Need help with Guerrilla mixture....

Going guerrilla, planting auto's mostly. Using a 8" gas powered auger to dig holes that will hold approximately 5 gallons of soil/mix. Want to use primarily native soil, live in Midwest and soil is good but fairly alkaline due to sedimentary composition.

I have available:

Alfalfa Meal or Pellets
Typical NPK analysis 2-1-2
Release time 1-4 months

Soybean Meal
Typical NPK analysis 7-2-1
Release time 1-4 months

Rabbit Manure
N- 2.4 P- 1.4 K- .60

Bone Meal
Typical NPK analysis 3-15-0
Release time 1–4 months

Blood Meal
Typical NPK analysis 12-0-0
Release time 1–4 months

Dia Earth

Garden-tone®
3-4-4
GUARANTEED ANALYSIS
The Espoma Company • 6 Espoma Road, Millville, NJ 08332
Total Nitrogen . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3.0%
0.2%. . . . Ammoniacal Nitrogen
0.6%. . . . Water Soluble Nitrogen
2.2%. . . . Water Insoluble Nitrogen
Available Phosphate (P2O5) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4.0%
Soluble Potash (K2O). . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4.0%
Calcium (Ca) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5.0%
Magnesium (Mg). . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1.0%
0.7%. . . . Water Soluble Magnesium
Sulfur (S). . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2.0%
Derived from: Hydrolyzed Feather Meal, Pasteurized Poultry
Manure, Bone Meal, Alfalfa Meal, Greensand, Humates,
Sulfate of Potash, and Sulfate of Potash Magnesia.
*Contains 2.2% Slow Release Nitrogen.
ALSO CONTAINS NON PLANT FOOD INGREDIENTS:
Contains 624 colony forming units (CFU’s) per gram of the
following species:
Bacillus licheniformis . . . . . . . . . . . . 208 CFU’s per gram
Bacillus megaterium. . . . . . . . . . . . . 208 CFU’s per gram
Bacillus pumilus . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 208 CFU’s per gram

Free City Compost (made mostly from lawn/leaf clippings collected by city)
Nutrients unknown....

What I would like to do is mix these ingredients together outside a week or two before holes are dug, maybe adding some water to give it a moist composition and allow microbial activity to start. I have a vegetable garden that is mostly organic, I was thinking about adding a bit of garden soil to the mix to introduce micro-organisims and such. I could turn it daily or every other day. So I would appreciate someone with experience with organics to recommend a part/part recipe using these ingredients. Then when holes are dug I would like to be able to just measure X amount and add it to each hole.

I dont know what would be appropriate for 5 gallon holes, but I was thinking 2 cups might be enough to last from planting to harvest?

Im considering adding peat to the holes also, probably 1-2 gallon / hole plus nutrient mixture.

I also have water crystals and was considering adding some but I would like to be able to reuse these holes and not sure how bad the crystals are for the soil as they break down, after a few years.

Thanks for all your help and advice, Go Green in 2015!!!

You have everything you need there, but you will still need to feed midway through the season.

1/2 cup alfalfa
1/2 cup soybean meal
1/2 cup bone meal
no blood meal
2 cups garden
I would top dress the rabbit manure, and let the rain soak it into the ground over the season. It may also help keep some animals from digging up your plants. Spread a quart or so around each plant.

You said you are growing auto's but how long from start to finish are they going to run? Some say 60 days, and some say 110. That will help you decide what you need to do later in the season.

Don't use the City compost unless you love concentrated toxic chemicals.

If you can get a hold of some kelp meal I would mix in a cup when you plant, and add a cup later in the season.

The autos Im running should go around 80 days. I hadnt thought about the chemicals in the city compost, but that makes sense. Better safe than sorry! They should get 3-4 ft tall and yield 2-4oz each, so not big plants, but can make up for that with quantity I guess

You will want to top dress around 40 days in. Some kelp, fresh compost, alfalfa, and a little garden tone will do it.

Look into team microbe's threads.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=296052 - soil mixes and teas are located here

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=286301 - this is his guerrilla thread I’d recommend checking it out.

Hope this helps you out a little bit

DJbigbud said:

Going guerrilla, planting auto's mostly. Using a 8" gas powered auger to dig holes that will hold approximately 5 gallons of soil/mix. Want to use primarily native soil, live in Midwest and soil is good but fairly alkaline due to sedimentary composition.

I have available:

Alfalfa Meal or Pellets
Typical NPK analysis 2-1-2
Release time 1-4 months

Soybean Meal
Typical NPK analysis 7-2-1
Release time 1-4 months

Rabbit Manure
N- 2.4 P- 1.4 K- .60

Bone Meal
Typical NPK analysis 3-15-0
Release time 1–4 months

Blood Meal
Typical NPK analysis 12-0-0
Release time 1–4 months

Dia Earth

Garden-tone®
3-4-4
GUARANTEED ANALYSIS
The Espoma Company • 6 Espoma Road, Millville, NJ 08332
Total Nitrogen . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3.0%
0.2%. . . . Ammoniacal Nitrogen
0.6%. . . . Water Soluble Nitrogen
2.2%. . . . Water Insoluble Nitrogen
Available Phosphate (P2O5) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4.0%
Soluble Potash (K2O). . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4.0%
Calcium (Ca) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5.0%
Magnesium (Mg). . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1.0%
0.7%. . . . Water Soluble Magnesium
Sulfur (S). . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2.0%
Derived from: Hydrolyzed Feather Meal, Pasteurized Poultry
Manure, Bone Meal, Alfalfa Meal, Greensand, Humates,
Sulfate of Potash, and Sulfate of Potash Magnesia.
*Contains 2.2% Slow Release Nitrogen.
ALSO CONTAINS NON PLANT FOOD INGREDIENTS:
Contains 624 colony forming units (CFU’s) per gram of the
following species:
Bacillus licheniformis . . . . . . . . . . . . 208 CFU’s per gram
Bacillus megaterium. . . . . . . . . . . . . 208 CFU’s per gram
Bacillus pumilus . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 208 CFU’s per gram

Free City Compost (made mostly from lawn/leaf clippings collected by city)
Nutrients unknown....

What I would like to do is mix these ingredients together outside a week or two before holes are dug, maybe adding some water to give it a moist composition and allow microbial activity to start. I have a vegetable garden that is mostly organic, I was thinking about adding a bit of garden soil to the mix to introduce micro-organisims and such. I could turn it daily or every other day. So I would appreciate someone with experience with organics to recommend a part/part recipe using these ingredients. Then when holes are dug I would like to be able to just measure X amount and add it to each hole.

I dont know what would be appropriate for 5 gallon holes, but I was thinking 2 cups might be enough to last from planting to harvest?

Im considering adding peat to the holes also, probably 1-2 gallon / hole plus nutrient mixture.

I also have water crystals and was considering adding some but I would like to be able to reuse these holes and not sure how bad the crystals are for the soil as they break down, after a few years.

Thanks for all your help and advice, Go Green in 2015!!!

Click to expand...

i agree with that first response saying u pretty much have what u need, BUT BUT BUT there's not much listed there for K…the bone meal will take care of the P in flower, but u need about as much K as u do that…i'd suggest adding in some wood ash, top dressing every so many weeks…

also, with the bone meal, i'd almost recommend adding that as a top layer closer towards flowering…unless ur transplanting them into these holes as they're beginning to flower…or at the very least, mix it sparingly for veg, then add as a top dressing closer to flower…

but it definitely looks like u need some wood ash, or other strong source of K for this mix...

Better dig way ahead of time with all the animal by product in there. Let the animals dig it up a second time for you before you plant. That, or you could select ingredients that aren't animal attractants.

If you use polymer water crystals, be sure to go light/spread them out.

Good luck!

In the interest of ease of carrying things in, I'd just go with the Espoma. It's got most of the other ingredients in it. It's 3-4-4. Then in bloom, you can topdress with another, low N, formula. Espoma's formulae are proven, been used for years by organic gardeners. Make it easy on yourself. Depending on how much you need, you may be able to get enough organic matter onsite. Look around.

I'm inexperienced with Autos, but reading this post, I realized that the 80 or so days allows you to avoid the long Summer, extreme heat, drought, and gives you a much shorter exposure time for confiscation and rips. Most with ill intent probably don't even start looking for guerilla crops till late Summer. You're already out of there by then. Puts your product into the market way earlier than the fall produce.

I would go with bigger holes, like 10 gal, and mix nutes a month before so the plants can hit the ground running. Good luck. -granger

I'd use photos suggestion but switch kelp out for bonemeal. In my experience plants are very good at up taking p and adding more to epsoma can cause problems. I wouldn't be to concerned with water crystals, I've found them still working my holes 3 years later.
Ps I've used all those amendments in various mixes for years before coming to these conclusions

Thanks for all the suggestions guys!

Couple questions, if I was just going to use JUST espoma, how many cups/hole would you suggest?

I really dont want to have to order anything via mail so kelp isnt going to happen. Is there something easier to find in central states that would work as a replacement?

Im planning to dig/mix the holes about 2 weeks before planting, so that should give the animals time to explore. Also I would like to mix the ingredients ahead of time at the correct ratio and then just use a fixed measurement of fertilizer per hole at digging time.

According to Photo's suggestion, it would be about 3 cups of mix / hole? Does that sound about right for 5 gallons of soil?

The holes will be 8" diameter and about 2 feet deep, so the roots should be able to search for moisture fairly easily, not sure if water crystals would be necessary in this situation or not. Live in a typical midwest state, can get dry, but not at all dessert conditions and will be planting where native vegetation seems to thrive.

I can source the meals MUCH cheaper than Espoma pre-mix so I would like to incorporate them if possible. 50lbs of alfalfa is about $10 bucks, soybean is just $13, etc.

Wood ash is easy to get, but Im a little worried about making my mixture too alkaline. Already the soil around here is usually around 8ph. Im hoping the addition of some peat will bring that down a little.

wood ash can be added at any time and watered in..highly soluable

I should have mentioned but I forgot, Ive got a 35gal trash can FULL of coffee grounds that the local starbucks was nice enough to provide me with from last summer. They are a little moldy, but should be good to incorporate into the mix also I think....

Those coffee grounds should drop your ph significantly. I would get them in the mix as soon as you can though since you dont want them decomposing still when your plants are in the ground. They are N heavy so take that into account.

im thinking of doing the same thing this year autos and all
... Midwest sun does great for me

I found this post related to Espoma Garden Tone product in a different thread. Some are recommending 2 cups of fert per 5 gallons soil, but this makes it sound like that would be way too much.... Any opinions on this?
-----------------------
I've found 2 tbs per gallon to be about perfect, in combination with 2 tbs per gallon of high p guano. No other nutes. When I added 1 tbs per gallon of alfalfa meal to that, they burned a little. I started with 1/4 cup per gallon of the Plant Tone and worked down from there. 1/4 cup per gallon burnt the shit out of them.

I'd go on the lower end. You can always top dress later if needed. Good luck. -granger

Nice man!!

I've always wanted to run an outdoor auto grow, they seem a lot stealthier than mature plant patches and I like how they can be harvested before heli's start flying later in the season. Anyways, you can keep it simple and go with Espoma ferts in your native soil... but you risk the chance of that soil not being balanced since there may be some NPK in it. I've added Espoma to bales of grower mix (peat moss, perlite, lime, wetting agent) with great success, but this was already pH balanced and ready to go. Native soil is not always like this, so a quick and easy soil test would be of best interest to know exactly what you need to do to that soil to balance it out.

I use www.loganlabs.com - their standard soil test is only $20 and you get results back within a week. From there you can see exactly how much of each amendment you need to add to each 5 gallon hole. THEN, you can save money by making your own Espoma-style nutrient kit customized to your native soil. Just take a measuring cup out with you after you mix it all up and drop however much you need into each hole a month before planting. Anytime I find good native soil I send it samples to see how good it really is, and some places only need a little N or K added and it's off to the races.

As far as soil goes, it's best to work with your scenario as best as possible (for example, in dry climates use vermiculite instead of perlite to help retain moisture). I add equal parts peat moss, aeration, and compost to my outdoor holes. This year I'll do 1 bale of peat, 4 cubic ft rice hull, 4 cubic ft compost per hole along with a nutrient kit added in there. This is what I use



As far as your ingredients go -

If using the Espoma, then nothing else is necessary for the most part. That nutrient kit is balanced and proven over the years to work, so don't do anything to it! Balance is everything in soil, not quantity.

Top dress with the rabbit manure, that'll feed nitrogen to your top layer very nicely during veg. I'd top dress only once with this, unless plants begin to yellow for some reason before hitting flower. The city compost is unreliable unfortunately, because what do people have in their lawns? Dog poop, cig butts, and a lot of random contaminant. All of that goes into the city compost when they break down the leaf bags in the fall, so this stuff usually does more harm than good in the garden. Avoid that shit like the plague. The blood meal is a dirty source for nitrogen compared to alfalfa meal, so I would toss the blood meal to the side this year. Bone meal is considered dirty as well, and is also unnecessary since we've got the Espoma. Soybean meal contains GMO's because of how it's cultivated, so avoid this stuff if possible. You can have a more than epic year with the Espoma in your soil mix, the rabbit poop as a top dressing, and considering how the plants look in late summer - a mid-flowering top dress with Espoma's flower tone or any other dressing that's rich in P & K.





If I were you I would do this....

1. Go out to your patch and collect enough soil samples (a little bit from each hole) to make 2 cups of soil. If doing a lot of holes, collect a little from each hole, mix together well, then select 2 cups worth from that mixture for the most accurate results.

2. If test results are favoring, use 100% native soil and amend with your custom-made nutrient kit using the test results as your guide. DM me if you have any questions at all with this process.

3. If results aren't favoring, I would dig your holes, discard of the dirt afterwards, and fill them all with:

1 pt. peat moss
1 pt. aeration material (rice hulls, pumice, perlite, lava rock)
1 pt. compost (if you can get enough fully composted rabbit manure, I would use that)

I'd lay a tarp down, add 2 gallons each peat/aeration/compost (as well as the Espoma kit), mix, then fill the empty hole. Take whatever the back of the Espoma bag recommends you add, and cut it in half when mixing it into the soil. I've done this with great success, it seems to be the perfect amount for cannabis. If plants fade then simply sprinkle a small handful of it on top before flowering hits. It's easy to add more, but it's impossible to take it out once added so proceed with caution here... less is always more.

These were grown with the Espoma soil mix I just recommended to you:

Epsoma and Jamaican bat guano baby!also the alfal meal wont hurt.also im doing 1 table spoon flower tone and one table spoon garden tone.

team microbe getting ya dialed if your ears are open