ph, how important is it.

DracoRincewind · May 3, 2009

OK I've been part of a debate recently elsewhere online. It is all about how important ph testing really is. There are currently 3 camps. The first are those that argue ph testing is an absolute 100% must. The second is arguing that it a complete waist of time and money, making no difference on the grow. Then there is my stance in the middle. That it may not be absolutely necessary it can affect the quality of the grow and helps to achieve a better quality harvest.

Now I doubt any of us are experts on the subject so I am choosing to seek the advice of a "neutral" 3rd party. (Or more specifically 4th)

So, Is testing ph really important or not, and why?

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M Blaze · May 3, 2009

When growing for quantity then I think that ph levels dont really matter but for quality it may help. I am only saying that from my personal experience and from what I have seen. My brother has never used a ph meter before and he has no problems at all and he grows huge, heavy plants even bigger than I do. Im not to fussed with ph levels as long as its reasonable then im happy.

I just realised your talking about soil. We use coco if that makes any difference.

Easy does it · May 3, 2009

for me a ph pen is a must, it lets you know how stable the food uptake is in your medium although most experts can tell what their plants need just by looking at them. if your nutes are tried and tested with a few strains and it works for you cool, but really you should test everything going in (and coming out)

FreezerBoy · May 3, 2009

You can grow great weed without ever testing for ph. I did outdoor grows for years without ever testing but, outdoors tends to be self stabilizing. Many that do "no pH" grows are actually doing "heavily controlled ph" grows because they're using soil/substrate formulas designed by others who did measure. It's how they arrived at the formula.

The farther from dirt you get, the more important pH becomes. It's certainly the first thing to check when deficiencies occur.

Stoney Jake · May 3, 2009

M Blaze · May 3, 2009

FreezerBoy said:
You can grow great weed without ever testing for ph. I did outdoor grows for years without ever testing but, outdoors tends to be self stabilizing. Many that do "no pH" grows are actually doing "heavily controlled ph" grows because they're using soil/substrate formulas designed by others who did measure. It's how they arrived at the formula.

The farther from dirt you get, the more important pH becomes. It's certainly the first thing to check when deficiencies occur.

We grow in a full coco blend medium and as I previously mentioned my bro grows huge trees and never tests his PH levels and it never seems to bother his plants. I test my ph but I never really have to adjust it as im always happy with the levels. That may be due to the water supply and nutes we use.

guest 77721 · May 3, 2009

Our cannabis plants are evolved to thrive in natural conditions. If you're growing in a good earth-like soil using organics and tapwater then pH testing isn't needed.

Also most people's tap water is hard, containing minerals Calcium and Magnesium with the pH above 7 which is fine for oganic/soil grows.

By the chart the best range for all nutrients to be taken up is 6.3 to 6.8. What's really worth noting is that all the major nutrients N, P, K and the two minor nutrients that cannabis loves Ca and Mg, are all available from 6.5 to 9.0.

Soil + Organics + Hard Water is fine.

The pH problems start when salt based fertilizers are used which buildup in the soil and pull the pH down near the end of a grow.

Hydro works with a pH of 5.8 which is unnaturally low compared to most peoples tap water. Testing and adjusting pH of the nute solution is the key to hydroponics. Most people's tap water is too hard to do hydroponics well because the minerals buffer the pH and raise it out of range despite adding pH down.

Also take a look at the narrow band that the Hydro has to have the pH in to get P, Mg and Ca.

I would recommend every grower to buy a cheap Aquarium pH test kit for $5 and test their water, nutrient mix and the soil runoff water periodically. It's a tool that can be used to dial your grow in and it's easy to do.

I use the pH as an indicator to see if the plant is taking up nutes and needs feeding or watering in the last few weeks of a grow.

M Blaze · May 3, 2009

Great post Red :smoker:

richirich_99 · May 3, 2009

I use the pH as an indicator to see if the plant is taking up nutes and needs feeding or watering in the last few weeks of a grow.[/QUOTE said:
How do you know by pH of runoff if the plant needs feeding or just water the last few weeks? sorry if this seems like a dumb question lol.

FreezerBoy · May 3, 2009

M Blaze said:
We grow in a full coco blend medium and as I previously mentioned my bro grows huge trees and never tests his PH levels

uhhh ... that's what I said ...

FreezerBoy said:
"no pH" grows are actually doing "heavily controlled ph" grows because they're using soil/substrate formulas designed by others

Coco doesn't grow on trees. It's not a berry you pick off a bush. It's formulated, manufactured towards a specific purpose. Naturally pH stabilizing, it's already in the optimum pH range for weed.

magiccannabus · May 3, 2009

with a fully organic grow, pH is almost totally irrelevant. I never test mine at all. Go to the organics forum and read the "Organics for Beginners" sticky thread, it explains really well how pH is not a factor in organics the way it is in chemical grows. I really don't understand why anyone uses chemicals anymore.....

magiccannabus · May 3, 2009

FreezerBoy said:
Coco doesn't grow on trees

You're kidding right?

nekoloving · May 3, 2009

magiccannabus said:
freezerboy said:

Coco doesn't grow on trees

Click to expand...

You're kidding right?

[SIZE=+2]COIR

[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Coir, obtained from the husk of coconut, Cocos nucifera, is a perrenial palm found in tropical countries. As far back as the 19th century, records indicate that the Philippines, particularly Pangasinan has been producing coir. Coconut husks were soaked in streams for 8-12 months and the fiber extracted manually by pounding them with mallets against slabs of woods. After drying, the fibers were made into ropes or twines for fishing and farming purposes.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The development of the Philippine coir industry started prior to World War II when the National Coconut Corporation, now the Philippine Coconut Authority (PCA), experimented on mechanized coir extraction. Shortly after the war, Martiniano Floro, a manufacturer, developed the first defibering machine and subsequently, established the first defibering plant in Alaminos, Laguna.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Other defibering plants followed in the late '50s up to the '70s. Today, with the establishment of other coir decorticating or processing plants, products of various applications have been developed for both the foreign and domestic markets.[/SIZE]

o:

Solidopc · May 3, 2009

I don't ever ph any of my organic soil feeds. I test the EC and that's it. I have tested the ph of the feed water after adding my organic nutes, and it's around the safe level anyway. But even when i feed it just plain water, i wont ph it in soil, and i never have any problems whatsoever with my plants.

In coco, i ph every feed to 5.8 without fail. Never give my coco plants anything without it being EC'd and PH'd first. It's a total must in hydro. You won't grow anything worth a dam without correct ph in a hydro setup. Organic soil, easy, forget ph, just concentrate on the EC only.

Sleepy · May 4, 2009

great post, red!

Mr.Jones · May 4, 2009

FreezerBoy said:
Coco doesn't grow on trees. It's not a berry you pick off a bush.

i like that :yeahthats

but growing on soil i dont think its necessary to check ph ... never did always worked

on coc im not sure (never used it) but if you have good tap water than after putting in the nutrient solution you should be around 6.0.

for example i have no ph issues at all ... i used to test the ph after mixin my solution and it always turned out to be around 6.3 ... so i lowered it to 5.9 but i guess it wouldnt have mattered anyways.

guest 77721 · May 4, 2009

richirich_99 said:
How do you know by pH of runoff if the plant needs feeding or just water the last few weeks? sorry if this seems like a dumb question lol.

My tap water is about 7.4-7.6 and when I add nutes it ends up around 6.5-6.8 depending on the strength of the nutes. Adding nutes always drops the pH down.

I periodically test my runoff. What I want to see is if the pH is dropping and reads below the nute mixture then that's telling me that there are nutes building up in the soil. Otherwise the pH would be at or above the pH of the nute mixture.

When I see the pH dropping, 6.3 - 6.5, I'll use plain water on the next watering to dilute the nutes and resume normal feeding on the following watering.

If I feel that I've lost control of the pH, lower than 6.3, then I'll flush the soil out with 2x the pot size and give a feeding with 1x the pot size.

I'll repost this good article on PPM and pH again. You don't need a PPM meter to have an idea what's going on in the pot.

kunafoot · May 4, 2009

Draco PH testing is very important when growing. It determines how much nutrients can be taken up by the plant. To make it short the roots have tiny pores that allow nutrients to move threw, when the ph is off the holes shrink up and then wont allow some necesarry nutes to get to the plant. The reason it still grows is because the nutrients that are small enough to get threw the dialated pores is enough to keep it growing but definatly not at its potential rate.
The best way to solve this issue is to do a test. Ph all thw water on one one plant and not on the other I assure the diference will be plainly evident in plant and smoke. Thanks bro I just want you to get your maximum yeald.

guest 77721 · May 4, 2009

Ok there are 3 camps of growers.

1. Growers that are dialed in or lucky

2. Growers that grow crap weed or struggle with minor problems

3. Growers that have disasters

Personally I want to be a #1 grower, not a #2 or a #3. pH testing is one tool in the toolbox to make it to #1.

DracoRincewind said:
OK I've been part of a debate recently elsewhere online. It is all about how important ph testing really is. There are currently 3 camps. The first are those that argue ph testing is an absolute 100% must. The second is arguing that it a complete waist of time and money, making no difference on the grow. Then there is my stance in the middle. That it may not be absolutely necessary it can affect the quality of the grow and helps to achieve a better quality harvest.

DracoRincewind · May 4, 2009

redgreenry said:
Ok there are 3 camps of growers.

1. Growers that are dialed in or lucky

2. Growers that grow crap weed or struggle with minor problems

3. Growers that have disasters

Personally I want to be a #1 grower, not a #2 or a #3. pH testing is one tool in the toolbox to make it to #1.

I want to thank you redgreen(love the avatar). You have supplied some incredibly enlightening information on ph and ppm. These are some great facts I have not found before in my research.

Though I'm afraid to ask which camp I'm in. :biglaugh:

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ph, how important is it.

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