[FoCo(No.Co)]

Originally Posted by ItsGrowTime

eta: Acetamiprid is also indicated as effective against phylloxera. Trying to source a commercial product but trade name is "Assail". Here's an interesting chart on pesticide effectiveness against certain bugs.
https://www.oardc.ohio-state.edu/grapeipm/Pesticide.htm

That looks like a great resource.

But whats up with this? It says that pyrethrins/Pyreth-It are not effective on phylloxera?!

EDIT: FUCK! It says that azadirachtin doesnt work either?? I have now purchased three organic products(Spinosad, pyrethrins, azadirachtin/neem) based on recomendations made by IC members and Ohio State says none of them are going to work!

I think we are going to be forced to use real, inorganic poisons to solve our aphid problems.......

SECOND EDIT: I FINALLY GOT WISE ABOUT THIS TIME, HARMFUL CHEMICAL PESTICIDES ARE THE ONLY ANSWER, IMO.

[MynameStitch]

Foco, send a pm to one of the mods to ask this to be a sticky; 10K is not around much so you would have better luck getting another mod to help you out.


Great work on the thread by the way, this is why I love the community, because we all help out one another, in some form or another!

[FoCo(No.Co)]

Can someone please drop some more info on how to SAFELY use Imidacloprid?

I am about to go buy a bottle of Monterey Imidacloprid from Home Depot($13)... but the label says that you only have to use this once a year?? If I use it during veg will it most certainly be out of my plants system by harvest?

THANK YOUs!

[ItsGrowTime]

Originally Posted by FoCo(No.Co)

Can someone please drop some more info on how to SAFELY use Imidacloprid?

I am about to go buy a bottle of Monterey Imidacloprid from Home Depot($13)... but the label says that you only have to use this once a year?? If I use it during veg will it most certainly be out of my plants system by harvest?

THANK YOUs!

(disclaimer: Im still working on this too so Im no expert obviously, just my thoughts here)

It's a safe systemic product, no special handling required according to my label. Just follow the directions. I got the Bayer Fruit and Veggie version (.235% imid) since they're about the same as cannabis plants. I added around a half oz to a 25gal res (around 1-2ml/gal) and it's been running through my system on small clones for a week now without issue. The label says to only apply once, but that's for full grown plants so Ill probably run a second small application around day 20 of flower when the aphid damage usually starts to show.

I found a commercial product with acetamiprid at Home Depot/Lowe's. It's Ortho Fruit and Veggie spray. There's also a Rose version but both have .006% acetamiprid so I didn't see the difference (other than price). They were the ONLY products that contained this pesticide! I think Ill apply the spray around the base of the plants every two weeks or so (says 4 applications max) and with my setup it'll run right down onto the roots. That should kill the bugs on contact and the roots will take some of it up systemically for further protection.

[humble1]

Originally Posted by FoCo(No.Co)

If I use it during veg will it most certainly be out of my plants system by harvest?

wikipedia says yes. or, rather, probably yes:
"The chemical breaks down to inorganic molecules by both photolysis and microbial action, in the air and with a half-life of 30 days in water and 27 days in soil anaerobically. Although it is not "persistent" in the technical sense since it does degrade, it can have a half-life in soil under aerobic conditions of as long as 997 days, which is the cause of the concern over possible water contamination as it gradually leaches out of a hypothetical soil reservoir."
Obviously conditions will vary, but IMO for the majority of smaller containerized indoor growers it won't be an issue. That's why I use merit!

But whats up with this? It says that pyrethrins/Pyreth-It are not effective on phylloxera?!
It says that azadirachtin doesnt work either?? I have now purchased three organic products(Spinosad, pyrethrins, azadirachtin/neem) based on recomendations made by IC members and Ohio State says none of them are going to work!

Ohio state is commenting on grape growing IPM. grapes are grown in soil outside, not indoors in smaller containers. pyrethrins are effective @ killing root aphids only if applied in the correct way, as i outlined earlier. simple drenching is not adequate because the aphids can and will move.
please note: if wikipedia is correct, and the half life is only ~30 days, do not apply these products within 30 days of harvest! I only apply merit periodically in veg and once at the flip to flower. Good luck to all in the land of REAL poison....

[ItsGrowTime]

Originally Posted by humble1

wikipedia says yes. or, rather, probably yes:
"The chemical breaks down to inorganic molecules by both photolysis and microbial action, in the air and with a half-life of 30 days in water and 27 days in soil anaerobically. Although it is not "persistent" in the technical sense since it does degrade, it can have a half-life in soil under aerobic conditions of as long as 997 days, which is the cause of the concern over possible water contamination as it gradually leaches out of a hypothetical soil reservoir."
Obviously conditions will vary, but IMO for the majority of smaller containerized indoor growers it won't be an issue. That's why I use merit!

Ohio state is commenting on grape growing IPM. grapes are grown in soil outside, not indoors in smaller containers. pyrethrins are effective @ killing root aphids only if applied in the correct way, as i outlined earlier. simple drenching is not adequate because the aphids can and will move.
please note: if wikipedia is correct, and the half life is only ~30 days, do not apply these products within 30 days of harvest! I only apply merit periodically in veg and once at the flip to flower. Good luck to all in the land of REAL poison....

There was one particular Bayer product at Home Depot that had the Merit logo on it. I think it was the Tree and Shrub version at 1.17% imid. Probably a good choice too.

The label on my Bayer imid product warns not to harvest for at least 21 days after application for most plants, so 21-30 days is probably a good guideline. Only exception listed is leafy veggies like celery and swiss chard say at least 45 days.

[FoCo(No.Co)]

Originally Posted by ItsGrowTime

I found a commercial product with acetamiprid at Home Depot/Lowe's. It's Ortho Fruit and Veggie spray. There's also a Rose version but both have .006% acetamiprid so I didn't see the difference (other than price).

Yea I have decided that the grow shop is useless for finding products to solve our little problem. I just took a trip to Home Depot intending to buy an Imid product, didnt have enough cash on me to buy it, but I found a cheaper product that contains GAMMA-Cyhalothrin!

So it is final, I am going to use this stuff($9/Quart)-


EDIT: THIS STUFF IS A GOOD TEMPORARY STOP WHEN YOU CANNOT APPLY IMID. MUST BE REAPPLIED.

Originally Posted by humble1

Ohio state is commenting on grape growing IPM. grapes are grown in soil outside, not indoors in smaller containers. pyrethrins are effective @ killing root aphids only if applied in the correct way, as i outlined earlier.

I'm so happy to have someone around to comment on practicing this stuff in the real world. Respect, man.

EVERYONE!

[CovertCrops]

Ive got the Bayer Tree and shrub with the Merit logo on it, 1.47% Imid

It calls for 1 teaspoon per gallon of container. That seems like a lot when the fruit and veggie version is only 0.235% Imid being applied at 1-2ml per gal (thanks IGT)

Humble1 - how strong is the merit that you apply? I think I could just dilute it down but I have never messed with this stuff before, just wondering what you do.

[ItsGrowTime]

Originally Posted by CovertCrops

Ive got the Bayer Tree and shrub with the Merit logo on it, 1.47% Imid

It calls for 1 teaspoon per gallon of container. That seems like a lot when the fruit and veggie version is only 0.235% Imid being applied at 1-2ml per gal (thanks IGT)

Humble1 - how strong is the merit that you apply? I think I could just dilute it down but I have never messed with this stuff before, just wondering what you do.

The fruit/veggie calls for .5oz per 10square feet of plant space. In a hydro setup it's pretty hard to nail down a sqft figure so I kinda winged it and started out light for clones. Based on root space figures in my garden (5'x5" fence posts, 6 of them), I can probably go higher than 2ml/gal but my clones just flipped to 12/12 and are only a 4-5 inches tall so I didnt want to overdo it. Will apply a little more later into flower.

[ItsGrowTime]

Originally Posted by FoCo(No.Co)

So it is final, I am going to use this stuff($9/Quart)-

What made you choose that product? I haven't seen that chemical mentioned anywhere as being effective but I could have missed it. Why that one?