Need DWC advice and tips

bionicchronic · Jan 22, 2017

hi i have been growing for 2 years and this
is my first go at hydro. i am looking for expert
advice and opinions. i am really scared of getting pythium and loosing this whole crop.

nutes:Gh 3 part ( switiching to lucas formula for flower)
size:18gal and 5gal
air pump:will attach specs photo
air stones: 5in round, 3 in tub and 1 in bucket
innoculant:great white
medium:hydroton and rockwhool ( some just rockwhool)
ppm 650-580
580
res change:every 10days
room temp 71night 75-78 day
water temp 68-75 (only 75 for short period)
strain: green crack x fruity pebbles og, gorilla bubble, insane jane og, double strawberry diesle x sd x og(clones from my own healthy moms.)

pics

mojave green · Jan 22, 2017

keep a good air gap between bottom of net pot and water level. in other words, keep only the bottom half of root mass submerged.

bionicchronic · Jan 22, 2017

mojave green said:
keep a good air gap between bottom of net pot and water level. in other words, keep only the bottom half of root mass submerged.

would you say my current gap is big enough?

mojave green · Jan 22, 2017

hard to tell from pic but looks pretty good

bionicchronic · Jan 24, 2017

i did a res change today noticed a strong lake or fish smell but ive always noticed tht since using great white. ppm is now at 900

mojave green · Jan 24, 2017

Bit too much nutes for my taste

bionicchronic · Jan 24, 2017

i plan on pushing this grow. i will stay at 900 for veg ill lower it if they burn.
for flower ill start at 900 and go up to 1100

PetFlora · Jan 24, 2017

I do not recommend DWC although I have used it in a pinch, and use it to start seedlings and clones

Raise your level to the bottom of the net pots

Lower ppm in early veg ~ 200ppm (I max ppm around 900 in flower)

The BIG problems arise during flower as waste materials are dumped through the root system. This causes ppms and pH to shoot up. Accessing the nutes is difficult as the top has to be raised DAILY to adjust. F & D is safer and better as roots benefit from semi-dry periods

Also, rez needs to be changed weekly from mid flower on. Easy to do with an outboard rez

See my Hail Hydro thread for lots of 411

View attachment 393762 View attachment 393763

Ganoderma · Jan 25, 2017

bionicchronic said:
hi i have been growing for 2 years and this
is my first go at hydro. i am looking for expert
advice and opinions. i am really scared of getting pythium and loosing this whole crop.

nutes:Gh 3 part ( switiching to lucas formula for flower)
size:18gal and 5gal
air pump:will attach specs photo
air stones: 5in round, 3 in tub and 1 in bucket
innoculant:great white
medium:hydroton and rockwhool ( some just rockwhool)
ppm 650-580
580
res change:every 10days
room temp 71night 75-78 day
water temp 68-75 (only 75 for short period)
strain: green crack x fruity pebbles og, gorilla bubble, insane jane og, double strawberry diesle x sd x og(clones from my own healthy moms.)

pics

I would raise the water level up to the bottom of the net pot and let the plants drink up the water to allow the water level to fall bellow the net pot. keeping the water level closer to the net pot stimulates more roots to grow from the net pot, where as letting the water stay lower causes the roots to grow longer mass straight downward. I change my air stones when I switch plants over to flowering, air stones start to plug up at some point and the reduction in air flow could led to some issue's. Also using beneficial bacteria in your res can help too.

From your pictures, everything looks to be looking okay.

bionicchronic · Jan 26, 2017

Ganoderma said:
I would raise the water level up to the bottom of the net pot and let the plants drink up the water to allow the water level to fall bellow the net pot. keeping the water level closer to the net pot stimulates more roots to grow from the net pot, where as letting the water stay lower causes the roots to grow longer mass straight downward. I change my air stones when I switch plants over to flowering, air stones start to plug up at some point and the reduction in air flow could led to some issue's. Also using beneficial bacteria in your res can help too.

From your pictures, everything looks to be looking okay.

thank you ill raise my water level i was wondering why my roots up close to my net pot looked that way. plants have been feeding like crazy :biggrin:

ppm is at 687 from 900 and p.h went way up. ill take fresh pics tomorrow.

thank you everyone for all the feedback. :tiphat:

growdc · Jan 26, 2017

bionicchronic said:
thank you ill raise my water level i was wondering why my roots up close to my net pot looked that way. plants have been feeding like crazy ppm is at 687 from 900 and p.h went way up. ill take fresh pics tomorrow.

thank you everyone for all the feedback.

Hey Bionicchronic,

I am also a beginner with Hydro, but unlike you, beginner in growing... period. First harvest went well, but 2nd one, I'm plagued with pythium.

This is what I understand about this pathogen after doing a ton of reading on the etiology of pythium.

I understand that pythium root rot starts out with this bacteria called cyanobacteria. It doesn't need light to thrive and is also pretty happy in colder waters with or without oxygen, they just multiply slower.

The first sign would be the sides of your dwc bucket that is not in the water, they start to leave this brown stuff from the splashing of the bubblers. Then this brown cyanobacteria eventually starts coating the roots and the roots start getting that white slime. Then when pythium sets in (apparently it's a pathogen, and you know there are pathogens everywhere unless you live in a sterilized box!), that's when the slime gets brown and the pythium starts feeding on the roots.

I know there are 2 schools of thoughts on DWC. Running sterile or running with beneficial bacteria.

I ran my first grow with every store bought bennies, cuz I just was dumb and didn't know better, but I think they saved me. I ran Tarantula, Voodoo Juice, Piranha, Mammoth P and Hydroguard.

But this time, those didn't do a things to stop the brown stuff. So, while I don't have pythium yet per say, it's starting. I've washed and sterilized everything 4 times already. Plants are not happy.

Someone on facebook suggested sterile, so I did. Just Grow A + Grow B + H2O2 innoculant. came back in 2 days. Cleaned and repeated 3 more times, and I figured, if this is a pathogen you can't even see, it's hard to know if I sterilized everything 100% hospital style.

So I started brewing some tea. It's not ready, but I will try cuz some people swear by it. They swear by it to get rid of root rot, but apparently, bennies don't really do much for DWC systems.

Correct me if I'm wrong anyone.

growdc · Jan 26, 2017

oh, and I forgot, a sure definite sign of cynobacteria as I understand it is like a super sharp pH drop like over night. I started out a fresh reservoir at 5.8 pH, the next day, it went to 4.7!! water never above 68 F. No light leaks etc..... If your pH drops crazy like that. Start doing something. Which I'm doing, however, I don't have sure results yet.

Loc Dog · Jan 26, 2017

I just started using Snypes RDWC. I have Aquashiled, SM-90, Great White, and others, plus avoid letting light get at water. Doing awesome at 5 days. Have used those in past with no problems, if water temps right, and no light exposure to stagnant water.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=267918

Douglas.Curtis · Jan 26, 2017

PetFlora said:
The BIG problems arise during flower as waste materials are dumped through the root system. This causes ppms and pH to shoot up.

Wow, so far off it's ridiculous. :laughing:

Please don't give advice on hydro setups you're unfamiliar with. "Waste materials" indeed. You simply don't know how to run DWC is all.

I've run DWC for 15 years and NEVER had ppm and pH "Shoot Up" for any reason. "Weird" pH changes come from using tap water, which is why I don't use it. I NEVER change out my res during flower and only use nutrients for pH changes. There isn't any magic, it's just the simple way "proper" hydro ends up. Proper hydro starts with R/O water and includes both a balanced nutrient profile (Lucas Formula is a great 'basic' to start with for any strain), and correct reservoir management (also explicitly outlined by Lucas for years). Without both of those together you'll have problems.

Fill your flowering res with water. Add nutrients, pH to 5.4 and let it run. The pH will slowly climb, as the plants eat the nutrients. When the pH reaches 5.8'ish, add nutrients back to the target ppm and (Oh gee, look at that) your pH is back at 5.4. How wonderful! Easiest/Laziest, way to produce smashing quality product. I spend very little time in my gardens messing with the reservoir.

@growdoc A sharp drop in pH means you have biological issues growing in the reservoir. Not necessarily cyano, definitely something growing though. DWC res temps should be above 65F and below 70F at all times. Anything else will cause slower growth and problems in the reservoir.

Hydro is ridiculously easy, when you learn it properly the first time. Hammering incorrect information out of your head is the difficult part. :tiphat:

PetFlora · Jan 27, 2017

Douglas.Curtis said:
Wow, so far off it's ridiculous. Please don't give advice on hydro setups you're unfamiliar with. "Waste materials" indeed. You simply don't know how to run DWC is all.

I've run DWC for 15 years and NEVER had ppm and pH "Shoot Up" for any reason. "Weird" pH changes come from using tap water, which is why I don't use it. I NEVER change out my res during flower and only use nutrients for pH changes. There isn't any magic, it's just the simple way "proper" hydro ends up. Proper hydro starts with R/O water and includes both a balanced nutrient profile (Lucas Formula is a great 'basic' to start with for any strain), and correct reservoir management (also explicitly outlined by Lucas for years). Without both of those together you'll have problems.

Fill your flowering res with water. Add nutrients, pH to 5.4 and let it run. The pH will slowly climb, as the plants eat the nutrients. When the pH reaches 5.8'ish, add nutrients back to the target ppm and (Oh gee, look at that) your pH is back at 5.4. How wonderful! Easiest/Laziest, way to produce smashing quality product. I spend very little time in my gardens messing with the reservoir.

@growdoc A sharp drop in pH means you have biological issues growing in the reservoir. Not necessarily cyano, definitely something growing though. DWC res temps should be above 65F and below 70F at all times. Anything else will cause slower growth and problems in the reservoir.

Hydro is ridiculously easy, when you learn it properly the first time. Hammering incorrect information out of your head is the difficult part.

Sounds like you are confusing DWC with RDWC which uses an OUTBOARD rez

Douglas.Curtis · Jan 27, 2017

PetFlora said:
Sounds like you are confusing DWC with RDWC which uses an OUTBOARD rez

You should try maximizing your browser window to see better. The majority here have no trouble reading regular sized print.

As far as the plant is concerned, DWC and RDWC are exactly the same and should be treated as such. My advice is for "Roots-In" hydroponics, because that's the style the OP is using. Had they been using a medium based grow, with intermittent feed, the advice would have been for those types of hydro setups. (Which is completely different from roots-in)

I know exactly what I'm posting. Thanks. :tiphat:

PetFlora · Jan 28, 2017

I recommend investigating High Pressure Aeroponics D2W. I used it for a couple years. Alas, the humidity and heat here are not conducive during 7 months of each year in my grow room environment

But in a properly controlled environment it produces the most nutrient hungry root systems= massive plant and bud development. I took what I learned from it to tweak F & D.

:tiphat:

bionicchronic · Jan 28, 2017

hey guys sorry i havent been able to post new pics. ill get some up today.
i have some kind of brown sediment gritty looking stuff on my roots. its the same color as the great white im using. could it be from that? my res isnt fully 100% lightproof but there isnt any slime. water temps are low too upper 50's to low 60's. i also noted some broken roots floating around. which could be from me pouring water on the roots to help wash off this brown shit. (yeah it washes off (mostly)) also ph is still going up so its not likley that the roots are being attacked right?

Douglas.Curtis · Jan 28, 2017

Below 65F rez temps will give you nutrient issues.
No idea on the great white, never used it. It does sound like you're still doing fine, as long as the numbers stay stable.

Loc Dog · Jan 28, 2017

Douglas.Curtis said:
Below 65F rez temps will give you nutrient issues.
No idea on the great white, never used it. It does sound like you're still doing fine, as long as the numbers stay stable.

Below 66F, plants think winter is coming, above 72F, dissolved oxygen drops off rapidly.

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