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Old 08-28-2016, 10:56 PM #41
slownickel
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Originally Posted by jidoka View Post
You may have nailed that one bubba.

The soil in question began the year at:
Fe. 151 ppm
Mn. 34 ppm
Al 293 ppm

How does one adress high Al
With with what water, soil analysis and the rest of the year applications?????...

Wait, I have an unopened crystal ball.... let me try... nah.. another dud. Maybe a soil analysis of that iron deficient medium on that specific plant to see what witches brew you concocted with what ever? Have a question? Send a sample of it and send one of your best. LEARN now.
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Old 08-28-2016, 10:59 PM #42
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Fe/Mn ratio at less than 1 and no more than .8 trying brewing that one up and smoking it. I want half of anything over a 30% increase in your yield.
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Old 08-28-2016, 11:17 PM #43
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Good idea on the soil tests. I will do that.
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Old 08-29-2016, 12:29 AM #44
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Originally Posted by slownickel View Post
Molasses is a pretty amazing microbiology stimulator. So is brown sugar.

My organic certification group is balking about the source of molasses as much of the sugar cane that it comes from is nearly always conventionally grown with chemicals and quite often glyphosate is applied to "mature" the cane or knock the leaves off of it, or to simply stop the flowering process. There are several usages. So if you get molasses from that cane, the microbiology will get knocked down and not increased. The first patent by Monsanto on glyphosate was as an antibiotic.

wow i'm glad to learn this but pretty bummed out too, that shit is everywhere!
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Old 08-29-2016, 03:48 AM #45
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PGA contribution to us all

This is the article that discusses the soil analysis types funded by the PGA (Professional Golf Association) and describes why we need to use an alternative soil analysis type to understand Calcareous soils. Don't get confused by this term, this could easily be many of you that have used oyster shell, dolomite, calcium carbonate, rock dusts, etc. etc.. Having these materials plus neutral or high pH water, or with any water problems, does not permit short term utilization of these calcium sources. If one does not understand why it is so important to understand what is really in your mixes, this will help you understand.

Alkaline materials with alkaline waters will take forever to become available, this is why so many are showing higher Ca than Albrecht called for, yet seeting Ca problems.

https://goo.gl/tu1id6

On the other extreme, I do not agree with the concept of using any other procedure than M3 for the rest of the analysis. Let me explain why.

If I did the job that I needed to do in maximizing to my best understanding, the multiplication of my root tips, this would give me the highest natural manufacture of both cytokinin growth hormone which is responsible for cell division and calcium uptake sites (root tips) that will maximize my calcium uptake.

To achieve this high level of root tip growth, I really need know what the level of nutrients that would be available in an acid soil, regardless of whether I am in an alkaline soil or not. This is because roots exude amino acids which have a very low pH of 3.5 to 4.5. If roots can create this acidity, I want to know what is really in the best of situations, available to the plant under that pH level that is exuded by a good healthy root. That analysis we all know is Melich 3 (M3).

If we are going to balance the soil, it must be done on the basis of knowing what is available at this pH, not at AA@8.2..... All accept for Calcium. We need that AA@8.2 Ca number to really dial it in. This shows us the real Calcium issue in the soil, the difference between the two, M3 and AA@8.2 being forms of Calcium that we cannot depend on to get to the plant, yet will give us false readings at the lab.

This is my contribution to soil science, taking the pieces of the puzzle and trying to make a real and up to date working system improving and building on what our forefathers learned. That reflects what we see in leaf analysis and at the same time achieves not only high yields, but also the highest of quality.

Thanks to the PGA for contributing to this very critical piece of the puzzle....
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Old 08-29-2016, 04:20 AM #46
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Good info, as always
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Old 08-29-2016, 04:58 AM #47
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On the topic of molasses and other carbs.
It's been explained to me in this manner;

if we feed a bunch of candy to kids, they'll get calories, get wired and not eat their vegetables. If we feed candy to soil bacteria they'll grow and be active, but they'll eat candy, not minerals and not pathogens.

What do you think about this scenario? totally unsupported by science. I used to feed mollasses in the fall. Within 24hrs of an application of mollasses I had 2 large healthy plants up and die.

I imagine Mg would contribute to it.
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Old 08-29-2016, 05:07 AM #48
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Sure sounds like an herbicidal reaction to me! How much did you apply? If you have a high CEC you need to go lighter. I typically add molasses with my metal applications mixed with amino acids and a bit of high cytokinin seaweed. My dosis per hectare (660 trees) is 4 to 6 liters of molasses on a CEC soil of 16 or so. It is quite black and comes from cane that we are quite sure has not had glyphosate applied.

Always try new products on one plant or so..... looks like you already learned that lesson.
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Old 08-29-2016, 05:18 AM #49
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Sure sounds like an herbicidal reaction to me! How much did you apply? If you have a high CEC you need to go lighter. I typically add molasses with my metal applications mixed with amino acids and a bit of high cytokinin seaweed. My dosis per hectare (660 trees) is 4 to 6 liters on a CEC soil of 16 or so.

Always try new products on one plant or so..... looks like you already learned that lesson.
3 ml/gallon organic unsulphured mollasses from the grocery (they sell 5 gallon at the grocery here). It wasn't new product to me, or process. I saved some plants, I figured it was a pathogenic fungal infection that I fueled. The affected survivors showed low yield on higher portions of plant with near normal on the lower branches seemed vascular to me. Sorry for the derailing anectdote.

I feed them meat and vegetables now 😆
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Old 08-29-2016, 05:45 AM #50
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3 ml/gallon organic unsulphured mollasses
That would equate to 25 liters to the hectare. My dosis are half or less than yours. We always push fertilizer applications via the injection system with more water after their injection to get down deeper into the root zone.

When you applied your molasses, how did you apply it?
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