[circadian clock]

does anybody think bugs get immune to chemicals we use 2 kill them, and year after year they get stronger/harder to get rid of?

[Wait...What?]

any indoor grower who ever fought spider mites will tell you that they do become chemically tolerant.

it helps to have a 'host plant' in your grow zone and let both your pests and their predator live on it. this way your predators have enough to feed on so they stick around and keep defending your garden.

[maryjohn]

they never get used to neem

[Wait...What?]

they do if you use it enough

their life cycle is so short they adapt very quickly.

A host plant for insects....that is something I was thinking about the other day as I was clapping always-there white fly. I hate bombing but that is the only way I've found to check their #'s. As soon as my outdoor veg gardens go in of course the population of white fly indoors goes up. They are more of a psychological issue as long as I keep them in check. Wait...What? you have experimented with host plants? This is a subject that is of special interest to me....even if just considering cost of bombs,sticky traps,sprays etc I have not done any research yet nor heard anyone take this line of defense but I'm sure there must be something to this host plant concept. Host plants...yes something the insects could not resist. Should throw some squash in my bunker....I know they love those. A nice line of thought. Bugz definitely become immune to chemz not too many generations down the line. I'll stand behind that statement all day. Amazing creatures.

[exploziv]

I had some white flyes in my veg room. made a enclosure from a trash bag, put the plants inside it, trew some vinegar and baking soda in a bowl (C02 & water will result) and sealed the bag with the plants inside for about a hour or two. all the flies were dead, most of them were in fact in the bowl caught in the vinegar smelling water. then I just took every plant and cleaned the eggs under the leaves. if they will reapear another gas chamber & leaves bath should be enaugh to never see them again.

first time that I had pests problem indoors. was pretty easy to deal with it.
do you think this should work also with the mites? I think they also need oxygen to live.

exploziv gbb: That I respect. Only I would need to do the entire room (perpetual so 2 rms) and that would be a tough one. I love that system though. Bombs suck....outdoors I don't kill my gophers, ground squirrels,rabbits, etc I just try to overplant and out think them(not easy) and I try to do that with bugs as well...just haven't thought out a proper solution.

[Mr_Ed]

Originally Posted by THE PABLOS

....that is something I was thinking about the other day as I was clapping always-there white fly. I hate bombing but that is the only way I've found to check their #'s. As soon as my outdoor veg gardens go in of course the population of white fly indoors goes up.

Pablos: I have heard that using vermicompost (Worm Castings) is a great way to get rid of white flies. You can spread the castings around the base of the plant if in soil and also make a very dilute tea to spray the plants. I have never had a whitefly problem but other gardeners in my area have sworn by it.

I use a combination of diatomaceous earth, neem oil and compost tea to combat fungus gnats and spider mites with great success.

I wish you the best. Pest problems are the pits sometimes.

[fishheadbob]

Originally Posted by circadian clock

does anybody think bugs get immune to chemicals we use 2 kill them, and year after year they get stronger/harder to get rid of?

(Un)natural selection. Of course they get immune to pesticides. When you hit bugs with an insecticide it kills maybe 98% of the bugs; the other 2% have some sort of immunity/resistance to that particular poison. They breed. Next cycle you have bugs from parents that were somewhat resistant; you apply the same pesticide but it only kills 75% of the bugs; who of course breed. Their offspring might have a 50% survival rate, and on and on, worse and worse. What to do? First, don't spray unless the bug situation is bad. If you are using a broad spectrum spray that kills most anything, you are also killing the beneficial insects that were going to eat the bad guys. Learn something from organic gardeners who almost never spray, and when they do it's something not overly noxious. Also learn your bugs. Is that one a pest or a beneficial insect ? If you do have to spray, change bug killers from time to time. If you hit them with the same stuff time after time you're just hastening the development of superbug .

This is why the big chemical companies are continually rolling out new pesticides. The old ones just aren't as effective after a while.
The same principle holds true for weed killers.

[maryjohn]

Originally Posted by fishheadbob

(Un)natural selection. Of course they get immune to pesticides. When you hit bugs with an insecticide it kills maybe 98% of the bugs; the other 2% have some sort of immunity/resistance to that particular poison. They breed. Next cycle you have bugs from parents that were somewhat resistant; you apply the same pesticide but it only kills 75% of the bugs; who of course breed. Their offspring might have a 50% survival rate, and on and on, worse and worse. What to do? First, don't spray unless the bug situation is bad. If you are using a broad spectrum spray that kills most anything, you are also killing the beneficial insects that were going to eat the bad guys. Learn something from organic gardeners who almost never spray, and when they do it's something not overly noxious. Also learn your bugs. Is that one a pest or a beneficial insect ? If you do have to spray, change bug killers from time to time. If you hit them with the same stuff time after time you're just hastening the development of superbug .

This is why the big chemical companies are continually rolling out new pesticides. The old ones just aren't as effective after a while.
The same principle holds true for weed killers.

that's a bit simplistic, as not all pesticides work the same way. True in some cases (mostly the new ones) not in others. There is no immunity to neem or DE, soap, nicotine, horticultural oil, sulfur, Bt, Boric acid, etc... Which is why they have been used for so long. If you want to put in the work, organic pest control allows to use the same methods in perpetuity.