[Mr Blah]

If there is one thing that I learned from doing vertical, is to put hooks on the ceiling to hang the heavy ass branches of bud.
I usually hang after week three or end of stretch. If I don't I get bud hanging low on branches or broken branches at worst cases.

Wire mesh works great put on the ceiling and hang strings or yo yos to each branch.

Looking great!

[datal4b]

thanks for that tip man i actually will probably just try that instead cause trying to reach inside the plant to tie to the stake is a bitch!

[datal4b]

day 31

my sativa doms are lookin like they're definitely going to finish before the indicas which you would think would be opposite.

some leafs are starting to fade out to orange now.

600ppm 1/.67 jacks still rockin the place. haven't checked the pH in over 2 months

house is gettin pretty stinky now.

[Desert Hydro]

looking good in there. someday i'll be back on track lol

[datal4b]

been there man to be honest every grow i've done in the last 5 years has been lackluster as fuck at best... i can only attribute the success of this run to the ppk and also these temp & humidity settings has been probably a big factor too, i got these from djm's coco trees thread:

ALL veg - 85 f / 75% rh (day) ; 80f/ 70% (night) ; 800 ppms co2


week 1 - 85f/ 75% rh (day) ; 80 f/ 70% (night) ; 1000 ppms co2


week 2 - 85f/ 75% rh (day) ; 80 f/ 70% (night) ; 1000 ppms co2


week 3 - 85f/ 75% rh (day) ; 80 f/ 70% (night) ; 1000 ppms co2


week 4 - 82f/ 72% rh (day) ; 78f/ 68% (night) ; 1000 ppms co2


week 5 - 80f/ 70%rh (day) ; 75f / 65% (night) ; 1000 ppms c02


week 6 - 80f /70%rh (day) ; 75f / 65% (night) ; 1000 ppms co2


week 7 - 78f/68% rh (day) ; 72 f/ 62% (night) ; 1000 ppms co2


week 8 - 75f/ 65%rh (day) ; 70f/ 60% (night) ; 0 ppms co2


week 9 - 70f /60% rh (day) ; 60f/ 50% (night) ; 0 ppm c02

i'm usually within 5% on the daytime humidity and it seems to be ok still but not completely dialed. i'm tryin to think how to use a humidifier in this setup but space is really limited now with the tree style, thinking about maybe an evaporation style since centrifugal is out of the question now. idk

[datal4b]

i was reading some pretty info from a longtime greenhouse worker on here the other day if anyone wants to read it. good info about plant steering

Hi folks, just thought i would throw in my 2 cents worth. As a commercial greenhouse grower of 30 odd years, collecting, controlling and logging vpd and T.diff values is standard daily fare for me. The real value of this data is not in just setting and controlling it, but its ability to be used for what is known as plant steering. I have not seen this term used for cannabis cultivation but it is essentially what all production horticultural based environmental, rhizosphereic and plant cultural activities seek to achieve. VPD and Temp diff manipulation are simply two of many tools in the growers steering arsenal. Steering is undertaken either in a vegetative or generative direction dependent on cultivar, time of year, position in plant life cycle and many other variables. All designed to achieve maximal yield based on the genetic potential of the particular cultivar. Poor steering may significantly reduce yields and quality. Learning why and how to manipulate VPD and T.diff for yield and quality maximization is what we as growers are all seeking to achieve. I do it at work on a large scale and at home on a much much smaller scale. Hope this blurb is of value. Cheers and happy growing.


I notice growers deleaf their plants to achieve better light penetration. How about if i told you deleafing has more to to do with aggressive generative steering than it does direct light contact with the lower flowers! If you understand the terms assimilates and exudates, hort science and steering specifically becomes much easier to grasp. Deleafing redirects assimilates to apical meristems and floral growth and development. This is a big reason deleafing is effective. Photosynthetic mass must be adequate for vigour to continue but lower leaf removal is often just as effective as upper obstructive leaf removal in improving flower development. Generally speaking, leaf removal is generative and retention is vegetative. Narrow temp diff, lower Mean temp and lower vpd's at higher temps are also vegetative maneuvers. Lower EC, ...the list goes on. glad i could be of some value here. Hort is still my passion even after all these yrs, Cheers and happy growing.


Deleafing prior to photo-period change is another positive generative action. Provided the existing floral mass has sufficient photosynthetic surface to maintain vigour, upper leaf removal can also assist with assimilate targeting to flowers and thereby increasing bud development. Keep in mind however, that as plants approach senescence, nutrient sequestration from older foliage is also important for good floral development. The root system becomes inefficient as it ages and cant provide nutrients as effectively. Some foliage must be maintained as a store house for this translocation process. Maintaining a super healthy and vigorous root zone also assists. One of the few reasons hydro methods can better soil yield on a kg per square meter basis. Better root zone health into senescence.It all comes down to balancing plant culture to perfection. Definatly an experience learned skill. I think i have rambled on more than enough for one day...
Thankyou to those who have taken the time to read and reply. One day i hope to grow crops worth more than $2.00/Kg at the market... dream on in my country. Cheers and happy growing to all.


Great question dude. Lower VPD's generally are vegetive in their effects but with cannabis in the vegetative stage raising the overall temp whilst maintaining a lowish VPD will encourage improved vegetative development. If your variety has a tendency to remain too short particularly, this manouver may be of help. If you have a naturally stretchy cultivar, then lowering overall temp with a lower vpd will be of more benefit. Generally speaking, we steer vegetative varieties in generative direction and generative varieties in a vegetative direction. High VPD's and lower temps in floral completion have been implicated with better trichome development with some varieties. And then there is is all the implications of lower VPD's and fungal disease development, so its not as simple as do "X" and get "Y". There are cross overs and implications for everything. Start thinking assimilate sequestering based on whats warm and abundant on the plant. In the case of fruiting plants its the large ripening fruits, in cannabis its the heavy developing flowers. on vegetative plants its luxuriant green leaves. The more assimilates the plant part attracts, the greater its priority for growth and development. So, yes you should manipulate VPD based on the particular varieties needs and all the other growth factors - light, CO2, nutrient appetite etc. Balance is god, the growers mantra. Cheers.


Cheers Kowhitee, thanks for the shoutout. Mean Temp. is the just average temp of the grow space across the course of 24hrs. If you were to sample temp each hour and add these values together, then divide by 24, you would get your mean temp. Temp differential is the difference between maximum temp and minimum temp. in a 24hr period. For example, if max 85F during the day and min 55F at night = Tdiff of 30F. Wider temp diffs and overall higher means temps are generally considered a generative measure in the grow space once flowering/fruiting is underway. These measures encourage assimilates towards flowering and fruiting plant parts in preference to the foliage provided the flower/fruit load dominates plant balance. Used appropriately, a very vegetative, slow n short, lower yielding variety can be encouraged to improve flower development and plant structure. Used poorly, or with the wrong variety, and you will get stretch like a bitch and/or "exhausted" plants that don't reach their genetic flowering potential.
Creating greater temp diffs that increase the overall mean temp tends to accelerate assimilate production and stretch and potentially improve yield(think warmer day temps with nights staying same). Greater temp diffs that lower the mean temp can reduce assimilate production and slow development and reduce stretch(think colder night temps with days staying the same).
These changes are relative to the 'normal' temps that you would use for a particularly strain for example with light intensity, CO2, and feed manipulation used to assist the process.
All this is great provided you have the ability to change and completely control day and night time temps (active heating and cooling systems). For most of us at home, we see the effects of on our plants of our inabilty to control changing mean temp and Tdiff. In our effort to correct it, we may smash our VPD to shit. Commercially, hydronic heating and evaporative fogging and/or A/C cooling systems are the growers friend but are not cost viable for most us at home. One day...
Still, knowing about it and doing what we can do to control or manipulate it can be the difference between an average result or a great one particularly under difficult climate conditions.
Once again, i have been asked a simple question and turned it into a wall of text. This new OG pheno i have just sampled could possibly be to blame...makes me rave on just a tad.
Cheers and thanks.
PS. 102F max temp in my part of the world today! Misting, irrigating, shading and venting time! Yehaaa!


twisted - I posted my temp /rh schedule a few pages back..these are the parameters I prefer...some say I run my rooms too hot, but what people don't realize is high heat during a colas formation is one of the biggest factors in how big the flowers get...a flower formed in a 85 degree room will always be larger than one in the mid to high 70s...always...once I get the flower size and formation I want , only then do I drop temps to facilitate the ripening phase

[datal4b]

noticed my pump was dead today. probably been down a few days. only reason i noticed is because i was hanging branches for a while and didn't hear the trickling of the halos. plants seem to be unphased.... +1 to the tailpiece saves the day

[datal4b]

trimming begins tomorrow, all in all went decent for 1st time.

[Mr Blah]

Fricken right it did!!
First run...not to shabby

[datal4b]

it is taking a long time to trim, not a problem i've encountered yet ha, me & the gf have been going at it for a week now probably only have knocked out 1/4 of it so far. i have about 1.75 lbs right now

fat ass cola day of harvest


rootz