[kelly1376]

I had no idea about any of that timber drama I just like their kits. How do the Asian cobs compare to the american ones like Cree, Citizen, & Bridgelux as far as efficiency and output?

[Chilly Willy]

Kelly1376 - I am kinda liking my old set up all over again too! I noticed the price difference when trying to copy this idea with newer equipment. I probably could just buy the standard sockets for the bulbs and use hoods that are flexible, thus I could change the bend to allow a wider surface at the roof so I could still offset the two different bulbs and their sockets. being that the hoods are flexible at the wings, this would allow me to modify the spacing so that each hood is close enough to the other. If I put some thought into it, I could design this from the start where the spacing of all the bulbs are staggered above the canopy, thus still making the hoods line up in a single file line like seen in my old grow.

------ ------ ------
--o-----o----o

----o-----o-----o
------ ------ ------

The old hoods were 26 long by 22 wide, so the top line above measured to the bottom line above would be 26 inches. The tree lights covered an area of 4 feet by 9 feet canopy. The "o" above are light bulbs, starting at the top left they would be MH, HPS, MH; and line below would be HPS, MH, HPS.

Below is another idea, since my grow structure is narrower, and a little shorter, I can pack the plants in tighter than once before. Before I had 38 plants under 4 x 9, each container was 6" wide x 4 eagles 2 ft. which mean I had two feet of blank space in each of the four rows of plants, thus only using half of the tray covered in pots. I could make them somewhat closer, because even when grown you could see the space between the rows. If I turned the hoods sideways, and modified each hood where it would take three light bulbs not coming from each end, but all from the sides.

This would be two hoods the same size as above as to concentrate the light intensity, which is good. It offers the different spectrums of light closer to gather than the other example above. And has more plants to take advantage of the space. The space would be 28" x 72". What I could do is run the first two lights (first two "o" below) for six hours, and the 4th and 5th at this same period. Then after six hours the 2nd, and 3rd would come on along with the 5th, and 6th.

I might have to work on that configuration so all the lights on at one time are all the same spectrum but it is a framework to start from. I gives me the same amount of lights in the new set up as the old one, and almost as much plants. I had 38 plants before but was 20" wider, and 12" longer (but again I was wasting space somewhat before). How many pants do you think I could squeeze in here? I am excited about the larger amount if intensity per plant, and introducing Co2 is a better idea than ever. Running three 400 watt bulbs does very little to an electricity bill. Also running two different color lights, one coming on in the middle of the day really does not draw any attention. It was a very efficient system. maybe I should not try to reinvent the wheel, instead just get it rolling again. So what are you thoughts about grams per watt both before, and now with putting the plants in the new grow. Thanks for helping me out, making me a part of the forum all over again.
------
--o--MH
----o--HPS
--o--MH
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----o---HPS
--o----MH
----o---HPS
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[Chilly Willy]

I know at first it seams like I must be crazy to waste money for so many bulbs under such a small space, but it gives me more intensity. I am also getting a more diverse light; the idea worked before, I am just trying to max it out some compared to before. I am also thinking the more intense light I will get even more results from the same amount of Co2 that I was using. It will run cooler than before (which was 82) because I will be exchanging all the air in this whole place every so many minutes. Photosynthesis is helped with proper temps, light intensity, light spectrum, and the right levels of Co2. I would like to try to get close to the same amount of yield as before but with this smaller footprint. Do you think it will work?

Oh, this idea also makes the lights move, which will make the leaves and buds move as well as seen in heliotropism. I have stayed on topic!

[positivity]

Originally Posted by kelly1376

I had no idea about any of that timber drama I just like their kits. How do the Asian cobs compare to the american ones like Cree, Citizen, & Bridgelux as far as efficiency and output?

Well now you know then. I've had a personalized experience and they suck. My opinion of course

How do asian COBs compare? Oh...they are using the same COBs

Kinda like that old song..

Little boxes on the hillside,
Little boxes made of ticky tacky,
Little boxes on the hillside,
Little boxes all the same.
There's a green one and a pink one
And a blue one and a yellow one,
And they're all made out of ticky tacky
And they all look just the same.

The differences aren't as extreme as they used to be.

Your grow idea looks pretty good chilly willy. GPW might go down with the MH inclusion but you might enjoy the growing and smoking better. Only one way to find out for sure. I'm just going to chill on the side and enjoy the banter before I get in trouble..chilly posi...haha

[Chilly Willy]

positivity - The GPW given was using MH from my last grow, using only MH for six hours then the other six hours was only HPS. I know, it is surprising to have such yields with so little HPS. That is why I am doing it again, but this time with more light intensity, and more Co2. Did I mention Love, also with more love!

From what I have seen, the old HPS, and MH bulbs should do just fine! On a side note, I am kind of blown away with the pictures I have seen from other grows, you have these two feet long tree trunks with a canopy way at the top, and big bulbs yet the yield is the same of just doing more plants under lower watt bulbs. I think the long tree trunks pretty much tells the story what is wrong. It may be more work potting 38 containers instead of five, but I like it!

[kelly1376]

I kinda think for what you're looking to do it would be a lot easier to just go with 315 ceramic metal halide and alternate 3100k and 4200k Phillips bulbs in each light. Here is a handy sheet with the different spectrums:

https://www.cycloptics.com/sites/def...ion%20link.pdf

Standard metal halide is:

18.9% blue 22.7% green 58.4% yellow red and 26.5% IR

4100k CMH is:

13.2% blue 25.7% green 61.2% yellow red and 18.1% IR

3100K CMH is:

11.7% blue 19.4% green 69.1% yellow red and 21.7% IR

HPS is:
4.4% blue 6.0% green 89.7% yellow red and 56.6% IR

1:1 MH/HPS mix is:
10.6% blue 14.8% green 74.6% yellow red and 21.1% IR.

Additionally the CMH has a bit more overall intensity than the 400 MH despite less wattage.

So instead of 6 lights with 3 on and 3 off at any given time at ~1200 watts just throw 3 or 4 CMH phantoms or nanoluxes over it and alternate 3100k and 4100 k every other light. You'd be between 990 and 1320 watts and I bet you would easily surpass your previous bests. The bulb is oriented vertically in those reflectors which causes a more focused downward beam, you can raise the lights a bit and still get the intensity at the top you want. Sea of green definitely works well. I believe since you don't veg you could probably even pack a bit more in there, 1 plant every 6 inches.

Anyway, good discussion here. This wankering is a lot of fun. I'm really excited to see your setup once you do get rolling again.

[positivity]

Originally Posted by Chilly Willy

positivity - The GPW given was using MH from my last grow, using only MH for six hours then the other six hours was only HPS. I know, it is surprising to have such yields with so little HPS. That is why I am doing it again, but this time with more light intensity, and more Co2. Did I mention Love, also with more love!

From what I have seen, the old HPS, and MH bulbs should do just fine! On a side note, I am kind of blown away with the pictures I have seen from other grows, you have these two feet long tree trunks with a canopy way at the top, and big bulbs yet the yield is the same of just doing more plants under lower watt bulbs. I think the long tree trunks pretty much tells the story what is wrong. It may be more work potting 38 containers instead of five, but I like it!

Ok, thats right. That will be an interesting changeup. Love is definitely important also, someones gotta show the attention or she'll let you know. I don't have backup/stand in growers so if I get lazy shows over. 2' tree trunks..haha, lots of different techniques nowadays.

CMH could be good but its not the same spectrum as a halide and hps. I'd try a CMH one day in a corner and see how it does before switching everything out

[Chilly Willy]

You guys like the new tv show called "Snowfall"? I am downloading it now on pirate bay.

Here is a link to a search I just made, finally found the right key words where only spectral charts come up in the search instead of the pictures of fifteen million light bulbs.https://www.google.com/search?q=rela...toCTwQ_AUICigB

[Chilly Willy]

Kelly, I see you been getting info from university grows too! You got to check out the orchid forums too, great resource. That chart you sent me, very nice! Once again, you got me thinking harder. I am going to buy one hood and ballast this month just to get this ball rolling. Would you recommend the Sun System equipment? Back in 2006 they rocked! Do you like their CMH system? I think 315 is a good number for the width I have at 28 inches, and later I can gat another or two to fill in the length of 72 inches. You say every six inches, that is precisely how far I had the pots before. You could see space between the tools of plants, would it be okay to squeeze another row in there? If it is 28 wide, and I am using one light at first, how many plants can I do?

Hey, I was wondering something, you know what a bee hive looks like; they slide those screens into the box, or pull them out and you see all the honey. Could a person grow this way, sliding screens in vertically between the plants which are in pots. In other words, between the pots we just talked about has six inches of space, If I was to somehow figure out how to place the pot outside my grow area, and get the stem to travel in the grow area then onto the screen and up the screen. Can you picture what I am talking about. I have done some weird stuff using thick mechanics wire and tie straps and bent the plants over so their backs all have buds. I was just wondering how far i can manipulate this.

I know it is fun thinking differently, taking chances, applying what we have learned. You are a cool individual, are you a penguin too? hehehehe

Positivity, I really appreciate your support, I sold the old equipment and not rich anymore, so I got to climb back up slowly. The tree thing is better than the root thing, when I first studied this stuff I was into aeroponics then I figured out on my own that it sucks because you are growing two foot long roots in the feeding tubes. I want two foot long buds, but I would have to sell my car to buy just one bulb that would do that. hehehehe Glad you noticed the comment above about loving your plants, I absolutely enjoyed doing this before. In fact it in a sense saved my life, all the other people were dragging me down. The grow was in my bedroom just two feet from my pillow and when the lights came on with the timer, I woke up seeing this stuff. I was going to ask you if maybe you could give me a point on my reputation, anyone who talks like I just did deserves a green square. Just comment that you like the snowfall tv show, and I reminded you it is on tonight; that will be fine. Hey, I look forward hanging out, thanks for stopping by. Keep a watch on me though, I am growing not just plants but myself! hahaha

CW, what an awesome thread.

I love your meddling into heliotropism, and wonder how a dome, like a planetarium, would work. Not that it's necessary to simulate the sun passing over head, but I really think the low angle light and those frequencies also help to influence all sorts of hormonal and growth functions that we are really just scratching the surface of.

Imagine a dome with LED strips mounted all over the inside of it, the higher and lower frequencies concentrated more toward the lower areas. Not only could one dial up the red spectrum as the "summer" progresses and with even an arduino system to run it, the "sky" is the limit.
Not only would the plants all get the daily movements (Tai Chi LOL) they need, the spectrum of natural light is covered for ANY place on the globe if you want it. One could easily give an Acapulco Gold the exact latitude it wants to see!

I'm subscribing to this, as I've already learned and or remembered SO much just by perusing it. Nice work, sir.

Very nice.