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Ideal Soil Mineral Composition

102

New member
Hi All,

New guy here. I have been lurking the forum for a bit trying to establish some things about optimum soil composition, in terms of minerals. I will be taking on my first grow (outdoor) in the new year, up North here at about 43 N. There is some great info and some awesome posters here, so thanks very much.

Although it will be the first time I'm growing on my own, I've been working a lot with some friends who have been growing for a very long time and I've learned an immense amount from them.

The one thing they don't do, however, is grow organically. I'm very interested in developing my own soil and think I've got the foundations down based on some of the posts here.

What I would like, however, is some type of resource which could tell me the optimum mineral ratios in the "perfect" soil. Obviously this is highly contextual and based on the geographic location and a host of other environmental factors. But perhaps a guidepost, just something of an aggregate of a prototypical soil which prescribes things along the lines of "You want sulfur at a 1:10 ratio with "X" minerals."

If anybody has any insights of their own, any resources, or what ratios are the biggest priorities, I'd really appreciate any and all input. Thank you. (Apologies for length)
 

xmobotx

ecks moe baw teeks
ICMag Donor
Veteran
the albrecht research is all about mineral balancing similarly, steve solomon addresses it

there's quite a bit of discussion here about remineralization

there's a lot of disagreement about how necessary it is; thinking ranging from 'apply some trace product is good enough' through, 'diversity of mineral amendments' to the balancing theories ~because much research has found the ratios aren't critical
 

102

New member
X,

Thanks for your response. Being that this will be my first solely operated grow, I will be keeping things slow and simple, and just using a tried and true soil mix developed my posters here.

My question was mostly for academic purposes with an eye toward improving my methods in the future. I will look into the Albrecht material.
 

102

New member
Albrecht's research is very interesting, but nevertheless, as you pointed out above, it does seem that the latest research shows no significant benefit to crop quality or yield using the BCSR method.

Rather, they showed that so long as calcium is the dominant cation - and also more abundant than magnesium - that the other cations levels can swing by quite a bit in terms of % of overall CEC, and there is no effect on yield.

It seems all we really need to focus on are some very simple, and easy to achieve cation ratios, and just keeping mineral levels sufficient (not in excess) and we are fine.
 
C

ct guy2

Albrecht's research is very interesting, but nevertheless, as you pointed out above, it does seem that the latest research shows no significant benefit to crop quality or yield using the BCSR method.

Rather, they showed that so long as calcium is the dominant cation - and also more abundant than magnesium - that the other cations levels can swing by quite a bit in terms of % of overall CEC, and there is no effect on yield.

It seems all we really need to focus on are some very simple, and easy to achieve cation ratios, and just keeping mineral levels sufficient (not in excess) and we are fine.

Well stated. If you choose to learn more about "mineral balancing" it would be wise to keep this above statement in mind. That being said, "The Intelligent Gardener" by Steve Solomon would give you a clear, easy to use guideline.
 

102

New member
http://vegaculture.blogspot.com/2011/12/michael-asteras-soil-recipe.html

^ Link to an article by Astera (thank you for the mention Stayfoolish). It obviously doesn't contain the full contents of the book, but he does lay out his exact prescriptions for soil mineral content. He apparently follows the BCSR method.

What's interesting is he also presents Reams values for ideal soil mineral content in lbs/acre. They approach the Albrecht values.

The research seems to show that yield is significantly effected by these recommendations but I'm left wondering if there is anything to show (either actual research or anybody's personal tests) where the BCSR/Astera prescriptions increase brix reliably.

We know that brix as a percent by mass of dissolved solids in plant sap is a general measure of nutrient density, and that higher brix tends to correlate with better plants: whether that be taste or overall vigor and resistance to disease. But at the same time, we'd then expect brix to also correlate with yield, so given that the BCSR method doesn't dramatically improve yield, we wouldn't reasonably expect to see huge improvement in brix from this either.

It would be awesome to see a "looser" organic grow with one of the recipes here (stressing a diverse and active microflora in the soil) put up against a BCSR-focused organic grow, in a brix test.
 

dank.frank

ef.yu.se.ka.e.em
ICMag Donor
Veteran
The question to me is not about increasing yeild as a guage of a "quailty" or "successful" garden...

To me...trichome field density - resin production - is the measure by which I want to quantify things...not yield.

There are all kinds of way to make plants yield more - but in doing so you make other sacrifices...that's why in my opinion, if yield is what you seek - it is better to pursue that through genetics - not through soil "improvements".

That isn't to suggest that a properly balanced and bacterially active soil doesn't by default yield more, because it does - but I think people choose soil to achieve a higher quality end product first and foremost...

Just some passing thoughts...



dank.Frank
 

102

New member
rik78, thanks for the link sir.

dankfrank, very good point you make there. To your knowledge does the degree brix correspond to increase trichome density? That would be interestng to know. Intuitively I'd think so, but I'm not sure. Thanks for the insight though, and for the PM'd info. I tried to respond but I can't send PM's. I'm not sure if its because I don't have enough posts yet or what.
 
C

ct guy2

I'm pretty sure MM and Spurr have posted research showing that brix is not a reliable indicator of plant health like many people have been claiming lately on here.
 

dank.frank

ef.yu.se.ka.e.em
ICMag Donor
Veteran
Brix has NEVER been a proven science in any way shape or form - a quick read of any scholarly articles discussing it always discuss it in theory and from a "yet to fully understand the correlation" type presentation...



dank.Frank
 

102

New member
Thank you for the link.

I have a bad habit of getting caught up in minutia and planning instead of just doing it. Right now I'm planning on using Tom's soil mix and seeing where I get. I like that its calcium-heavy. Coot's looks interesting though.
 
Thank you for the link.

I have a bad habit of getting caught up in minutia and planning instead of just doing it. Right now I'm planning on using Tom's soil mix and seeing where I get. I like that its calcium-heavy. Coot's looks interesting though.

Always good to go into something new armed with knowledge!

Good luck into your adventures with organics, It'll be a worth while experience I'm sure..SW
 

slownickel

Active member
ICMag Donor
Veteran
For what it is worth, the Ideal Soil was a terrible book. Lots of guessing and lots of plagiarism. Given his limited understanding, Astera started making best guesses based on pure fantasy and too many drugs. (Too much cocaine and alcohol.) Astera recently passed a couple of weeks ago. RIP
 
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