[DoctorSax]

Hello Everyone!

I've recently begun work on my very first grow. I've been reading here and on OG (when it was up) for about a year now and I finally feel up to the task. I am really looking forward to this experience, and hope to learn alot.

The Seeds
I originally ordered Master Kush and White Widow from Nirvana, but due to the poor packaging (a letter envelope with an obvious weight problem) the seeds were stolen by the government. I did some more research and ended up with Lowryder from JointDoctors (chosen because of the short flower time- I want the next bowl I smoke to be homegrow!) and the very beautiful Satori. From what I've seen, Mandala runs a good shop with quality information, and Mike seems to be very active an helpful on these forums, important for a first timer such as myself.


Quick delivery and excellent (stealthy) packaging from Dr.Chronic.

The Setup

Seedlings in Pro-Mix under 40W flouro's in 5 inch pots


From there they will be transfered into the actual grow room under 400HPS w/ Hortilux bulb.


The little seeds were placed into wet paper towels (sorry Mike, I read your germ info after they had sprouted) and all showed tails within 36 hours. Within 5 days, all plants have sprouted and are looking healthy.



I did however find a tiny black insect with orange limbs sitting on one of the leaves. I immediatly removed the trespasser, and I will be keeping a close watch for any more.

Any questions, comments, critiques will be happily recieved. I'm sure to have many questions in the future, so please bear with me as I grow with these already beautiful plants.

Peace brothers.

[BagseedSamurai]

good luck. ill be watching.

[MandalaMike]

High DoctorSax!
How are things going? I hope we can see an update soon and if you have any questions our support board is at your disposal. :wink:

Mike

[DoctorSax]

Hello again from DoctorSax

I cant say that my babies are doing all that well. In general, growth is slow and the plants no longer have a healthy appearence. More specifically:

This one is showing dark orange/brown spots on the leaves. Possibly overwatering?





My biggest problem has come in the form of what I believe are spider mites, but I have yet to see a picture that looks like the bugs i have found. Anyway, here is some of the damage they have caused.



I've since used a neem based spray heavily, but they seem to keep coming back. I had not been spraying the undersides of the leaves, which I have just finished doing, so hopefully this will take care of the problem.

The plants are still under the 40W flouro due to a problem with my ballast, which had to be sent back. I am thinking this is the reason for the slow growth. I am in no hurry, but I am wondering if there might also be a problem with my nutrients or something.





Thanks for your help.

[MandalaMike]

Hi Doc,
The symptoms shown on this photo can be from the treatment with Neem oil. It's definately not from overwatering (keep soil moist and water when the surface is dry).



On young cannabis plants most biological pest sprays cause burn marks on the leaves. This is because they are based on oily, soapy or salt substances that tend to clog the stomata on the leaves, plus young leaves are still tender and susceptible to dry out. Pyretheum and rotenone sprays are similarly aggresive. The stomata are tiny openings on the leaf surface that regulate transpiration (ie. the exchange of water and gases) of the plant. If they are blocked then the leaf surface "overheats" thus leading to the necrotic, brown spots or leaf edges.
It's actually best to avoid treating young plants... or to treat them and then hang the lamps higher for a few days to reduce heat, and to "shower" the plants with water to remove residues after a day of treatment.
You should not use Neem oil more frequently than once a week either way.

Originally Posted by DoctorSax

My biggest problem has come in the form of what I believe are spider mites, but I have yet to see a picture that looks like the bugs i have found. Anyway, here is some of the damage they have caused..

These are not caused by spider mites (their marks are small white spots). These are the typical marks caused by the larvae of Thrips. The larvae are small, whittish, long, and wiggle around on the leaf eating away the surface. In fact these critters can also run fast! After working so many years with pest management I have a lot of respect for the instinctual intelligence of insects! After the first time you squish one of these critters on a leaf with your fingers, the next time they sense your presence, they immediately hide or run for their life! *lol*
The main culprit is the adult Thrips, which is small flying insect, usually black in colour. They enter grow rooms through any available cracks and love humid areas. So they usually fly around the bottom plant area near the pots or crawl on the substrates in hyrdoponic systems. The adults lay their eggs on the plants, the larvae hatch, and munch on the leaves. You get the same problem with White Flies and Aphids. All are flying insects and their larvae cause the actual damage. So even if you spray the plants you don't catch the adults and always get them coming back!

Ok, here is what you should do... the most effective method which is also completely harmless for your plants is to buy yellow stickers and place one sticker on a bamboo stick into each pot. Put them at plant height but be careful that the leaves don't stick to them. As the plants grow adjust the height upwards. You can also hang some stickers additionally around the grow area such as under the rear end of the lamps, near the door, etc. In a short time you will see the pests sticking to the stickers.
On your seedlings you can try to catch the few larvae that already exist and squish them with your fingers. In time they mature to adults and then hopefully meet a timely end on a sticker (they are attracted to the color).

Originally Posted by DoctorSax

The plants are still under the 40W flouro due to a problem with my ballast, which had to be sent back. I am thinking this is the reason for the slow growth. I am in no hurry, but I am wondering if there might also be a problem with my nutrients or something.

Certainly they can't grow in leaps and bounds under such minimum light. :wink:
Best to put them under the 400W once you get the ballast back. Unless you use very poor soil depleted in nutrients, there is almost never a problem with nutrients at this early stage of development, and you should not feed young plants in the first 3 weeks of growth.

Till later,
Mike

[DoctorSax]

Mike, thank you for your help.

I have stopped using the Neem oil, and will set up the yellow dot system as soon as I can. I had no idea such a bug existed. The reason I thought I had spider mites is this fellow:

and his companions that continue to show up all over the leaves. The neem oil did not do much good against them, and I'm not even sure exactly what they are. I also found a small beetle-like brown and black bug that reminded me of a ladybug, also crawling on the leaves.

Other than that, the seedlings seem to be coming along okay, although they look rather beaten up. On several of the Satori, the small new leaves at the center have a dark, almost purple look to them.

I will of course put them under the HPS as soon as it arrives, i think the flouro is causing them to stretch out and not build up their leaf structure.

Again, thanks for you help. With your help, this first time is turning into a great learning experience.

[MandalaMike]

That critter does look like a spider mite (quite huge!). So it seems you have spider mites and thrips. If you can see the mites then kill them with your fingers. This may seem a rather primitive method *lol*, but it does the job for starters. You can gently rub down the leaves between thumb and forefinger to get rid of the various mites, or squish individual adult mites. Neem oil should work against them (the oily film basically suffocates them). But I have also found some Neem products to be inaffective. Bio-sprays are tricky. We sometimes joke that you have to decide to kill the pests and the plant with them, or let the insects roam freely!

By the way, are you regulating the pH of your water? Just asking, since you report some color change on the Satori's.

Mike

[DoctorSax]

Hello again everyone!

I'm happy to report the the plants are doing very well. One of the Satori's has exploded in height. I'm having to constantly raise the light. The others are doing well, even the two runts. The mites are no longer a problem, one showing up every few days or so (the neem spray I was using was definitely not working, I'm sorry I bothered to spray that crap on them). Thrips is still present, but it seems to be less active, I'm finding less new trails on the leaves.







Along with the Satori's I have two Lowryder's. At three weeks is it possible to tell sex? I ask because one of the LRs is showing something very different from any of the other plants:





At the very top there are small green balls and shoots, but not new leaves like all the other plants. And, show in the first picture, there are little green clumps at the internodes instead of the little green hairs that come up. The plant is healthy, so i figured i could be seeing the beginnings of a male plant. Having never seen any cannabis plant before, I thought I'd put it to the experts.

Anyway, thanks for your help.

Also, is there an approximate on when to transplant to bigger pots? That one Satori is growing so fast, i'm wondering if it will be time soon.

[okwildfire]

kinda looks like a male to me??? i dunno...at the very least it would be a good chance to get some pollen.

[MandalaMike]

I agree that they look very healthy. The last shots from your lowryders show a male plant.

Originally Posted by DoctorSax

Also, is there an approximate on when to transplant to bigger pots? That one Satori is growing so fast, i'm wondering if it will be time soon.

You can transplant now into 4-5L pots (approx 1 gallon) till sexing. That way they have good space for root and shoot growth, plus plenty of nutrients for the main vegetative period. After sexing transplant into 10L pots (2 gallons).

Grow on, Mike