[gmanwho]

So i like turning the grow area into one big reflector. grow in the reflector an not just under it!! Anycase. would a 1000 magnetic ballast run 4 250w bulbs if wired correctly, series or parallel ( rusty at the moment). Would a digital? Any info out there??? bsafe...

[dizzlekush]

...this is a perfect example of 'how to burn your grow room down'.

Its one of them things, it would probably work but sure as hell isnt safe, and it isnt what the ballasts were intended to do. It is against NEC code and if you ever had a fire HO insurance would tell you to go shit in your hat because it is an illegal electrical installation. I would not recommend it, you could run the possibility of melting the bulbs. No ballast should ever run a bulb smaller than the ballast is rated for. 250's only have 12 inches or so of penetration and its doubtful you would do any better with 4 250s then you would with 1 1k. For the 250's to perform the best you need really short plants.

I have run 250's for years and I also have 1k and the 1k produces much better bud than the 250 in size and density, quality is about the same.

if you insist on running 250's I'd get 4 250w ballast kits and do it the right way, electrical fire is nothing to play around with.

[gmanwho]

Dizzle, thank you for knowledgeable insight, noted, electrical u need to know what your doing, an that would be an accepted for most people..

but

Lion , i would like to know why you would consider it unsafe?? whate does NEC code state why it is unsafe? NOt in terms of arguing or anything. just electrical facts im curious an if wired properly shouldnt be unsafe at all.. My backgorund with electronics, wiring, an machinery trouble shooting is decent an its tell me it may work safely. But i do not know this far into electrical. Electrical is not scary to me when understood an done correctly. Doing things half assed is scary..

Since the wattage is ran series over all 4 bulbs, there is no unsafe wattage going to one bulb at any given time.Having to much wattage sent to one bulb would be the one of top reasons not to do it. But in this case there would never be any unsafe wattage. if one bulb went out, all the other 3 would go out as well an breaking the connection an no surege of wattage to the remanding bulbs.

MANNNNNNNNNYYYYYY Ballasts are run in series safely. you say its not intended. A magnetic ballast is nothing but a transformer power source for giving out X amount of wattage an volt .

So i guess the question whould be why not a 1000 watt hydro sun magnetic ballast. Will it have to do something along the lines of changing the ohms an the transformer operates differently. Can the capacitor not handle the startup over 4 bulbs?

an right now im running 4 600's an a 1000 all verticle in flower, an about 5 seperate 216watt t5 setups.

But i love building bigggggg hoods. an like the idea of running 4 250's in the same ammount of area that would occupy a 1000. as for light penetration i try to trim anything abou14 -16 inches below the top canopy. even if there was a thing as 500 watt bulb, i would rather run 2 seperate 500's . ( but i would rather run 2 600's anyday compared to one 1000)
Hope a person with an elctrical background can chime in b-safe...

Originally Posted by Iron_Lion

Its one of them things, it would probably work but sure as hell isnt safe, and it isnt what the ballasts were intended to do. It is against NEC code and if you ever had a fire HO insurance would tell you to go shit in your hat because it is an illegal electrical installation. I would not recommend it, you could run the possibility of melting the bulbs. No ballast should ever run a bulb smaller than the ballast is rated for. 250's only have 12 inches or so of penetration and its doubtful you would do any better with 4 250s then you would with 1 1k. For the 250's to perform the best you need really short plants.

I have run 250's for years and I also have 1k and the 1k produces much better bud than the 250 in size and density, quality is about the same.

if you insist on running 250's I'd get 4 250w ballast kits and do it the right way, electrical fire is nothing to play around with.

[Azeotrope]

You would have to consider the total load on the ignitor for 4 - 250w bulbs....... NOt going to happen. Especially when you consider the length of wire to each bulb. The load on the capacitor would be questionable as well. Parallel electrical loads that are "listed/stated" to be equal do not always draw equally. Every time you add a connector/connection, you are adding a point of heat and potential voltage drop. All components need to be 4kv rated (including wire nuts, crimp connectors/stakons ....).

People ask this stuff all of the time and it just blows my mind that peole that can not answer the question themselves are even wiring this stuff!!!!! I have administrator level electrical licenses in 3 specialties in 2 states and 20yrs of field experience wiring everythig you can imagine. Please don't do what you are asking about. You could cause great harm to yourself and or others. Just get 4 250w ballasts and or stick with the 1k.

Best of luck to you and please stay safe! Remember - The most important connection is the ground! Never ignore or fail to ground your hoods, ballasts and or anything else that draws a load or is metalic and houses/holds a load.

Not saying it wouldnt work, what I am saying is that it's not up to code and can be dangerous. They make cord splitters for digi's but I can guarantee they are not UL listed, meaning if they fail and you have a fire it's on you.

I make my career in the electrical trade and this is something you would never see done and from a professional opinion I would never recommend this be done.

If you are ok with the risk, then by all means.

I can try to find the NEC article for ya.

[gmanwho]

Originally Posted by Azeotrope

You would have to consider the total load on the ignitor for 4 - 250w bulbs....... NOt going to happen. Especially when you consider the length of wire to each bulb. The load on the capacitor would be questionable as well. Parallel electrical loads that are "listed/stated" to be equal do not always draw equally. Every time you add a connector/connection, you are adding a point of heat and potential voltage drop. All components need to be 4kv rated (including wire nuts, crimp connectors/stakons ....).

People ask this stuff all of the time and it just blows my mind that peole that can not answer the question themselves are even wiring this stuff!!!!! I have administrator level electrical licenses in 3 specialties in 2 states and 20yrs of field experience wiring everythig you can imagine. Please don't do what you are asking about. You could cause great harm to yourself and or others. Just get 4 250w ballasts and or stick with the 1k.

Best of luck to you and please stay safe! Remember - The most important connection is the ground! Never ignore or fail to ground your hoods, ballasts and or anything else that draws a load or is metalic and houses/holds a load.

Thank you for dropping in, few questions thou. the Mogul ceramic sockets are 4kv rated. But why is the bulb and or any ballast running 300v, or am i wrong?. Wouldnt the 4kv pulse stand for 4000 volts. an isnt the ignightor the same thing as a capacitor? It is. keeping it safe. just looking for a mentor as why it not recommend. still searching. what if i doubled, tripled the cap an ran atleast double or triple the mfd for a cap? that would solve the startup portion. wheels are always turning. b-safe

[Azeotrope]

I can tell that you are reallystuck on this idea...... I get that way with stuff! However, the arc tube of these bulbs is made of either a ceramic or glass (depends on bulb design). They are sensative to resonance and have very specific charges of gas/metals within the arc tube. It takes just the right "pulse or strike" from the ignitor to excite the mix within the tube. As the arc gap between the electrodes within the bulbs is specific to their wattage and specific design, it is unsafe (potential for rupture of arc tube) and unreasonable to try and calculate what ignitor or capacitor changes/additions would be required. Ignitors are like a "start capacitor" they store and build a charge then discharge at a high voltage until ignition is sensed. Just fact that one arc tube could ignite and the ignitor could not see it could mean that the other tubes wouldn't start...... Or worse! The tube in one bulb reaches ignition and the ignitor being of a design for a larger load/tube (1k watt) doesn't see it and keeps striking it until the pressure rises so high that the bulb explodes! The ignitor for a 150w, 250w or 400w hps is usually the same spec as the arc tube lengths are similar enough, but the ballast manufacturers engineer them to match their specific coil design. The ignitor, capacitor and bulb are all loads on the core/coil. So to start messing with the matching and not to forget the wire lenghts (voltage drop and impedance), connectors and such could cause bulb rupture, failure and or a ignitor/capacitor melt-down. I have witnessed start and run capacitors going boom like an M80 firecracker!!!!! Not cool and it can cause a fire!

Yes, the operating voltage of the bulb is around 300v, but the strike or pulse has potential to reach 4kv. As a matter of fact, you should always use 600v rated wire or sjo cord on the secondary (bulb/load) side of the ballast wiring. Believe it or not the strike is actually something that has to have the correct "timing" to strike the correct type of bulb.

This is why I get so frustrated with folks using the "switchable" ballasts as they are using one type of core and it may be providing the correct voltage for a halide but not an HPS once the bulb is struck and fired. Take for example a 150w High Frequency Electronic (up to 20khz!) halide ballast...... They will fire a HPS 150w, but the lamp voltage will be around 100v while the standard s55 150w hps is designed for 55v. You can (as I have) buy a 100v rated (s56) 150w bulb to avoid premature failure or sudden rupture. If you use a high frquency ballast with a smooth and rolling sign wave on the ceramic design of a CMH (ceramic metal halide) they will rupture due to high resonance. They were designed for 50-70hz off of standard line. You can run them (as I do) on an electronic or digital ballast that runs up to 300hz if it has a well regulated and controlled square wave form out-put. 104hz to 144hz is best though....

What I am saying in long form, is that these things may look simple and you may have a great desire to see one simple mathematical equation of 1000/4= 250, but that is not where this type of thing goes, Save your cash, look at industrial suppliers or surplus outlets and buy the correct ballasts for the bulbs you intend to run. I used to run 1050w to 2k watts of CHM between multiple bulbs and get massive yields. Every single ballast I owned was purchased new in box for under $50 U.S. at industrial surplus outlets. Now I run a 250w and a 150w cuz life has changed. Every day I wish I could run all the gear I have stored!

[gmanwho]

THANK YOU AZEOTROPE!!!!! I appreciate the knowledge an your time explaining. when people tell me no, well i wanna know why no. not just some answer "well cause someone told me no " . im not built that simple..

I understand in most senses now why it is not possible to be done correctly with regular ballasts. the striking the bulb etc. over 4 bulbs wouldnt be correct. i was thinking more in lines of when i was setting up the t5 fluros. so i was wondering why fluro ballast can, but hids ballasts cant.

I appreciate it ....

Still like the idea of running a huge reflector with lotta 250's in there, Spaced every foot an half or so. Just gotta get the right ammount of CORRECT ballasts. was hoping of gettting 4 1000 rated ballasts an fire 16 250's. but not possible.

thank you an b-safe.

[Phaeton]

I had nine close spaced 400 watt lights in the last budroom, I must say the plants loved it and grew evenly.