[socioecologist]

Originally Posted by stasis

THIS Is the 1% talking. No different than the Rich against the poor. Alnost NO ONE can make this happen anymore. QUIT BRAGGING>

As for this quote "Turn yourself into a specialty item like fine wine, coffee, cigars, scotch,seafood,etc. that can charge super high prices because consumers recognize the value of your product. Marketing/consumer education/brand awareness are all key here. "

SO Far, Boutique Does NOT WORK. Maybe that will change. They just find someone with TOP_SHELF stock and Lowball, until they find someone willing to part with it for pennies. THE NEW NORMAL>

Two things: first, you couldn't be further from the truth about me. My company isn't vertically integrated; we sell seed to farmers and some R&D flower from our test grows each year to other product manufacturers. We're very big compared to closet cannabis breeders, but still awfully small and lean compared to standard vegetable seed breeders. I agree with your statement that only the wealthy can afford to be vertically integrated and producing at scale, it's just not me or my company.

Second, the problem may be with your definition of "boutique" going into this. If there's one truism of pre-legal cannabis, it's that every grower thought they had the best flowers on the market--and, for almost every grower, it was generally true. Due to the structure of informal markets, most are isolated from each other (and hence the success of boards like these in the pre-legal days) and buyers are limited to friends and family with some occassional outliers. Think of cannabis growers as being, literally, the asteroid belt between Earth and Mars. Everyone thinks they are the shit when they are a fist-sized rock and have 20 pebbles orbiting them; it's beyond the scope of comprehension for that rock to notice planet-sized protuberances exerting their gravitational force on the whole asteroid belt. That's the cannabis market today; those planet size forces don't think your flower deserves a 200x return on investment anymore, especially when the market is flooded (Oregon currently has 10x it's yearly consumption in cannabis products being stored in retail, wholesale, and grower facilities). If you don't have something truly novel--and no, a new polyhybrid cookies cross isn't novel--you don't stand much of a chance.

[Gram Paw smurf]

I personally think a lot of the newer businesses will bust out once wholesale prices really strt coming down n others can strt reachin for their dreams with either some extract or edible or whatnot that they can have a specific recipe for or something that ppl just like.
Plus there's just going to be a mass exodus of businesses eventually as the market gets more n more flooded with options, eventually ppl will figure out their own tastes n know what they like n what they don't need to bother with trying or playing around with anymore.
Those who's products are enjoyed n used n bought up will go on n the rest will bust out like everyone else in every other business.
Hell How many 10's of if not 100's of thousands of ppl are just gonna opt out n grow their own n fuck buyin or selling any of it, n be perfectly fine with that really.


We're fuckin human beings, if you can't adapt to something as simple as a business market place busting out than that's just evolution.
What I really see is a lot of whiners crying about how they won't be allowed to be the ones monopolizing a biological commodity/resource without changing a thing they do to do so.


In simplest terms it just aint gonna fuckin happen. lol
Get over it n move on n just enjoy doing your thing, or get to thinkn n workin a lot harder cause that's what it's gonna take to keep up.


cheers,....................... .............................. ........gps

[Abja Roots]

I've been in Oregon for the last year and a half. To try and keep it short prices have cratered from last year for the recreational market. There doesn't seem to be much demand for finished flowers in the market. At one point last year people were getting $1400-1600/lb. Right now indoor lbs are going for $800-$1200. Some people are getting higher tickets, but lots of them are sitting on hundreds of pounds. There are a lot of farms trying to sell their outdoor flowers at between $300-$500 simply to not go broke. I think prices will eventually stabilize, but it may take 2-3 years for that to happen. There are still lots of farms coming online in this next year, so I expect the market will continue to be flooded. I think that in a few years we'll see which of the small farms will survive, and which of the large ones as well.

I think there will be a lot of the 200-400 light indoors that will fold. When I see a company with 300 lights and 30+ full time employees, I struggle to see how those numbers add up. As far as the vertical integration it does take lots of capital. The cost of an extraction lab, edibles kitchen, retail storefront, and production facility can be daunting.

Someone who is a partner in one of the more outwardly successful operations said that it doesn't matter if it's light dep or greenhouse (without lighting). If it's not cookies, it's basically pre-run. Which means it will only be wanted for extraction.

A lot of people made bad business decisions and committed to models that will not work. Farming is about scale. There will always be some people who want small batch flowers, but that's a very small market and the first to disappear if the economy tanks. I met someone who sold their small farm and started a pre-roll company. He found he would make more money just buying low grade flower, turning it into pre-rolls, and slapping some branding on it.

I think we'll see lots more of that in the future.

[soil margin]

Originally Posted by Abja Roots

To try and keep it short prices have cratered from last year for the recreational market. There doesn't seem to be much demand for finished flowers in the market.

It's so ridiculous that government regulators can't see this is how black markets are created. Oregon can grow way more pot than it can use, can't export it legally. Farmers are eventually forced to break the law and ship out of state so they can feed their families and pay bills.

The attempt at segregation of cannabis markets by individual states is completely absurd and needs to be fixed quickly. The only motivation for it is greed/laziness/incompetence and it's only going to cause problems by preventing the establishment of free markets.

[Abja Roots]

Maybe this is exactly what they want. To bring all these people in, crater the market which will wipe most of them out, and then allow a few companies to monopolize large parts of the market. Easier to manage a few of these large companies than thousands of small ones.

They get their money either way, so I don't think it matters much to them. I think that the traditional black market/medical grower will be wiped out by this. I'd be surprised if 1/100 of them can make the transition to owning their own operation. Most will be lucky to find employment at $15-20/hr. Those will be the kind of positions where you can be easily replaced. Not a very bright future for most of those who can't see the writing on the wall.

[hamstring]

Abja Roots

Loved this bit of knowledge. I am in IL and flowers still sell but the eruption of pens is crazy. Very inexpensive.

They suck if you really enjoy the taste of weed. The flavor is so one dimensional in those things.

Isn't there a market out there for guys who smoke good pot? What about all those guys who grew up smoking good weed for the last 15years?
Are they really going to buy those very koolaid tasting pens? I know I wont.

Originally Posted by Abja Roots

I've been in Oregon for the last year and a half. To try and keep it short prices have cratered from last year for the recreational market. There doesn't seem to be much demand for finished flowers in the market. At one point last year people were getting $1400-1600/lb. Right now indoor lbs are going for $800-$1200. Some people are getting higher tickets, but lots of them are sitting on hundreds of pounds. There are a lot of farms trying to sell their outdoor flowers at between $300-$500 simply to not go broke. I think prices will eventually stabilize, but it may take 2-3 years for that to happen. There are still lots of farms coming online in this next year, so I expect the market will continue to be flooded. I think that in a few years we'll see which of the small farms will survive, and which of the large ones as well.

I think there will be a lot of the 200-400 light indoors that will fold. When I see a company with 300 lights and 30+ full time employees, I struggle to see how those numbers add up. As far as the vertical integration it does take lots of capital. The cost of an extraction lab, edibles kitchen, retail storefront, and production facility can be daunting.

Someone who is a partner in one of the more outwardly successful operations said that it doesn't matter if it's light dep or greenhouse (without lighting). If it's not cookies, it's basically pre-run. Which means it will only be wanted for extraction.

A lot of people made bad business decisions and committed to models that will not work. Farming is about scale. There will always be some people who want small batch flowers, but that's a very small market and the first to disappear if the economy tanks. I met someone who sold their small farm and started a pre-roll company. He found he would make more money just buying low grade flower, turning it into pre-rolls, and slapping some branding on it.

I think we'll see lots more of that in the future.

[CaptainDankness]

Basically we are all fucked. If money is the goal that is. Cannabis is not much different than tobacco, it might even yield more per acre of land.

Best we can do is overgrow the corporations and literally free the weed. I'm talking giving weed for free of course it won't be legal to do but since when do we care about the law?

Right now you can stack some cash in illegal states then invest in a legal business. But the days of making a profit on indoor growing is coming to an end, unless Jeff Sessions is able to crush the movement.

I'd definitely prefer federal legalization, but I thought ahead and run a legitimate business. Just like the gold rush came to an end so will the green rush. We can stop the corporations if we actually free the weed that's about it but free weed won't turn a profit.

[soil margin]

Originally Posted by CaptainDankness

Best we can do is overgrow the corporations and literally free the weed. I'm talking giving weed for free of course it won't be legal to do but since when do we care about the law?

I'm 100% with you on this. If corporations want to try and kill the industry for average people, we can kill the industry for corporations. I'll happily grow hundreds of pounds and give it away to strangers on the street if it comes to that.

[budchopper]

Originally Posted by soil margin

I'm 100% with you on this. If corporations want to try and kill the industry for average people, we can kill the industry for corporations. I'll happily grow hundreds of pounds and give it away to strangers on the street if it comes to that.

can I have the 1st hundred pounds?

[Gr33nSanta]

there will be a market for boutique weed, only we are gonna find out that not everybody has the best weed. Only the very best will survive the flower market since the majority of the population will endup smoking nothing but concentrates within a matter of a few years. Hard to think otherwise, concentrates are healthier, and not as <<stinky>> in public...