a ppk for a 6 plant limit

I have found the 1/2" WP grommets and half inch black hose works perfectly but let me ask, D9: when using the larger garden hose, doesn't the pulse rez have to be bigger and use more water because the bottom rez is draining back into the control rez faster as the pulse is happening?? answer?> bigger pump?

Hey old man.....Gladta see yas back around and helpin folks....How`s it feel ta be a "legal beagle" now ....

That`s the 1 thing I could never do was break ties from home and leave everything behind , including family........regardless....

Proud you`re in a better place for you and yours bro......Respect....now...

Carry on....Freds.........

Snook said:

I have found the 1/2" WP grommets and half inch black hose works perfectly but let me ask, D9: when using the larger garden hose, doesn't the pulse rez have to be bigger and use more water because the bottom rez is draining back into the control rez faster as the pulse is happening?? answer?> bigger pump?

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Please correct me, if im wrong D...the new tailpipe has a "limiting plug"...which slows the flow from the bottom to pulse rez, creating a equal and consistent timed flood at each and every plant site, all the way across the board.

Snook said:

I have found the 1/2" WP grommets and half inch black hose works perfectly but let me ask, D9: when using the larger garden hose, doesn't the pulse rez have to be bigger and use more water because the bottom rez is draining back into the control rez faster as the pulse is happening?? answer?> bigger pump?

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It seems as this "limiting plug" helps reduce the need for a bigger pump (depending on how many plant sites are in your system) as D is using a 2400 GPH pump for a 24 plant system. Needing a rated pump at 100 GPH per site. Each pulse rez was said to have roughly 15 gallons of nutrient solution = 2.5 gallons per site.

Snook said:

Your first runs with the 'original' PPK was with these same muck tubs as the rez as I remember (but you got them at wally world)...
Original...HA! every time you have a new idea, the system changes.. but it's the same..
I've been running 3.5 gallon top/bottom for some years now.. am starting to lean to 3.5 bottom bucket and 2 gallon top pot. growing in a tent limits my veg time so most runs do start at about 12" and root density isn't very much in the 3.5 bucket...

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yeah, these containers are just an example. they fit a certain need. i primarily wanted to show the modifications.

i'm using 3.5's in 5's right now for sub-irrigated mothers. the problem with this is that by the time you get an acceptable air gap you only have 3.5 inches of water left.

this will starve your pump if you are trying to do a full pulse. with a wave type pulse it should work.

DunHav`nFun said:

Hey old man.....Gladta see yas back around and helpin folks....How`s it feel ta be a "legal beagle" now ....

That`s the 1 thing I could never do was break ties from home and leave everything behind , including family........regardless....

Proud you`re in a better place for you and yours bro......Respect....now...

Carry on....Freds.........

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it feels pretty good!

Mrrite008 said:

Please correct me, if im wrong D...the new tailpipe has a "limiting plug"...which slows the flow from the bottom to pulse rez, creating a equal and consistent timed flood at each and every plant site, all the way across the board.

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i was wondering when someone would get around to the "limiting plug"!

immediately following transplant the containers flow too fast as they don't have much root yet.

sometimes requiring huge pumps or multiple pumps to operate the system.

this plug slows the drain until roots occupy more of the container.

at the point when drain speed noticeably begins to slow the plug is removed for the rest of the grow.

delta9nxs said:

hey, dabs! i'm building the rest of the system today and tomorrow and will record the whole thing.

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Thanks man, saw some new pics, still wondering about how you set the water level within the ppk. No rush tho, i know you are a busy dude

Snook said:

I have found the 1/2" WP grommets and half inch black hose works perfectly but let me ask, D9: when using the larger garden hose, doesn't the pulse rez have to be bigger and use more water because the bottom rez is draining back into the control rez faster as the pulse is happening?? answer?> bigger pump?

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No. The return flow can only be equal or slower. As the return system only works by gravity. If Im reading your question correctly?

DabOnDabs said:

Thanks man, saw some new pics, still wondering about how you set the water level within the ppk. No rush tho, i know you are a busy dude

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Float valve in the control res connected to a bulk res that keeps it auto topped up.

Miraculous Meds said:

No. The return flow can only be equal or slower. As the return system only works by gravity. If Im reading your question correctly?

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i think a slower flow would only work with a rez capable of holding a larger capacity than all of you lower buckets connected to said rez combined, else you would be draining your rez before the flood is complete.

Grow4Flow said:

i think a slower flow would only work with a rez capable of holding a larger capacity than all of you lower buckets connected to said rez combined, else you would be draining your rez before the flood is complete.

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Grow4flow, snook is asking if, in the new build, the black hose connected to the res the plant sits on, is bigger thus making the water from a flood return faster to the control res. Which yes, it will return faster but it will not overflow the control res because the returning water will only flow back at the same speed that the pump is feeding at or slower, because it is just resetting at the float valve height by way of gravity, I believe.

OIC, guess i read that one wrong

Grow4Flow said:

OIC, guess i read that one wrong

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I've been trying to figure what the fuck this PPK method is for the past 6 months now.

I see tons of pics...hell it just looks like a flood n' drain with a tube stuck in the middle of it.

...but I am watching...n' one of these days I will figure it all out

5th said:

I've been trying to figure what the fuck this PPK method is for the past 6 months now.

I see tons of pics...hell it just looks like a flood n' drain with a tube stuck in the middle of it.

...but I am watching...n' one of these days I will figure it all out

Click to expand...

Im not pro, but I can throw out a few details for ya. One of the main benefits is the wick/drain, can help keep plants alive during pump failure and power outages, due to the wick. But the real magic comes in reducing the PWT (perched water table). Look that up for more detail but basicly its how much volume of water that doesn't drain from the bottom of your planter, each medium holds a different amount. By using the wick/drain u have 3" of wet medium not well suited for roots, instead of the entire bottom of your planter. basicly more better area for the roots.

Throw in auto topping off by using a bulk res to keep the same level of water connected to a ro float valve in the control res, (res that holds the pump, and where the return drains from under each planter come back to) and just sit there and watch her run till u gotta fill the bulk res again. The bigger the bulk res the longer u go on vacation.

So the roots are initially planted in the tube in the center right? ...no top feeding to get the roots to the bottom? hows a guy veg like that? leaves 'em in the cloner until he's got 8-12" roots? Or does the flood come up to the 3" sweet spot you were takin' about?

They would have to be elevated I guess if the return is gravity fed back to the res. Or a large surface area res... I like the idea of less parts/fucking around (no bulkheads etc)

Am I really making this more fuckin' difficult then it needs to be?


I'm gonna go back to sitting in the corner, watching. Thanks for the rundown Meds.

5th said:

I've been trying to figure what the fuck this PPK method is for the past 6 months now.

I see tons of pics...hell it just looks like a flood n' drain with a tube stuck in the middle of it.

...but I am watching...n' one of these days I will figure it all out

Click to expand...

It's a flood/drain system combined with a wick fed system. The two work synergistically to create an ideal root zone environment. The flood/drain part of the system insures that not only is the nutrient solution in the root zone regularly refreshed (preventing salt build up and deficiency), but also that high levels of oxygen are maintained. No different from any other flood/drain system. However the drain portion of the flood/drain setup on a ppk has two functions. One obviously to act as a drain for the flood cycle, but it also acts as a wick. Often referred to as the "tailpiece". The wicks primary function in the ppk, is to remove the perched water table (PWT) that would otherwise be generated after each flood cycle. By removing the PWT you end up with much more of the root zone in the ideal oxygen range. This in turn simulates greater root growth from your plants, resulting in faster vegging, and ultimately larger yields . So technically the ppk is hybrid between a flood/drain and wick hydro systems .

5th said:

So the roots are initially planted in the tube in the center right? ...no top feeding to get the roots to the bottom? hows a guy veg like that? leaves 'em in the cloner until he's got 8-12" roots? Or does the flood come up to the 3" sweet spot you were takin' about?

They would have to be elevated I guess if the return is gravity fed back to the res. Or a large surface area res... I like the idea of less parts/fucking around (no bulkheads etc)

Am I really making this more fuckin' difficult then it needs to be?


I'm gonna go back to sitting in the corner, watching. Thanks for the rundown Meds.

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You haven't quite grasped it yet. Lets see if I can clear it up a bit more for ya.

The roots are not placed in the wick/drain to start. You fill the wick up with the same medium your gonna use. Then u plant as normal. Like all growing there are different strategies for how u wanna veg. D9 actually roots cuttings in this thing. So either start directly in the ppk or say root a cutting in rw or whatever, tp into a solo cup with medium of choice. then when ready throw in ppk planter with same medium, just like tp'ing any other way.
You do water from the top, with a pump in your control res, feed line going to the top of your planter, set on a timer to auto water. When ur little girl grows, she will stretch her roots down into the wick, but usually not grow to aggressive roots down there cause that is where ur PWT is making ur medium more wet = less oxygen. But the entire top planter will be a sweet spot for ur roots since the PWT is now below it in the wick. That water logged medium in the bottom of your planter is only in the bottom of the wick.
OK, so now I think u need to understand that the planter sits on top of a bucket. The wick/drain goes thru a hole u cut in the bucket lid, thus holding it in place and allowing it to drain into bucket. The bucket has a hose connected to the bottom, on the side that runs back to the control res. the control res is controlled by a float valve connected to a elevated bulk res. This keeps the water level the same that u set the float valve at in the control res, and the bucket underneath ur plants. So the bucket underneath ur plant will always have a water level that is set to keep your wick/drain wet so u can wick back up moistures as needed.
What helped me was to see these things to better conceptualize them in action. Im sure as d9 builds the thread u will see it coming together, but I suggest looking for some pics that can help. I know most of d9 pics are gone on the old thread "big plant ppk", but if u look around page 65ish alien dog or dam ugly dog now quoted d9 and made a joke about a refection of a fan in the control res. While it is funny he did us a big favor by capturing a pic of d9's control res. That will help with the plumbing idea on the control res. Next I recommend looking at flower farmers ppk thread, here u can see the big ppk version and see what I mean by planter on top of bucket returning to control res.
Man I didn't realize how hard this shit is to put into words, wish I could take pics for ya but there out there just spend some time searching or wait for d9 to bring it here.

No need for the pics Med. Between you n' Mister_D I now know exactly wtf is going on.

I tried the "big plant ppk", we know whats up with that though, I always thought Aliens ppk was just a flood/drain system. Hell I've watched his youtube, that's exactly what it looks like...

Now I know what the deal is...looking forward to seeing these feed lines. I'm off to FF's thread then.

Thanks again guys.

5th said:

No need for the pics Med. Between you n' Mister_D I now know exactly wtf is going on.

I tried the "big plant ppk", we know whats up with that though, I always thought Aliens ppk was just a flood/drain system. Hell I've watched his youtube, that's exactly what it looks like...

Now I know what the deal is...looking forward to seeing these feed lines. I'm off to FF's thread then.

Thanks again guys.

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Cool, DabsonDabs has some good pics of the planters on buckets towards the end of his thread.