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Why the price of pot matters to us all: How to improveCuomo's legalizationWHATSAYYOU?

Tudo

Troublemaker
Moderator
ICMag Donor
Veteran
The way some think in NY What say you?


Why the price of pot matters to us all: How to improve on Cuomo's legalization framework
New York residents who currently spend a lot on illicit marijuana may understandably be curious what the drug will cost if Gov. Cuomo’s legalization plan is enacted. Policymakers, health professionals and the rest of the general public should care about this question as well.
Marijuana prohibition creates illegal markets in which simple plant-based products sell for as much as precious metals. But when the recreational marijuana industry becomes legal, the price of weed rapidly falls to that of, well, a weed. Some decline in marijuana’s price is inevitable and positive, to the extent that it weakens black markets and draws customers into the legal, regulated, market.


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But marijuana legalization states like Colorado, Washington and Oregon are well beyond that sweet spot: Prices are down 50-90% with no bottom in sight. This poses two challenges that New Yorkers should carefully consider.


First: Taxes based on the price of the plant (Cuomo is proposing 20%) stop bringing in significant revenue when prices collapse. Twenty percent of all $400-per-ounce marijuana sales is a lot of money, but 20% of all the $10-per-ounce marijuana sales may not even cover the costs of regulating the industry, much less fund investments in communities that have been historically harmed by marijuana policy.
Like California’s marijuana tax system, Cuomo’s proposal offers some protection against tax revenue collapse by also having an additional flat weight-based tax on cannabis flower ($1 per ounce). That’s clever, although the state may still find that it has to shift to an entirely weight-based tax, as Maine recently did, to make sure that legalization remains net revenue positive.
Second, like any other commodity, consumption of drugs is price-sensitive, particularly in populations that have little disposable income (e.g., teenagers). If it becomes extremely cheap to be intoxicated all day, more people will do just that, creating costs for themselves and for taxpayers (e.g., more traffic accidents, school dropouts). This is particularly concerning because Cuomo has not proposed a cap on the drug’s potency. The experience of Washington’s market shows that the average legal marijuana product is 20% THC, more than quadruple the average potency of marijuana 20 years ago.
Another way to keep marijuana prices off the floor is to prevent the industry from being vertically integrated. This was the approach taken with alcohol after Prohibition, when regulators split the industry into producers, distributors and retailers, with strictly separated owners. Cuomo proposed this corporate structure to allow small businesses a chance to thrive in the new industry, but it should also serve to make the distribution chain less efficient and thereby reduce the decline in marijuana prices.
To a 25-year-old who currently spends $1,000 a year on a daily marijuana habit and simply wants the drug to be as cheap as possible, this may all seem like hand-wringing. But heavy use of marijuana, like all intoxicants, can impose harms that society pays for, giving the government an interest in maintaining higher prices to reduce heavy consumption and raise tax revenue. When that same 25-year-old is 45 and has a house full of teenagers, this will seem more obvious than it does right now.






Cuomo’s legalization proposal shows more awareness than those of other states of the risks of marijuana price collapse and how rock-bottom prices could expand heavy use and starve tax revenues. The governor and his policy adviser deserve credit for that, but the Legislature can improve on his proposals by shifting to a weight-based tax and also either capping marijuana’s potency outright or subjecting the highest-strength products to an additional tax surcharge.


Humphreys is a professor of psychiatry and addiction research at Stanford University.
https://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/ny-oped-why-the-price-of-pot-matters-to-us-all-20190118-story.html
 

dddaver

Active member
Veteran
The last paragraph in that article says Cuomo's plan shows "awareness". The only awareness I see is that his no grow policy shows a huge $300 million money grab for him. Of that, he's KEENLY aware.
 

DoubleTripleOG

Chemdog & Kush Lover Extraordinaire
ICMag Donor
The last paragraph in that article says Cuomo's plan shows "awareness". The only awareness I see is that his no grow policy shows a huge $300 million money grab for him. Of that, he's KEENLY aware.

Supposedly home growing will be allowed if you have medical. With pain being an acceptable reason for a med card. I see an sudden influx of people getting med cards. Which we all know where a lot of the money involved in getting med card will go(to the state) . The way it seems to be set up, is to have the state making as much money possible at every step of the way to the consumers hand.
 

Chunkypigs

passing the gas
Veteran
The growers tax is $1 per gram, not $1 per ounce as mentioned in article.
No way the medical homegrown makes it to the final bill.
 

CrescentFresh

New member
in 2012 in California - a (Medical) dispensary had $50 eighths

and in 2019 a (Recreational) dispensary has $50 eighths

I get that the State is taking a bigger bite in tax prices --

but..shouldnt 2019 prices be way way lower? Given that the cost per unit in 2012 was ~$2600 and the price per unit in 2019 is ~$1600?


is there truly no price fixing involved?
 

igrowone

Well-known member
Veteran
we who live in NY would love better
but it's NY, got its own rules
and it's rule from the top, which can suck
however, Cuomo may not get his plan as is
we're watching the process and maybe get something better
still, legal retail is better than nothing, small home grows will move further down the priority list
 

soil margin

Active member
Veteran
in 2012 in California - a (Medical) dispensary had $50 eighths

and in 2019 a (Recreational) dispensary has $50 eighths

I get that the State is taking a bigger bite in tax prices --

but..shouldnt 2019 prices be way way lower? Given that the cost per unit in 2012 was ~$2600 and the price per unit in 2019 is ~$1600?


is there truly no price fixing involved?

I would actually say it's worse than this because in 2008-2012 era I could get an eighth of really good weed from a medical dispensary for $50. In 2019 I can go to several different recreational dispensaries near where I live and you can barely get even half decent eighths for $50. A good eighth at a dispensary now is like $65-70.
 

Tudo

Troublemaker
Moderator
ICMag Donor
Veteran
Cuomo is a scumbag. What's that saying that comes to mind...."an enemy of my enemy is my something...........or a friend of my friend is my friend?
 

geneva_sativa

Well-known member
Cuomo is a scumbag. What's that saying that comes to mind...."an enemy of my enemy is my something...........or a friend of my friend is my friend?


that's not the quote,,, here I found it

" a piece of shit is a piece of shit,,, stop standing there gawking, thinking that it's a magical wish granting genie,,,flush the toilet "


~ from Lady Eleanor's Guide to Effervescence and Common Sense Housewifery
 
honestly, any legislation that doesnt let monsanto take over would be nice, they should implement a plant cap and a flat fee maybe. Limit number of Grow houses or limit number of Dispensaries for sure. have a stay away from school zone in footage part, No advertising meant or seemingly directed towards kids either or thatll revoke a license. and do a plant cap per household as well, with a medical extension if need be to slow the growth of under ground grows like what we do, but personally my plants are like my gun right, come and take it. over all there is no medium happy solution without a dumbed down approach. a Percentage Sales tax on sales from dispensaries would probably be the best route, at 15%,A "Sin Tax"
 

Sunshineinabag

Active member
Not impressed yet, it's too easy for legislation to baffle folks with Bullchit. A buddy across the lake was complaining about VT ...........when I went to visit there were more NY plates in VT then there were VT plates. This article was kinda unappealing to me personally. Obviously gotta keep doing what I've always been doing. Having property in both states makes this process interesting. Which property will I spend most time at lolololoo
 

Maximus50

New member
Living in NY it’s one of the most regulated, most taxed and least personal liberties state in the country. Even when Medical marijuana became accessible, a patient couldn’t smoke or grow it. Only pills and oils were dispensed. Only in NY. I’m an upstate resident and I love this state for all the beauty of the lakes and rivers and Adirondack mountains but as in every move the politicians make in this state it puts a burden on the regular middle class worker. Legalization is coming to NY but I’m sure they will make it a clusterf$&@ like everything else the govt. touches.
 

Sunshineinabag

Active member
agreed! May as well keep doing what we have always been doing! Leaglization is the yuppies excuse to make money off cannabis!
 

EvergreenState

Active member
A state's only real concerns are: How much money can we make off of this and how can we get complete control over it so we can see where all the money is going and insure we always take our cut? There is no concern over what the people want. NONE! The citizens of a state do not matter at all. The state is only concerned with the state.
For the state to claim any other concerns are lies. Claims to be concerned about the citizens are distractions to make you think it cares about the people. Don't believe it!
I found it funny that the article is claiming that the state should be worried about citizens health if the price of marijuana drops too low. :jerkit: The only concern the state has about marijuana prices is to try to keep them as high as possible so they generate more tax revenue for the state.
Keep your eye on the ball. The state's ONLY concern is generating as much revenue for the state as possible. Any state that doesn't allow home growing is robbing it's citizens of it's rights. Don't ever forget that.
No one should ever be concerned about the marijuana " INDUSTRY". You shouldn't be concerned if big growers or stores are successful. If the state would stay out of it, a guy could rent or buy a thousand square foot space, grow in about 700 SF of that space and sell his wares in a small 300SF store front.
The state would never allow that. The state will sell licenses to big time producers and eventually end up with monopoly owned stores. The state of Oregon is having that very scenario play out.The state was passing out grower and store licenses willy nilly, this is a government that was supposed to REGULATE the INDUSTRY and before you knew it there was way too much pot being produced. The stores couldn't sell all of the WAY over production of pot, prices fell, the stores had to get rid of it a greatly reduced prices and then they couldn't survive. Eventually selling out to big corporate store chains.
People who had been in the black market for decades invested everything in the new legal market. Bought or rented spaces, invested heavily in making beautiful stores and then lost it all because the state grossly mismanaged it's redponsibility or regulating the industry. Now it's going to end up with a few giant growers and a few monopoly store chains. Coming to a state near you!
All of the little stores are being bought up by the big sharks. It's much easier for a state to control and heavily tax a few extremely large producers and corporate owned stores! It almost makes you think it was planned that way all along doesn't it?
Why would the state pass out so many licenses, to so many large growers, when they knew they had the capacity to produce far more than the state's citizens would ever consume? Why did they pass out so many store licenses when they knew the market could never support that many stores? Makes you wonder doesn't it? So all of the mom and pop stores, where the people lost their life savings, too bad for you.
The people should be allowed to grow and if they want sell the extra they grow, they should be allowed. We've been so brainwashed over the years to think it's normal for the state to control and regulate everything. We don't need the damn state controlling everything. We need our freedom back.
New York however is the most highly regulated state in our country. Sorry residents of New York but you're gonna get fucked on this one Big time! And there won't be a damn thing you can do about it. You allowed your state to get way out of control a long time ago and now it's too late. Remember, the state will want to keep prices high.:shark: We all know that is what people want right? We just love to pay high prices. Especially if we could grow it ourselves for about 25 cents a gram but we'd much rather pay $30 a gram.
 

Mr.Poison1

Outdoor Specialist
Veteran
We all know that is what people want right? We just love to pay high prices. Especially if we could grow it ourselves for about 25 cents a gram but we'd much rather pay $30 a gram.

I agree with the other words you said but this sounds wrong.

We dont love to pay high prices the only thing what sounds good is to pay high price for extraordinary "Dank Qualtity" and not paying so much for medium quality were you get in evry town.:tiphat:

High prices are not good for the community if you want a mass adoption in your continent stop the black market with weak canabis and start with a "minimum standard" that is better than old market.
 

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