one you already tried.

your baseline seems normal. just like mine. i dont have to add anything at all. i stopped checking mine when i mix because its so stable. i check the res once a week or so at most.

hopefully someone will chime in with help

Nobody has experienced this?
I am holding all the control buckets at 5.7 with the acid.
I think it has to do with my well water so I might be stuck with doing this dance until spring.

I hardly even want to chime in, being that I have never used jacks, and also because I know so little about wtf I'm ever even talking about, but my RO also does.. wild and unpredictable shit unless I buffer it out with some tap water. I've been mixing 1:3-1:4 tap to RO with predictable results for some time now.

Starting ppm is 300-550 depending on the season, with a ph of 7.5-8. RO comes out clean enough. 1:3 tap to RO, I come out around 75-125 ppm, and after mixing in the usual 555 or 2.5/5/7.5 (gh) I come out ~700 @ ~ 5.8. Without buffering, I come out 600 @ ~5.4

I honestly don't know dick squat about water chemistry, or very much about plant biology, but.. my water seems to behave erratically sometimes unless I buffer it out with some tap. I wouldn't assume that "tap" is the answer. It seemed to work in my instance, but.. I didn't do a controlled study by any measure, so tf do I know. I also see everybody else doing just fine without tap. I truly do not know what tf or why tf.. BUT.. I also haven't had a "surprise" ph reading since I started buffering with tap some 3-4 years ago, so.. I just keep on buffering.

I feel bad now for even having opened my stupid trap. But.. I already typed it all out so.. I'll just leave this mess here.

muratic acid will add considerable chloride to your solution, so it probably is not a good long term solution.

Sulfuric acid would be a better locally available acid to use for pH down adjustment. It is sold at my local lowes in the plumbing section, on the wall with the basement pumps. Battery electrolyte for maintaining back up batteries. Item # 117269

The Gen Hydro pH down is a mixture of phosphoric acid, citric acid and monoammonium phosphate. The organic component (citric acid) makes it prone to microbial degradation and thus a loss in buffer action.

When was the last time you changed your r/o filter? (Edit: *facepalm* I see you just changed them. *sigh* Shows I'm paying attention, eh?) A back-wash system will help extend the life, but they do have a lifespan. When was the last time you changed your pre-filters as well? The ppm rise is not from the r/o water. Is there a reason you're mixing some (variable element mix) tap water with your clean r/o? Is your nutrient mix balanced for using tap water or can you do everything with your nutes and skip the tap water? Whatever is in the tap is most likely your issue.

R/O is super predictable/neutral to pH. If you're having issues, you need to look at the source of your r/o water.

Is there a reason you're mixing some (variable element mix) tap water with your clean r/o?

Click to expand...

Assuming that this is aimed at me, since OP didn't mention tap..

It's good water. I grew up on it. I started using it as a ph up while I was waiting on a bottle, and it stabilized everything really nicely, so I started mixing it in off bat and my ph ghost went away completely.

Apples and oranges, but I haven't had issue since. Sorry for the hj.

Mr.Blah,

What is your ppm and pH of plain r/o water, after a day in your Brute? Jacks and cal-nit are definitely different from GH Flora. I have only used pH up for 15+ years, after mixing GH products into r/o water.

very weird shit, blah! any chance you are getting the water after a water softener? is there a water softener upstream from your ro filter?

not all ro water is the same. i also used to mix my ro with tap until 100 ppm combined.

that may stabilize it.

also, i use 85% phosphoric acid for ph down and my system is very stable.

http://www.dudadiesel.com/choose_item.php?id=FGphosg

delta9nxs said:

very weird shit, blah! any chance you are getting the water after a water softener? is there a water softener upstream from your ro filter?

not all ro water is the same. i also used to mix my ro with tap until 100 ppm combined.

that may stabilize it.

also, i use 85% phosphoric acid for ph down and my system is very stable.

https://www.dudadiesel.com/choose_item.php?id=FGphosg

Click to expand...

Oh shit! I woke D up..
There is no softener in the line, anywhere.
Just took some measurements an hr ago and 5 mins ago.
Well water out the tap is 9.5Ph (an hr ago) with 525PPM's at 67degreesF.
and out of the RO machine with all new filters and membrane is 8.0Ph (an hr ago) with 46PPM's at 67degreesF.

about ten mins ago I thought I would check before posting this just for shits and giggles;
Well water out of tap is 9.9Ph with 526PPM's and out of the RO machine it is still 8.0Ph and 46PPM's.

It's got to be this well fluctuating from summer and winter flushing up calcium or something.

Even adding about 10mil of muriatic acid to the control buckets they rose again like with the PH down did.

I shut down 4 of the flower rooms and never reloaded until this shit is figured out. I got 2 finishing and as long as I keep the PH at bay they are fine. Forget to do it one day and they lock out and PPm's rise..I think that's what is going on?

I've made a copy of jack's here in the UK and have had a constantly rising pH.

There's not enough ammoniacal Nitrogen in the mix to buffer pH with certain water.

I've used MAP in my mix to sort this out. But you could replace some of your calcium nitrate with ammonium nitrate to sort it.

You might need to do some calculations to make sure you still have around 150 mg/L total nitrogen, with around ⅛ of it from ammoniacal nitrogen..

Peace
BL

EDIT: I also use a calcium chelate to make up for lost calcium but in a recirculating system calcium uptake is slow compared to other elements so it tends to accumulate.