[Choc]

Hey Guys i want to discuss a few things about monster cropping and Plant Degradation...

For those of you that do not know what monster cropping is please see the quote below that has all the info you need to get you up to speed my questions will Follow

Monster Cropping

Monster Cropping or Flowering Clones is another method of growing that was brought to my attention by one of our members; JWP, who also was kind enough to provide the pictures for this part of the guide. This method involves taking clones of flowering plants and then forcing them to root and re-veg, which eventually leads to very bushy plants with a great number of branches and nodes. I named this technique Monster Cropping because that is what you will get, real monster plants, but also because this method was introduced to the scene by a grower named greenmonster714. He in turn credits a grower named Feral for discovering this technique.

Taking clones from flowering plants goes against all that has been said about cloning cannabis and might therefore seem a bit confusing at first but the science behind the technique is sound and the results speak for themselves.

You start by taking clones of a plant that is about 21 days into flowering. This seems to be the best time to do it but you can also take clones at a later stage with similar results. The lower branches make better clones as they have not yet become rigid and will also root faster and more easily than say the top cola. Move the new cutting into a glass of water and let it sit for a while in order to make sure that no air gets into the vascular system during handling, as this can be fatal to your new plant. You should make the cut so that it runs along the stem as this will increase the surface area for water and possibly nutrient uptake, depending on what method of cloning you use. Personally, I have found that using a small hydroponic setup or a propagation bubbler to be by far the best way to clone cannabis plants. I will not expand on the subject of cloning here, if you need more information on how to clone your plants, have a look at the official cloning thread by JJScorpio

In the picture below, you can see how the clone from a flowering plant been has placed in a propagation bubbler for rooting and re-vegging. This also means that you will have to put the clone back under a veg light schedule of 20/4 or even 24/0. Any less and the clone might just continue flowering. Clones do not need strong light so a small CFL will do. You can remove some of the buds and leaves at this stage in order to encourage the plant to revert back into its vegetative cycle but leave the topmost shoot alone.

It will take several weeks for the clone to root, some never do, so it is best that you take a great number of clones at the same time in order to ensure that at least one makes it on to the next stage. It might be a good idea to place the clones inside a humidity dome, which can be bought at gardening stores or custom built for your specific needs. The high humidity inside the dome will make sure that the plants do not dry out and die. Ventilate the dome every day just to make sure that the plants don't get attacked by mold.

Keep in mind however that the most important thing when it comes to cloning is to provide the fresh cuttings with plenty of oxygen and that is why the propagation bubbler is so effective compared to other methods.




The clones might be a sad sight at first but as soon as they root, they will also revert back into the vegetative stage and start growing again. Once the clones have rooted properly and started growing again, they will put out single unserrated leaves at first but the normal leaves are soon to follow. It might be a good idea to apply some training at this stage, tying down some of the tops will encourage even more branching. You can also provide some heat underneath the clones as this will speed up the rooting process considerably.



When the plant starts growing again, the incredible branching power of the flowering clone becomes apparent.

As you can see, this plant has grown into a real monster, and all this without ever topping the plant. That's the beauty of this technique; you can forget all about topping and FIM'ing since the flowering clone will sprout all these new branches all by itself.

This plant is now perfectly suited for a SCROG or perhaps even a SOG grow. This one plant can easily fill up an entire Scrog net in no time. Several of these plants grown in SOG will definitely give you a grand harvest.

There are other benefits from using this technique; it also removes the need for keeping mother plants. When the newly re-vegged plant is flowered, it can also provide more clones for a perpetual harvest. Recycling at its best. This might be of interest to those who need to keep down their number of plants.

Needless to say, this method is highly effective thanks to the heavy branching that occurs after a flowering clone is re-vegged. With further training and some patience, you will get some real monster plants and thereby also a monster harvest.

please note the above is from an article here on ICMAG

Ok now i have taken clones from flowering plants before and had crazy mutation that have lead to monster yields...

i had a Chronic x Rhino Cross that produced quite well but 2 weeks into a grow i needed some cuts and my mum was to small and these plants were big so i took 40 cuts from the flowering plants and put them in the propagator to root....

some of these cuttings made there way to a friend who grows single plants per square meter under 1 x 600 he usually gets 7 to 11 oz per grow... not that efficient but not that bad either as it suits him...

i also vegged these cuts on for 3 weeks and then flowered them getting 2 oz per plant from them... not a high yield for 3 weeks veg but i normally veg for one week and flip them but had to go the 3 weeks due to the plant having to revert back to veg..... i normally yield 1 OZ so in theory i doubled my yield... same space same light same pot size ect ect.....

Also my friend with the trees for 16 to 19 oz per plant it was an epic grow and he puts it down to weather converting to airpots at the time and good luck... this was 2 years ago and he has never match the yield of this plant even with cuts from the same mum....

So Monster Cropping defiantly works thats my First and main point!!!

what i would like to know is how efficient do you think it would be to take clones off of a flowing plant again and again... do you see this being a problem?

Basicaly i would take a cut from a mum veg and flower

2 weeks in take a cut from that plant Root it and reVeg and then flower

2 weeks in Take a cut from that plant Root it reVeg ect ect ect....

how long do you think this could go on for before you see a Degradation in the plant or end product?

I have kept mums for a couple of years and know of a guy that has a 11 year old cut that has been renewed every now and then with a fresh cut from its self...

But would you run in to problems if you was flowering and revegging a plant again and again infinitely...

Please discuss, give you opinions or previous findings.....

[dansbuds]

I do the same thing myself , i don't take clones till the plants are abut 2 weeks into flowering so i can get the monster cropped clones . the longer in flower i take them the longer the reveg takes .

now as to your question .... I don't know from experiance yet if they degrade over time . I have read up on this from many sources that in cannabis plants ....it takes many years ... if at all to show any signs of degradation . many have been doing it for years (as much as 15 years )with the same strain & have seen no differences . environmental differences have changed the growth habbits but no signs of degradation .

as I said this is just from doing some reading on degradation of the cannabis plant ( not much referance to it on the web , not as much as fruits & flowers .

[Choc]

Hi Dan thanks for chiming in

To be honest i dont see it being a problem but i will keep a mum as a backup just in case! she will have the youthfulness of the plant still in her genetic make up as it wont of been flowered and reveged over and over again if this is even a problem...

I would still like to here from others if they have been doing this or have done it in the past for a substantial amount of time...

[big twinn]

very interesting! i'll be trying this!

[highonmt]

I have tried this but the time that it takes to bring the plant back to vegetative growth can be used to grow a much larger plant than any 'monster crop' in my opinion. The clones I used took like 3 or more weeks to sort themselves out and start growing well plus 2 weeks to root. In the mean time the normal clones were already 2ft tall, lst'ed, topped and ready for bloom. My point is that with 21 days of veg as you reported and longer rooting times you could get much larger root mass, plant size and yeild potential. We get close to 1 pound a plant at 4 weeks veg... There are much better ways to gain branching such as fim, lst etc. It is cool they way they replace bud sites with stems but inefficient and it seems stressful for the plants imo. Note that Oxidative stress is known to shorten telomere length much more quickly than aging and in plants that can mean loss of vigor and potency....I would recommend propagation in veg for maximum yield and long term genetic stability.HM

[supermanlives]

tooo many branches and popcorn for me .

[Choc]

Originally Posted by highonmt

I have tried this but the time that it takes to bring the plant back to vegetative growth can be used to grow a much larger plant than any 'monster crop' in my opinion. The clones I used took like 3 or more weeks to sort themselves out and start growing well plus 2 weeks to root. In the mean time the normal clones were already 2ft tall, lst'ed, topped and ready for bloom. My point is that with 21 days of veg as you reported and longer rooting times you could get much larger root mass, plant size and yeild potential. We get close to 1 pound a plant at 4 weeks veg... There are much better ways to gain branching such as fim, lst etc. It is cool they way they replace bud sites with stems but inefficient and it seems stressful for the plants imo. Note that Oxidative stress is known to shorten telomere length much more quickly than aging and in plants that can mean loss of vigor and potency....I would recommend propagation in veg for maximum yield and long term genetic stability.HM

Cant Argue with that at all...

im going to do a side by side anyway.. i have enough room for a separate veg area to house normal and revegged plants so will see how it compares... i was worried about the stress levels and if it become a problem like i said i will have an original mum to fall back on...

[stihgnobevoli]

how old is this technique? i been doing it since 08. i think it should be called stihgnoCropping. also the longer you wait the harder it is to root clones, just take the clones about a week after flowers show.

i change my mind, call it the all bud method.

i just throw the plant into flower after it roots. it will veg/stretch and then flower on its own and the result is...

all bud, all bud.

[humbleguy]

The plants will finish shorter with very little stretch but the flowers will contain more smaller leaves.

[WarrenBuffet]

I've done it as well. I like cloning in veg better. Plus it's harder to train a mutant.