[Emeraldo]

Originally Posted by Satyros

Hrm well that is pretty mindblowing to me that *any* plant would have a good harvest after four weeks from first pistils. Was there anything that prompted you to chop, other than 50% milky? What made the first Maroc take longer?

...The first Sexbud flowers are rounding out more, to the point where they look like tufts of white clover. On that note, it could be said to flower faster, or at least build mass quicker, than some sativas.

Orient Express just has two landrace parents, and in that situation, they make something like 80% of the standard hybrid, with 20% resembling one or the other parent, and they are not all that different besides structure & size. As you know, Sexbud is quite more complex than that, and it is fairly new. Which kind of leaves it as a guessing game as to the % of standards versus how many might show autoflower, or resemble White Widow or anything else from its diverse background...

Well, mind-blowing or not, it is what happened. You too Paulie. I'll say it again (and you can see it in my photos which prove it): Pistils first visible on Aug 1 and finished by end of August. All four FS plants with "early flowering" genetics finished by the end of August.

In each case greater than 50% trichomes were milky, and I chopped, sometimes over two different days to let some buds get even riper. The first Purple Maroc flowered in a frenzy but did not have much odor, only a faint diesel. I sampled partly cured weed today: and uplifting, long-lasting, clear headed high.

The first Sexbud flowered steadily through August and had pineapple odor which got stronger toward the end. Chopped her over two days. The second PM had stronger odor, very strong and sweet. Finally I let the second Sexbud go as long as I could, she was heavy and smelled strongly of grapefruit.

I cannot explain any of it. But it all makes sense if, at the very least, I can add 2-3 weeks into "flowering time" that preceded the first pistils. Then I would have about 7 weeks in each case. However, that alone may not explain it. I wonder if FS has something to say here about the autoflower cross that they say affects these two strains.

Mr. Bean, where aaaaare yoooouuu?

The weed (so far) is good and I am satisfied. Yes, the Sexbud buds you describe are what I saw as well: roundish daisy-like buds surrounded by small leaves. The buds themselves are not large, oval-shaped. Will let you know what the results of sampling will be. Am about a week into curing the first SB.

[Satyros]

Somehow I picked up the idea that White Grapefruit is Grapefruit x White Widow, but that's not true. Female Seeds described Grapefruit's origin and characteristics here:

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?threadid=59047

Where they use the phrase, "starts flowering from the inside". They were not trying to make an autoflower that would bloom in the spring (which I interpret as 60 days from seed, if planted early), but to make a late-flowering sativa bloom in early summer--which seems to work if planted early, but, obviously not if you plant in summer.

[Emeraldo]

Originally Posted by Satyros

Somehow I picked up the idea that White Grapefruit is Grapefruit x White Widow, but that's not true. Female Seeds described Grapefruit's origin and characteristics here:

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?threadid=59047

Where they use the phrase, "starts flowering from the inside". They were not trying to make an autoflower that would bloom in the spring (which I interpret as 60 days from seed, if planted early), but to make a late-flowering sativa bloom in early summer--which seems to work if planted early, but, obviously not if you plant in summer.

Sat, thanks for that. I looked into your link and found the discussion where Bean talks about how the FS "semi-auto-flowering" strains start the flowering phase by flowering "from the inside." Bean is talking about Grapefruit there. But maybe this could explain what I observed with Sexbud, namely, that Sexbud starts "flowering" before you can see any pistils. Bean seems to be describing how Sexbud flowers, too. This is starting to come together for me.

So does Female Seeds include Sexbud in what they call "semi-auto-flowering" strains? Sexbud's genetics are said to be C99 x White Grapefruit. But parts of the Grapefruit genetics discussion doesn't quite fit with what Female Seeds says on their website about Sexbud.

Just so everyone who reads this can see what we are talking about, here is the relevant response in the discussion about Grapefruit genetics. Mr. Bean was able to respond directly to only one of 4 questions (while awaiting info from breeder Ferry on the other questions):

Hey Sante,

No probs. I won't reply to all questions since I am still waiting for a message from Ferry, Female Seeds' breeder and founder. Anyhow I can give you an answer to 1 of the 4 points you wrote.

3) All our semi-auto strains were developed before the automatic era. We started breeding automatic lines with our early-flowering lines in the beginning of the 90's.

We were after plants that not started flowering in spring, but started flowering very early in Summer. Plants first mature, then go into flower. So we went after the late maturing ones.. We sold the very early maturing ones as " early Misty " seeds, nowadays called "automatics". In those days we were not interested in them, because of the bad smoking qualities, like the first "low riders", that came to the market at the end of the 90's...

So our semi-automatic plants are late maturing (around 10 weeks), so they cannot flower in the spring, when they mature. The autoflowering gene kicks in, the plants start flowering from inside out, a few weeks later the plant starts to react on the shorter day length, and because the autoflowering gene induced the flowering, it starts to flower faster and heavier, with an early finish.

Since many breeders or seed banks will surely tell you this is not true and that is partially wrong, please take it with a pinch of salt.
Here we share our ideas and opinions about our job, it does not always mean that is absolute truth.

As soon as I receive a reply from the breeder I will post it here.

Hope I gave you an idea of what you were asking.

All the best,
Mr B.

I think the passage you quoted (which I put in boldface) may be the answer to my question, if what Bean said there applies to Sexbud. Grapefruit, from what was said there, matures at 10 weeks of veg and promptly goes into flowering. Sexbud, which is a C99 crossed with White Grapefruit, might have similar "early flowering" genetics, right? But on their website, Female Seeds says the following about Sexbud: "this cannabis strain flowers early, without waiting for the shorter days... it matures in 4 weeks from seed, but we promise that is the only thing that will be done faster than expected!" FS also mentions Sexbud can finish after 75 days from seed.

So now I want to know, Mr. Bean, can that info in the Grapefruit genetics discussion, specifically the 10-weeks for the plants to mature, also apply -- to some extent -- to Sexbud? Is that possible from your breeder's perspective?

In my grow, 2 Sexbuds and 2 Purple Marocs were germinated April 28. They then vegged outdoors during all of May and June and into July. So if my plants had vegged about 10 weeks when they started flowering, that would be early to mid-July, which seemed to be what happened. Only thing is, they were "flowering from the inside" (invisibly) at first, so, in MOST cases, pistils became visible only later, about the end of July. The Grapefruit genetics discussion seems to explain what I've seen with both Sexbud and Purple Maroc.

I think we still need to allow for variations between specific plants, so, while one particularly vigorous Purple Maroc showed pistils on July 8 (it must've been flowering from the inside very soon after the June 21 summer solstice) and one Sexbud showed pistils on July 27, the two others (less vigorous plants) took a bit longer and kicked into inside flowering in early to mid-July, showed pistils around the end of July, and finished by end of August.

Makes sense, right? Well, no. Am confused. Awaiting the word... Mr. Bean? Are you there?

[Female Seeds]

Hey guys, sorry for the late reply but is getting busy here in our office. To be honest I enjoyed your conversation, you both pointed out important features of our strain. And to be honest there was so much to read that I really needed some time to reply in a proper way!

Anyway let's start from the beginning.

Some of Female Seeds genetics are based on some small percentages of Autoflowering strain an example are our C99, Sexbud and Purple Maroc, Easy Sativa and Maroc.
The questions comes by it self...then why did we cross our strains with some tiny amount of Autoflowering strain?
We started breeding automatic lines with our early-flowering lines in the beginning of the 90's and we wanted to obtain strains that could flower very early in Summer. The autoflowering gene kicks in, the plants start flowering from inside out, a few weeks later the plant starts to react on the shorter day length, and because the autoflowering gene induced the flowering, it starts to flower faster and heavier, with an early finish.
(You may already read this in the other thread)

The consequence of this action is that some phenos of these varieties are a bit more photo sensible, meaning that some sudden change of light, even the slightest change can somehow trigger the plant and make her flower. Many people don't realise this and think that the plants will start flowering by itself but actually there are always small details that we don't notice but the plant does that influence the beginning of the flowering period.
Called them recessive auto flowering stuff, called them semi-automatic or called them whatever you want but the point is that in their origins they were indeed bred and crossed with a few Autolflowerings traits but only to make things faster not to produce Autoflowering strains.

Originally Posted by Satyros

Ah, yeah. If there is some recessive autoflowering stuff in there, it could still affect a minority of plants.

Comparing my larger Sexbud to straight sativa types, its leaves are a degree not quite as thin, and its growth was a degree not as fast, but its pretty close, would have to be "sativa dominant" in my understanding.

The younger one did not turn out to be the first flowering of round 2 of plants, so I topped it. The bigger one is gaining more pistils. It has four tops and four nice branches, but at this point, wouldn't expect it to branch more, and even with some stretch, the smaller will probably remain smaller.

Originally Posted by Emeraldo

Sat, thanks for that. I looked into your link and found the discussion where Bean talks about how the FS "semi-auto-flowering" strains start the flowering phase by flowering "from the inside." Bean is talking about Grapefruit there. But maybe this could explain what I observed with Sexbud, namely, that Sexbud starts "flowering" before you can see any pistils. Bean seems to be describing how Sexbud flowers, too. This is starting to come together for me.

So does Female Seeds include Sexbud in what they call "semi-auto-flowering" strains? Sexbud's genetics are said to be C99 x White Grapefruit. But parts of the Grapefruit genetics discussion doesn't quite fit with what Female Seeds says on their website about Sexbud.

Just so everyone who reads this can see what we are talking about, here is the relevant response in the discussion about Grapefruit genetics. Mr. Bean was able to respond directly to only one of 4 questions (while awaiting info from breeder Ferry on the other questions):



I think the passage you quoted (which I put in boldface) may be the answer to my question, if what Bean said there applies to Sexbud. Grapefruit, from what was said there, matures at 10 weeks of veg and promptly goes into flowering. Sexbud, which is a C99 crossed with White Grapefruit, might have similar "early flowering" genetics, right? But on their website, Female Seeds says the following about Sexbud: "this cannabis strain flowers early, without waiting for the shorter days... it matures in 4 weeks from seed, but we promise that is the only thing that will be done faster than expected!" FS also mentions Sexbud can finish after 75 days from seed.

So now I want to know, Mr. Bean, can that info in the Grapefruit genetics discussion, specifically the 10-weeks for the plants to mature, also apply -- to some extent -- to Sexbud? Is that possible from your breeder's perspective?

In my grow, 2 Sexbuds and 2 Purple Marocs were germinated April 28. They then vegged outdoors during all of May and June and into July. So if my plants had vegged about 10 weeks when they started flowering, that would be early to mid-July, which seemed to be what happened. Only thing is, they were "flowering from the inside" (invisibly) at first, so, in MOST cases, pistils became visible only later, about the end of July. The Grapefruit genetics discussion seems to explain what I've seen with both Sexbud and Purple Maroc.

I think we still need to allow for variations between specific plants, so, while one particularly vigorous Purple Maroc showed pistils on July 8 (it must've been flowering from the inside very soon after the June 21 summer solstice) and one Sexbud showed pistils on July 27, the two others (less vigorous plants) took a bit longer and kicked into inside flowering in early to mid-July, showed pistils around the end of July, and finished by end of August.

Makes sense, right? Well, no. Am confused. Awaiting the word... Mr. Bean? Are you there?

I remember that I did reply to all the points of the questions they asked but I will re post it here so that it stays clear to everybody.

1) The Grapefruit was created years ago, approximately 10 years ago. And yes, at the time it was created by taking a C99 phenotype with a strong Grapefruit smell and crossing it with a fast flowering sativa plant. It's not an autoflowering plant, (which is always an indica), but a fast flowering (under low light conditions) sativa plant. At the time that was named semi-autoflowering, but that turned out to be confusing and misleading.
Since then the Grapefruit has been developed on by selecting the best phenotypes. The C99 hasn't been involved ever since. They are now just two separate strains

2) Female and feminised seeds refers to the process used to create female seeds. This is also something from over 10 years ago, when there were two main methods. The feminising way was less reliable and could cause some hermaphrodite problems. While the second process was more reliable and the seeds coming from that were named female. But this is all old school stuff. These days the processes have been perfected and all seeds are pretty reliable. It's also down to selecting the correct plants to use in the process

3) Semi autoflowering refers to fast flowering sativas who also bloom under low light conditions. 12/12 is recommended. But the term is old school

4) The current Grapefruit is derived from the initial batch from 2007. Only over the years the best phenotypes were selected and used for breeding.

Sexbud is not a stretchy variety, don't expect wild growth or weird things, it mostly goes smooth with no problem until the end.
It starts slow and step by step increase smell, taste and frostiness too.

So yes, Sexbud is included in these "semi-auto flowering" strains. This explains how and why it can finish flowering stage in 7-8 weeks.

Last but not least, we are revisiting all the descriptions of our websites since there are few contradictory elements that people mostly misunderstand.

Forgive me if did not reply to all questions but the problem I got a bit lost in the whole conversation

And as always, just feel free to ask. I will try to reply as soon as possible,

All the best,
Mr B.

[Emeraldo]

Originally Posted by Female Seeds

... So yes, Sexbud is included in these "semi-auto flowering" strains. This explains how and why it can finish flowering stage in 7-8 weeks.

Last but not least, we are revisiting all the descriptions of our websites since there are few contradictory elements that people mostly misunderstand.

Forgive me if did not reply to all questions but the problem I got a bit lost in the whole conversation

And as always, just feel free to ask. I will try to reply as soon as possible,

All the best,
Mr B.

Hey Bean thanks for that! I understand it was a real deeeep conversation between two growers of Sexbud who were amazed at the way this plant grows and flowers and finishes. I understand from what you say in your reply of today that with Sexbud 1) the auto-gene kicks in when the plant is mature, and then 2) with the shortening of the day length, it flowers faster and faster. That is what happened in my grow, as far as I know.

So to make my question more to the point: Does Sexbud, like Grapefruit (as you said in that earlier thread), mature in 10 weeks and then go into flowering, sort of, auto-matically? Or is Sexbud (as stated on the Female Seeds website) mature in only 4 weeks? It can't be both.

My personal experience this year would lead me to believe it is the former. But I am confused by some of the info that is out there, but am very happy with the result. I tried Sexbud "for the first time ever" today and got high, then got very busy cleaning house and started several projects in the garden that I had been putting off. Makes you want to get out and be active!

[Satyros]

Originally Posted by Emeraldo

So to make my question more to the point: Does Sexbud, like Grapefruit (as you said in that earlier thread), mature in 10 weeks and then go into flowering, sort of, auto-matically? Or is Sexbud (as stated on the Female Seeds website) mature in only 4 weeks? It can't be both.

I'd go with, it is mature in 30-40 days, and then it is waiting around sensitive to light changes, which will trigger flowering.

So Sexbud is filling the niche, how can I grow a sativa without it getting really huge and taking a long time?

On my run, this was answered three ways. Mekong High does nothing, if grown for a full season, it would be two meters tall and take forever. I prevented that by planting late.

Orient Express reduces the size of the plant, but doesn't do anything to affect the flowering cycle. That didn't matter because I planted late.

Sexbud, by being...sensitive to light changes...speeds up the whole process, and keeps it on the smaller side, because, no matter when you plant, it's going to flower soon, without stretching a whole lot. So I didn't gain the advantage it provides, but it worked about the same by being planted late. On the other hand, to get a two meters, kilo of harvest kind of plant, this will never do it.

And yeah...with further inquiry, seeing as how Grapefruit is ten years old and pretty stable, I can't really say my Sexbud #2 is some type of variation. I think it must have gotten mixed up with something else and it's just the wrong thing, so I only have one--but nice to hear it's an energetic buzz!

[PaulieWaulie]

I think its hard to put an exact number of weeks to outdoor flowering due to photo periods and temps. Indoors its more controlled. Im on week 8 and she looks done. I let her go 9 weeks usually, but people actually said that it makes them fall asleep so 9 might be too long, which was surprising because she is very sativa. will post chop pics.

[Emeraldo]

Originally Posted by Satyros

I'd go with, it is mature in 30-40 days, and then it is waiting around sensitive to light changes, which will trigger flowering.

So Sexbud is filling the niche, how can I grow a sativa without it getting really huge and taking a long time?

On my run, this was answered three ways. Mekong High does nothing, if grown for a full season, it would be two meters tall and take forever. I prevented that by planting late.

Orient Express reduces the size of the plant, but doesn't do anything to affect the flowering cycle. That didn't matter because I planted late.

Sexbud, by being...sensitive to light changes...speeds up the whole process, and keeps it on the smaller side, because, no matter when you plant, it's going to flower soon, without stretching a whole lot. So I didn't gain the advantage it provides, but it worked about the same by being planted late. On the other hand, to get a two meters, kilo of harvest kind of plant, this will never do it.

...

So in my grow, I did the opposite of you, Sat. I planted end of April, which was "early". The plants matured by the end of May, and then they continued to veg along until -- hey! -- they suddenly noticed that the days were getting shorter in mid-July. That triggered flowering, and they finished by end of August.

Planting mid-May might have produced the same result, only with plants that would not have had all that veg time I gave them. Which actually was a good thing, in the end, they had time to fully develop.

I think I read something by Female Seeds, maybe it was Mr. Bud here or on their or someone else's website, the whole quest with C99, Sexbud, Grapefruit, etc., has been to do exactly what you said: breed a sativa-dom plant that can be grown conveniently in the european summer.

Now am enjoying the buds. The Sexbud buds are nuggets, hard, button-like things. Smoked well and made me very high.

So you going to let your other strains ripen into the winter?

[Emeraldo]

Originally Posted by PaulieWaulie

I think its hard to put an exact number of weeks to outdoor flowering due to photo periods and temps. Indoors its more controlled. Im on week 8 and she looks done. I let her go 9 weeks usually, but people actually said that it makes them fall asleep so 9 might be too long, which was surprising because she is very sativa. will post chop pics.

Hi Paulie. I agree, hard to figure what goes on in the ourdoor grow. Day length is going to trigger flowering at some point, hard to tell when. Maybe if I grow this strain again next year I will know what to look for. It's all a learning process, learning to understand how the plants grow and ripen.

Yours is indoors, did I get that right? You're already past week 7 and into week 8. Well that's pretty fast for an indoor sativa grow, I guess. Usually they are said to take longer than that, no?

Sexbud's psychoactive effect surprises me: 1) high energy head high, made me want to get stuff done, and 2) definitely reduces inhibitions with me, maybe will improve my sex life!

[Female Seeds]

Originally Posted by Emeraldo

Hey Bean thanks for that! I understand it was a real deeeep conversation between two growers of Sexbud who were amazed at the way this plant grows and flowers and finishes. I understand from what you say in your reply of today that with Sexbud 1) the auto-gene kicks in when the plant is mature, and then 2) with the shortening of the day length, it flowers faster and faster. That is what happened in my grow, as far as I know.

So to make my question more to the point: Does Sexbud, like Grapefruit (as you said in that earlier thread), mature in 10 weeks and then go into flowering, sort of, auto-matically? Or is Sexbud (as stated on the Female Seeds website) mature in only 4 weeks? It can't be both.

My personal experience this year would lead me to believe it is the former. But I am confused by some of the info that is out there, but am very happy with the result. I tried Sexbud "for the first time ever" today and got high, then got very busy cleaning house and started several projects in the garden that I had been putting off. Makes you want to get out and be active!

I am really glad to read such passionate and positive experiences, it always makes us really proud as you can understand.
Yes, you understood quite well how Sexbud behaves. But maturing means to us, after germination and if you switch to 12/12 after just one week. Grapefruit then can be ready in 8-9 weeks, Sexbud in 7-8 weeks. If maturing for you means only flowering stage then 10 weeks that's more or less ok for the Grapefruit even if officially it takes 8-9 weeks for flowering.
As mentioned before, our website descriptions are being controlled and checked again since many people get confused and misunderstandings are becoming a normal result.

Originally Posted by PaulieWaulie

I think its hard to put an exact number of weeks to outdoor flowering due to photo periods and temps. Indoors its more controlled. Im on week 8 and she looks done. I let her go 9 weeks usually, but people actually said that it makes them fall asleep so 9 might be too long, which was surprising because she is very sativa. will post chop pics.

Yes, that's exactly the truth. When growing outdoor there are always many variables but still, the validity of the genetics makes the plant stable both for indoor and outdoor even if the last one is a bit more tricky, nothing else than that.

8 weeks? That's actually perfect. It may sounds strange to you guys, but yeah, all this is thanks to the famous auto-genes inside the Sexbud. Fast flowering indeed isn't it?