[vapeman24]

Hello all. I have searched but did not find what I was looking for.

I am wondering if any of you know if there is a correlation between the amount a strain yields (BHO) and it's individual THC/CBN/CBD contents? For instance, will a strain that has a total THC content of 25%, yield you 25%?

I have never tested a strain for THC levels before running it, so I would appreciate anyone's input if they have any theory's or experience.

[trichrider]

not in my world.
doubtful you could recover 100% of the cannabinoids regardless the solvent.

test then test after, is the only way to determine imo.

[vapeman24]

Originally Posted by trichrider

not in my world.
doubtful you could recover 100% of the cannabinoids regardless the solvent.

test then test after, is the only way to determine imo.

Yes, I know extraction of 100% of the material is not going to happen unless you did multiple washes, even then I am not sure.

I am just wondering, even given the material is not extracted 100%, is there a correlation between the percentage of THC/CBN/CBD in the starting material and the resulting BHO. For instance, my highest yielding strain to date was Banana Kush at 28% using a single pass-through system. Could one say that the Banana Kush strain had at least 28% total THC?

The reason I am asking this is because I have some serious intentions of eventually growing my own strains. I would love to be able to have a potent strain that also has great yields. If I could find a correlation between the THC/CBN/CBD contents of the starting material and it's resulting BHO, I would be able to much more easily decide what strains would be best for me to grow.

EDIT: And yes, I know testing is the only way to know. I just thought it might be better to ask a simple question than to shell out hundreds of dollars and wait weeks to find the answer to a question that has already been answered.

[Gray Wolf]

Originally Posted by vapeman24

Yes, I know extraction of 100% of the material is not going to happen unless you did multiple washes, even then I am not sure.

I am just wondering, even given the material is not extracted 100%, is there a correlation between the percentage of THC/CBN/CBD in the starting material and the resulting BHO. For instance, my highest yielding strain to date was Banana Kush at 28% using a single pass-through system. Could one say that the Banana Kush strain had at least 28% total THC?

The reason I am asking this is because I have some serious intentions of eventually growing my own strains. I would love to be able to have a potent strain that also has great yields. If I could find a correlation between the THC/CBN/CBD contents of the starting material and it's resulting BHO, I would be able to much more easily decide what strains would be best for me to grow.

EDIT: And yes, I know testing is the only way to know. I just thought it might be better to ask a simple question than to shell out hundreds of dollars and wait weeks to find the answer to a question that has already been answered.

You may not extract 100% of what total resin is available, as a conscious trade off for higher quality, but the ratios between the cannabinoids in the oil, should parallel those in the strain.

[vapeman24]

Originally Posted by Gray Wolf

You may not extract 100% of what total resin is available, as a conscious trade off for higher quality, but the ratios between the cannabinoids in the oil, should parallel those in the strain.

Okay gotcha. Have you done testing on the subject, or are you just speaking from generalized experience? Obviously I am sure the moisture content would have to be the exact same from strain-to-strain to correctly test this theory correct?

Also, thank you so much Gray Wolf for all your wisdom throughout the years! I actually had the pleasure of having a few smoke sessions with you at a clinic in OC a few years ago. We had great conversations about decarboxylating when you were first experimenting, and you even enjoyed the few samples of oil that I had brought with me! Good times indeed

[Gray Wolf]

Our GC results for bud and oil support the theory that plant genetics determine the ratios of the cannabinoids except for CBN, which is a function of THC degradation.

To a large degree, they also determine how much oil is produced, as a percent of starting material weight, but growing conditions and how dry the material is, also affects that number.

I've also found that my yield on a strain is in the ball park, whether I extract it fresh or at 25% moisture content, once I adjust for the difference in moisture content.

I have never run a controlled experiment to establish that point to the decimal place, just noted it was in the ballpark.

Thanks for the good thoughts and good times bro! Hee, hee, hee, snicker, snark, snort, always glad to share another brother or sister's creations and have learned much from the synergy.

[G.O. Joe]

The correlation you're looking for is the extract process, not the strain. Cold butane is not capable of extracting THCA quantitatively if hexane can't, and it can't.

It's possible to extract THC quantitatively with hexane. Cold butane may be different.

[Gray Wolf]

Originally Posted by G.O. Joe

The correlation you're looking for is the extract process, not the strain. Cold butane is not capable of extracting THCA quantitatively if hexane can't, and it can't.

It's possible to extract THC quantitatively with hexane. Cold butane may be different.

Would you elaborate?

[G.O. Joe]

First is the extraction procedure itself, regardless of solvent. You can't get too sloppy if you want quantitative extraction obviously.

A good question though - does a plant with 20% THC+THCA have a BHO yield exactly twice as much as a plant with 10%. You can't say a 28% yield has anything to do with the amount of cannabinoids in a strain if you don't know how much other crap is in the mix, which could vary with the strain or the grow. Maybe it's all wax and you have discovered the Wax Plant.

A continuous extraction, sonication, maybe a tiny addition of polar solvent component like acetic acid could all improve extraction in some way. Not just winterization, but good winterization that's effective yet doesn't pull your cannabinoids along. Talking extraction in general as a chemist not BHO head - BHO should disappear and I could not care less about making it. Amateur and dollar-signs-in-your-eyes extracts result in bad press that we don't need more of. Complain about losing terpenes while you won't smoke, make, or sell hash and I digress.

THCA is relatively much more polar than THC. In completely nonpolar solvents like the alkanes and CO2, a percentage of the more polar materials should remain. There's no reason for me - not having a GC or any sacrificial buds - to doubt the scientific literature in this case, even though this is usually stated as a fact without backing data as I did earlier. For instance from the UNODC manual: "It should, however, be noted, that non-polar solvents such as n-hexane and petroleum ether give a relatively clean extract but will only extract the neutral/free cannabinoids quantitatively, while the other solvents and their combinations give quantitative extractions of the cannabinoid acids as well."

Romano and Hazekamp have petroleum ether extracting slightly more THCA than ethanol did from ground dry 19% THC Bedrocan - extracting 2x and combining, using the same procedure for both solvents. It's the only case I know of where there is disagreement on THCA extraction efficiency, but they don't say anything about that aspect. This next one goes way back and although it doesn't particularly reflect what people are doing these days, it's hard data nonetheless. There is no extraction procedure given, but it seems to be 2x extraction, with light petroleum ether (close to butane) extracting less acidic cannabinoid than methanol did from 2 year old finely ground ~1974 hash.

[Gray Wolf]

I should be able to answer that question quantitatively shortly. I've finally gotten another forensic lab willing to work with me, and have my samples being analyzed to verify or dash the results I got with our own GC.

The sample consisted of one lot of Blue Dream extracted five different ways, specifically Ethanol, Isopropyl, Butane, Hexane, and Naphtha. I am not adroit enough on our manual injection GC to publish my own results, so will present them once I have third party results.

The experiment wasn't set up to measure THCA and THC separately and the reduction procedures decarboxylated it some, so even though there is enough material to run a HPLC run, it won't help much at his point.

One thing that I've often found missing when comparing research data to field data, and that is perspective. Is it totally leaving them behind, or is it just less efficient extracting them and what are the quantitative end differences?

As we both know, there really isn't a polar or non polar as much as a dielectric constant continuum, and so even if a solvent isn't perfect for the job, using enough of it can often still get the job done picking less preferred elements, by changing process parameters.

To the original question, we've found yields all over the place, regardless of extraction process. Our worst yield yet for oil from a strain was Catalyst at 5.7% from prime bud. We grew it as a high CBD strain but dropped it in favor of Catatonic and Maui Bubble Gift, which are even higher CBD and average closer to 18% yield.