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Old 12-07-2018, 01:30 PM #1
Veggia farmer
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Can hermie trait reverse?

As the title says: can hermie trait reverse?

I have earlier seen beatifull seed plants get hermie traits when revegged. But is it possible to reverse it?

Im revegging a really nice OG kush from HSO but I saw hermie traits in the males when making a seed run. So its possible that this hopefully future mother can hermie on me now. I have seed from her so not crisis, but she is is really nice!


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Old 12-07-2018, 02:26 PM #2
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Quite a few lines are more prone to stress when grown from seed than if you took clones from the same plants and flowered them.. personally i think its to do with seeds having a tap root which clones dont have so they are more likely to stress over root binding

Ogs can get stressy and damn cookie lines do a lot..
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Old 12-07-2018, 02:45 PM #3
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If either of the parent plants carry the trait for hermaphrodism it *can* be passed to the offspring. Different strains are more prone to triggering hermaphrodism for different reasons ie: Some tolerate heat, others hermie from it, some plants are really sensitive to dark period being disturbed (light leaks/pollution) and going hermie, while others can dont seem to care.

Try to remember/avoid whatever the cause was for the males turning hermie and it shouldnt trigger it again in the offspring. Unless its happening naturally from genetics without stress, which youll have to wait to find out...Ethephon can be applied foliarly to suppress the generation of male hormones in flowering plants, forcing them female. If you spray it on a flowering female plant that has started going hermaphrodite the pollen sacks should dry up and fall off.

Ethephon can be used to make male plants express as female plants also (in apperance/sexual expression only, it is still an XY plant). You can apply Ethephon to a clone from a male plant and then flower it to see the bud/flower traits it *can* pass on when used in a cross.

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Old 12-09-2018, 11:51 AM #4
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Smile yes

You can reverse hermie trait by using regular male pollen, during the vegetative female pre-bloom stage. I've been doing it for years. In late vegetative stage you see single flowers at the nodes of all females. When you pollinate these pre flowers only with true reg. pollen, the female becomes stable and will not revert back to hermie trait. This method can keep your garden hermie free until harvest. At the end of the harvest you will only get about 12 or 15 seeds off the whole plant!

However the very few seeds you get, can be a little unstable and will need reg. male pollen too!
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Old 12-09-2018, 12:57 PM #5
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^over generalization please ignore. Hermaphroditism is genetic inheritance from ancestors, Some landraces are immune to reversing according to Sam_skunkman. Whether you use a Male or reversed female, the pollen donor's sexual designation (XY or XX) wont affect the potential for hermie offspring. This is a good example of why you stress test clones before using a plant to breed with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam_Skunkman View Post
We found that any female clones that can not be stressed to express intersex flowers are unlikely to produce progeny that express intersex flowers. I am not referring to STS as a stress, it alters sex expression temporarily, it does not alter the genes.

We also found that using a Thai female clone that does express intersex flowers even without stress, when we used the pollen from the intersex flowers, they also produced all females and almost all were expressing intersex flowers, not surprising as like begets like.

We also found that a selfed single plant will lose vigor as it is inbred, each generation is worse and by S3 or S4 the plant will have serious problems like being functionally sterile, the pollen does not dehiscence it is just to sticky and while viable it must be collected with a Q-tip or another way to be used for pollination.

You can easily avoid the inbreeding by using two different varieties, one as the transformed pollen source and one the clone to be pollinated.
-SamS
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Originally Posted by Natural high View Post
Hi Sam. Are you talking about regular/feminised breeding here or selfing? Selfing can expose recessive genes which would otherwise stay hidden even under stress..
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Originally Posted by Sam_Skunkman View Post
I was talking about both, selfing and using transformed females to male for pollen to use on a completely different female variety. I did not see intersex problems with selfing a single plant or making S4 from a single plant line, the S4 were all screwed up from inbreeding and loss of vigor and resistance but we did not see intersex problems. As long as the females used were not found to express intersex if tested with all kinds of stress.
-SamS
Does A Male Or Female Pass On More Genetics To Their Offspring?: From February 2018

Link To Thread:
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=350271

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Originally Posted by VenturaHwy View Post
White Fire is a famous cross. Fire Og female x (reversed female) The White. Would it be the same if the other way around? It would be a great test. Natural males are an unknown factor (crap shoot) since they don't grow buds.
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Originally Posted by oldbootz View Post
One way to test this is to take 2 stable but non related varieties (A and B). Take 2 clones off one female plant from one variety (A) and 2 clones off of another female from the other variety (B). Take 1 clone from each variety and reverse them onto the other variety (A-reversed x B, B-reversed x A). This way we will find out of there is some natural process that is different when DNA is donated via pollen or in the calyx.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Natural high View Post
It makes absolutely no difference which parent in a cross is male and which is female. The genetic potential of the offspring is the same either way. The only practical difference is the resultant seed size may vary depending on which parent is the female, and this is due to the size of the calyx on the female.

The phenotypes seen in the offspring from any cross or pollination are the result of the dominant alleles inherited from each parent.


Hope this helps.
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Originally Posted by Natural high View Post
I've done the double reverse and there was no difference in the offspring phenotypes as expected. The one difference was that seed size from the cross was different due to the maternal parents having considerably different sized calyx.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam_Skunkman View Post
you can cross two female or cross two males by transforming one to the opposite sex, a transformed female clone to male will express pollen but it is still genetically a female, the same with males they can be transformed to female to make seeds.

Transforming males to a female will also allowing smoking of the male transformed to female expression or lab testing of the cannabinoids and terpenes they can contribute to progeny.

Regardless if the female is Haze or Skunk the f1 hybrids express the same general terpene and Cannabinoids, I have made hundreds and tested them.

There may be sex linked traits but this has not been proven in Cannabis.


Intersexed plants can be male or female. Males that are intersex can make seeds on themselves or on nearby plants.

One last point is plants do not just turn intersex because they have not been pollinated, they are born with the intersex traits, be they XY intersex or intersex traits that require stress of some sort to express the intersex. Both are inherited from intersex parents.

People confuse dominate and recessive genes with what a plant recieves from the parents, but do a prunett square with two palnts that have dominate and recessive genes for the same gene and you will see progeny have a crap shoot on what they receive. Depending on what the parents have Ww X Rr for example in the case of White and Red.

Plant genetics like Cannabis can be confusing as Cannabis is a dioecious obligate outcrosser and is a bit special. (90% of all flowering plants on earth have both sex, the remaining 10 percent have unisexual male and female flowers on the same plant (monoecious species) or male and female flowers on separate plants (dioecious species) they are the minority. Cannabis is one of the minority it is dioecious.
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Old 12-09-2018, 04:13 PM #6
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Smile hold on to what you got

Don't flip out bro! You didn't have to write all that stuff! I'm just telling about my own experiences! I should of specified, I don't use fem seeds at all, but only reg. seeds with this method! Also, if you hadn't tried this method yourself, you have no business criticizing it!
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Old 12-19-2018, 12:57 PM #7
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I forgot this thread…


Well, creeperpark its a good fix if it Works, but im going soon for a sog and this would practical time consuming at the moment. But I will probably try it one time later, thanks!


Ok, so lets say you have a pretty female you flower. "shit I want it to be a MOM" soo you revegg it.. In the revegg you see pollen sacks… "in theory" : after the revegg you treat it PERFECT.. So Backwards: If this plants was treated this way from the begining, it wouldnt EVER be a hermie…


Is it possible after the revegg, Perfect care, that this once hermie will not be hermie anymore? Yes, we can talk in months, years too for the fun of it.....

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Old 02-04-2019, 12:59 PM #8
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Smile may of been a misunderstanding

Sorry for being out of pocket medical reasons! What I was talking about was, when one has some REGULAR seed females that are in the veg stage and has pre-flowers. One can help stabilize her gender to stay female when she is dusted with male pollen early in veg. NOT reverse hermies but make less likely to herm on you. Its not fool proof, but its has a good success rate.
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Old 02-08-2019, 08:11 PM #9
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Super seeds

Other good reason to dust your reg, females in Veg. pre-bloom. Is, you will get 1 seed per bud to share with your friends.
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Old 02-08-2019, 08:24 PM #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibechillin View Post
Hermaphroditism is genetic inheritance from ancestors, Some landraces are immune to reversing according to Sam_skunkman. Whether you use a Male or reversed female, the pollen donor's sexual designation (XY or XX) wont affect the potential for hermie offspring. This is a good example of why you stress test clones before using a plant to breed with.
Thank you







Does A Male Or Female Pass On More Genetics To Their Offspring?: From February 2018

Link To Thread:
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=350271[/quote]
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