[ballast]

High power Light Emitting Diode technology has improved tremendously in the past few months, in my opinion offering great potential for micro growers. Emitter luminous output and efficiency have near doubled since much of the LED posting around here, and likely will improve even more by the time current units reach the grow light market. Cost is dropping rapidly too. Any other DIY electronic types here building your own setups or considering it? Looking for serious discussion of LED growing, photosynthetic spectrum, optics, wiring, where to buy, etc.

To begin with, why do so many LED grows reportedly fall short of HPS or CFL? Several possible reasons come to mind:

* misunderstanding of lumens, PAR, radiant flux, mcd, etc. how much usable light are plants actually getting? marketing hype may vastly overstate it.

* photosynthetic action spectrum and LED wavelengths - what quality of light are plants getting? it seems that more experimentation is needed in this area for cannabis, including UV and IR effects.

* less efficient older LED's - comparing watts alone hardly tells actual light output.

* cost - grower may tend to use less light than if cost were not a factor.

Much to consider in designing a LED setup; power supply and drivers, what wavelengths and how much of each, thermal management, which manufacturers... anyway I plan to start one soon and welcome any input. LedEngin has high power 660 nm deep reds, apparently hard to find until now. Blue and royal blue K2's and such are widely available, as are whites. I like the idea of running a little white in the mix, since they have a blue peak to help keep internodes short in flower and also have a wide band elsewhere to cover accessory pigments' possible needs:

https://icmag.com/ic/album.php?albumi...pictureid=1044


Eye safety... most blue and white high power emitters come with a warning, but worth repeating here: do not stare directly into them... 'nuf said.

Going with almost all blue and royal blue for veg, not sure yet what ratio of blue to red and deep red for flower. And does UV really make a worthwhile difference in resin production? High power 400 nm are available cheap now, but somewhere I read that 320 nm UVB is what supposedly counts. Open to suggestions

[guanito]

Hi Ballast
Is that Kelvin scale along the bottom of that graph?
how come it's in hundredths, and not thousanths?
It says strongest part of the spectrum ia about 450? (should be 4500k?)
It would be nice to add a panel to my flower chamber in addition to the 150hps.
Perhaps can be mounted on a side wall? Can they stand a little misting, or need to be keep absolutely dry?
Perhaps can be covered w/2 mil clear polyvinyl to keep dry?
I think you (I) need to keep at least a 150hps going in there as well.
I don't know of anyone who's done a LED alone grow.
cheers!

[sonnyblanko]

Hi Ballast,

I have been manufacturing the 90W UFO grow lights, I bought one of the first generation LED UFOs and it was junk, I spent a lot of money on the unit and had it tested and the manufacturer was using regular LED lights, what a joke. So I played around with it until I decided to take my research into production. I am currently using High Output 660nm Reds and 430nm Blues. I am also thinking about adding the Orange Spectrum for a test run. I am willing to give everyone who wants the LED UFO Grow Light using the nm stated above at wholesale pricing, for those who are intrigued and wanted to play around with LED grows, this way it's not a hard hit in the pocket.

Hope this help.
Mike

[TheShroomDude]

How much is wholesale?

[ballast]

high guys, thanks for dropping in

guanito: thats wavelength in nanometers on the graph, not color temperature. Just another way of expressing lamp spectrum. I think you're right that most of the LED light systems on the market just arent ready for prime time, yet recent advances in LED parts themselves is amazing and its surely only a matter of time. in supplementing HPS you would want some blue LED, since HPS has plenty of red. High power LED emitters should be protected from moisture, but with the regular 5-10 mm types in these panel arrays it should not be so critical; not having used them i couldnt say, but would protect them unless the panel maker says otherwise. I have read that side-mounted blue light does wonders for keeping plants from stretching up into the main lights so much, if you try it let us know how it goes

sonnyblanko: awesome man, what size emitters are you using? orange is an interesting idea, since HPS have so much orange outside of chlorophyl's absorption range yet plants thrive on them. thats what i love about LED it lets you be in complete control of the spectrum! well only limited by what colors are available, 470's and 455's are everywhere but where did you find 430? hope your project turns out well, that will be a boon to the many who want to try the new LED tech but lack electronic skills. how soon do you expect them to be ready? my bets are we shall see some test grows at least matching HID soon

Good luck.

[FoothillsFarmer]

I've gotta follow this thread, LEDs have been on my mind for some time...

[Weezard]

Originally Posted by FoothillsFarmer

I've gotta follow this thread, LEDs have been on my mind for some time...

No worry, brah.
LEDs don't weigh much.:smile:

From- Treasure Island.
Sawbones: "You mean you've been carrying that bullet around in your neck for nine years?!"
Long John Silver: "Shore! Bullet don't weigh nothin'".

Just thought I'd hop in and introduce myself.
I'm the wee, tiny, 'zard from da Islands.
Got my third generation under LEDs and they're makin' me proud.
You can see some of the lights I use in my photo album.
Been growin', off and on, since 1968.
Startin' to get the hang of it now.
I speak solder and won't hesitate to offer advice on construction.

Howzit?

Weezard

[Weezard]

Originally Posted by ballast

High power Light Emitting Diode technology has improved tremendously in the past few months, in my opinion offering great potential for micro growers. Emitter luminous output and efficiency have near doubled since much of the LED posting around here, and likely will improve even more by the time current units reach the grow light market. Cost is dropping rapidly too. Any other DIY electronic types here building your own setups or considering it? Looking for serious discussion of LED growing, photosynthetic spectrum, optics, wiring, where to buy, etc.

To begin with, why do so many LED grows reportedly fall short of HPS or CFL? Several possible reasons come to mind:

* misunderstanding of lumens, PAR, radiant flux, mcd, etc. how much usable light are plants actually getting? marketing hype may vastly overstate it.

* photosynthetic action spectrum and LED wavelengths - what quality of light are plants getting? it seems that more experimentation is needed in this area for cannabis, including UV and IR effects.

* less efficient older LED's - comparing watts alone hardly tells actual light output.

* cost - grower may tend to use less light than if cost were not a factor.

Much to consider in designing a LED setup; power supply and drivers, what wavelengths and how much of each, thermal management, which manufacturers... anyway I plan to start one soon and welcome any input. LedEngin has high power 660 nm deep reds, apparently hard to find until now. Blue and royal blue K2's and such are widely available, as are whites. I like the idea of running a little white in the mix, since they have a blue peak to help keep internodes short in flower and also have a wide band elsewhere to cover accessory pigments' possible needs:

https://icmag.com/ic/album.php?albumi...pictureid=1044


Eye safety... most blue and white high power emitters come with a warning, but worth repeating here: do not stare directly into them... 'nuf said.

Going with almost all blue and royal blue for veg, not sure yet what ratio of blue to red and deep red for flower. And does UV really make a worthwhile difference in resin production? High power 400 nm are available cheap now, but somewhere I read that 320 nm UVB is what supposedly counts. Open to suggestions

I think we're going to get along!
I has a soldering iron too.

Don't put too much stock in what you read about 320 nm UVB.
It counts for very little.

If you can afford pricy LEDs you'll get more return fooling around with Far Red 730 nm. to help reset the phytochrome ratio FR:R and trick your girls into flowering with extended light and shorter dark periods.
I'm sure by now, you've read about the "Martian Method"
and I highly recommend any posts by Salmayo or Rauber
on "Artificial Darkness".
Those two are on to something.
They talk over my head alla time.

I'm just a simple 'zard and get by with 4. 660nm 12W Ledengins and 1. 15W Royal Blue for Bloom.
And 7:3 R:B for veg.
Recently added a single CFL just to cover all spectral bases.
Have just about got it dialed-in, now.
My yeild matches a 400W HPS with only 45W. of LEDs

Let me know if I can help.

Regards,
Weezard

[CLDBD]

I have 8 of the 3pod grow bars. I had another set of 4 that were from a different company. They did not grow worth a shit. I was new at growing then and that is why I have not completely given up on them. At the time I could not afford to waste any more time so I switched to HID. I then played with cfl and now use a mix. Might try the led bars again when I get a new house with more room. I paid a ton for these lights so I better try them sometime. I have a pic from my cell phone here.