[D.S. Toker. MD]

well xare, Im sure open to ideas, but that aint the first casualty ive had this year. or last year either for that matter. Im not sure why you think its root rot, but let me give you some more of the facts that im lookin at.

The condition starts with round spots on some of the largest leaves, as the spots spread, the leaf yellows and falls from the plant and spots begin to appear on surrounding large leaves and as the spots multiply, the leaves yellow and die. That continues until all of the large leaves are gone and by then its appearing on secondary leaves. This describes a 2 week period. This condition seems to be on the trees and many other native species in my enviroment. Their leaves have the same spots and fall off just as they do on the cannabis.

These plants arent planted in the same soil. They are spread over 8 sites miles apart in very different types of soil from black rich loam to high clay content soil. Plants in each location have the spots.

Weve practically been in drought with temps for 95-100 nearly every day. Soil temps are in the 80's. Can roots rot under those conditions?

All plants dont respond the same. The blue hash plants seem unaffected at any site. Sensi star doesnt seem to have it. Standing right next to it can be a white widow or biddy early thats seemingly covered with it with every leaf yellowing. Further, the biddy early seems highly sensitive. It has branches wilt, or the whole plant will wilt, regaurdless of the site. I have biddy earlys wilting at 6 different sites miles apart. The white widow gets the condition but it doesnt wilt, it just doesnt seem to progress any. The buds dont grow and the plants look yellow all over.

Ill piss on them if it would help. After hearing those facts do you still think its a root fungus? If so, what should i pour on them? Ill pull up the plant in the picture above and take a pic of the roots if you want to see them.

Ive got 12 of these girls and every lower leaf is spotted and falling off. Ive got a few weeks to figure it out.

[Dorje113]

Originally Posted by Xare

D.S. Toker, those plants are dying from a soil borne root infection not a Foliar disease.

They needed a soil drench with a Fungicide to prevent root rot, not a foliar applicated fungicide like greencure or copper spray.

To fight these kind of infections effectively you have to be able to diagnose them correctly.

All that wilting you see happening overnight is because fungal slime like pythium or fusariam are building up on the roots and suffocating it.

Dig up the roots to one of those infected plants and you will be able to find it. You may even notice a dead rotting plant death smell. Get your nose down by the roots and sniff.

Yup.

I agree wilting like that is a rot in the main stem or roots. A friend got some black stem rot that has killed a couple plants randomly, it's a water borne fungus that he introduced by not cleaning out the buckets he mixed his nutes in. It occured right at the bas of the plants. Either that or in the roots like Xare mentioned....

The leaf fungus will defoliate the plant but shouldn't cause wilting like that.

[Dorje113]

Originally Posted by D.S. Toker. MD

Ive got 12 of these girls and every lower leaf is spotted and falling off. Ive got a few weeks to figure it out.

The fungi could spread to the roots, which would lead to the wilting..... but it's usually a different species of fungus. For the plant to wilt like that, there has to be damage to the plants water uptake system, either in the main stem or roots.

[D.S. Toker. MD]

Dorje113, the water uptake system isnt the only reason for a plant to wilt and die. Disease can make them wilt, and even borers.

In this instance, not all plants respond the same way. Most of the plants do defoliate progressively, but it seems to effect the plants differnetly, in this case only biddy early has wilted and died. The others wont ever wilt really,

[Xare]

More then one type of infection can make things confusing.

And when a plant is weakened by one disease it makes it more susceptible to further infections. Its immunity is down.

On top of that breakouts occur around the same time of year. The spores that give rise to these infections are everywhere and because they are a living thing they are driven by the need to reproduce not just the environmental conditions.


Treat all outdoor plants as if they are in danger of infection.

To protect our entire plants we have to proceed with a two pronged attack. Foliar Fungicide sprays to keep the fungus and mold off the leaf as well as a soil drench of the root zone to fight the diseases that live there.

As an organic grower I like to use Biologicals to inoculate my rhizosphere, but I know you are a chemical grower D.S. so you may want to use something like Physan 20 when you water.

This year I left a few plants in different locations with no defenses. They get spots and the bottom leaves start to yellow and fall off then it spreads up the entire plant. But then right next to it there will be a healthy plant that fought off the diseases.

My main plot however has been inoculated and sprayed on a regular basis all year. So they have a better defense.

[ronbo51]

I'm with the Doc on this one. That liquid copper is OMRI listed and it will work. The question is whether the plants can be saved. They are about to use huge resources trying to fruit and with a compromised photosynthesis system at best yields will suffer. But if you can save the little darlings then you know you will be armed for next year with something that works. Good luck.

[Xare]

Copper will accumulate in the soil and can harm plants so dont use it as a Soil Drench around the rootzone.

[D.S. Toker. MD]

ronbo1 and others, i have news. On monday, i went and completely drenched a plant that was 4 weeks into flower with a solution of 1oz per gallon of Lcopper. I picked off the yellowed leaves so i could tell if more yellowing occurred. Just a few minutes ago i checked the plant and i have no more yellow leaves, but even more importantly, the plant looks better, healthier. I believe the fungus was stopped in its tracks.

On Tuesday before spraying other plants, i inspected the flowering plant sprayed on Monday to see if there was any damage to the hairs/flfowers or the plant in general. I saw no flower/hair discoloration or any sign of negativity at all, so i drenched 4 whit widows that were also in flower. This morning there is no hair/flower discoloration and it appears just as it did on the plant sprayed monday, that the plants are in better shape.

The Liquid Copper seems to stop the disease on contact and in 3 days, i have no other leaves yellowing..

Straintesterr: my wife says nothing would stick around in the vicinity of those socks! I may hang one from each plant.

ghost of sage: Water curing a must? Well, theres no good answer to your question. Let me give you the facts. Studies indicate that no residue can be detected upon the plant 14 days after the last application, regaurdless of how many applications have been made. I used data taken from tests on cabbage, lettuce, cauliflower and brocolli because these are plants that the sprayed leaves are eaten.

That said, liquid copper is a heavy metal and i dont trust their test/results. Because of the potential for toxicity, i'll be watercuring my bud even though i wont use the product in more than 30 days from harvest. I keep in mind that Greencure is supposedly not present after rain or 14 days, but any weed i treat with it taste metallicy and makes me cough, so i water cure that bud as well.

In my case however, its either liquid copper and watercuring or not have any bud at all.

[ghost of sage]

I went by the light of the moon last night because the birds are flying and sprayed all of mine with the liquid copper.I only mixed it at 3 table spoons to a gallon of water as that was one of the heaviest applications in the instruction book.I could not really see what I was doing as the moon does not give off a lot of light in a forest but i believe I coated them pretty well.I will prolly go back next week and hit them again but do it with my big sprayer instead of the hand sprayer and see how they look.I sprayed almost 3/4 of a gallon onto5 big plants so maybe i got them good enough.

[D.S. Toker. MD]

I hear you on the big sprayer ghost. This hand held 1/2 gallon sprayer is working me to death!

Im using 2 tablespoons per/gall, but 3 should be fine as i havent seen any negative effects on any strain. Ive just gotten home from blasting nearly every plant ive got. It takes a lot of spray and trying to do both sides of the leaves is a tough haul, but im getting it. Im doing a before and after ghost. (i wish i knew how to make these pics smaller)


Here's a GHwhite widow with the fungus. All of the yellow leaves are hard to see but its covered with them




Another pic of the yellowing leaves.




Here it is after ive picked off the yellow leaves and drenched it in liquid copper spray. Ill post a pick in a week to see if there are any additional yellow leaves.