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Anyone ever try high PPM CO2 for killing spider mites?

Ringodoggie

Well-known member
Premium user
Fucking borg. I have had spider mites for almost a year. The past 4 or 5 crops. I keep thinking they are gone and then I find them again.

I have managed to keep them under control with predators and Azamax but it seems like they just keep on popping up.

I am definitely not one to spray (anything, organic, natural or otherwise). I sprayed the Azamax in desperation but don't really want to do it again. And, I just sprayed the bottom leaves and not the buds at all.

Plus, my plants are VERY crowded and it's almost impossible to get good coverage with sprays.

Predators worked fair but are very expensive and need to be replenished regularly.

So, someone in another forum pointed me to an article about using high PPM (10k to 15k PPM) CO2 to suffocate them. Makes sense.

2 of my grows are in tents so I am hoping I will be able to get the PPM up that high. I have found these tents to be pretty tight. The other is in a 4x4 room and will definitely be harder but I think it's possible.

Has anyone ever tried this?

Any idea how much CO2 it would take to flood a 4x4 tent with CO2 up to 12,000 PPM? The grow store sells a 20 pound tank but it doesn't seem like enough.

Well, before I buy the stuff to try this I thought I would ask around and see if anyone has actually been successful with this method. I am at the end of my rope and will be forced to shut down my space if I can't solve this.

After I shut down, I plan to bomb the entire house with DDT, Round Up and Agent Orange. LOL These fuckers have GOT to go.

Thanks
 

MJPassion

Observer
ICMag Donor
Veteran
Your problem is that you're afraid to spray your buds.


If you don't get 100% coverage you will continue to have problems. As long as airflow is good you should never have any problems spraying your buds. (and I mean drenching the buds with whatever it is that you are using at the time) I've only ever experienced bud rot when my plants STAY wet from extended periods of rain (spray). It shouldn't be a problem with proper ventilation.


On that note, You can use high CO2 to kill ALL of the borg in your room.
HOWEVER...
They're smart critters and have ways to hide from that as well.
Namely by leaving the area!


Being that you are indoors You've got to clean the entire house and treat the entire house as if it is infected.


I had a buddy get a super bad case of the borg & he didn't know what to do.
I went ballistic on them (the borg)!
First I sprayed with a mixture of Neem oil, capsasin & soap every three days for five applications.
As well I got a bag of Diatamaceous Earth and dusted the carpet with it and layed it out in the corners of the room. It was dusty every time a person walked in the room for about two weeks until it was vacuumed up.

I did the exact same for a room I had that was located on the edge of a wheat field.
Neither room has had issue with the borg since. That was nearly 10 years ago!
 

Ringodoggie

Well-known member
Premium user
Thanks bud. I am totally against spraying ANYTHING. Sorry, I'm just anal like that. So, yeah, you're right,spraying isn't going to work on just the bottom leaves.

I mean, I am the kind of guy who buys raw wheat and grinds it to make my own flour to make my own bread. LMAO I sure as fuck ain't consuming a bunch of Azamax. I don't care HOW safe THEY say it is. I know it's my issue but... it is what it is. SO.... spraying any kind of poison is out of the picture. At least until after harvest. Then, I'll Agent Orange the fucking place. LOL

I agree with you that part of my problem is that the mites are 'in the room' and even if I get them off the plants, I still have eggs and traces. Plus, my grow room is carpeted (yeah, I know LOL) and I feel the eggs and babies just lavishing themselves in the luxury of cut pile. LOL

I also tried diatomaceous earth. Wow, what a mess. I will dust the carpet with it next time.

I also feel they are in all my pots and tools and dirt and ..... geeze, just everywhere.

Thanks again for the input.
 

Lost in a SOG

GrassSnakeGenetics
Erm I dont know about the co2 technique.. With out a ppm meter you're just guessing with the co2.. I bet it probably does help though..

If I open my co2 regulator, turn on the co2, id need to run it for about a minute I think to get up there in ppm.. If you just open a bottle then god knows..

Hmm difficult one..

Positive mental attitude. You will defeat them!

Fuck the Borg! I eat them for breakfast.. Literally, they're on my basils outside..
 

Ringodoggie

Well-known member
Premium user
That is another issue with this method..... measuring 12000 PPM. My meter only goes to 5000. Even my Raspberry Pi sensor only goes to 5000. Not sure how I would even measure 12000.

So, based on your post, maybe just seal the tent.... stick the hose in and run on full for 60 to 90 seconds. ???

Thanks
 

Mr. Greengenes

Re-incarnated Senior Member
ICMag Donor
Veteran
You just need to learn how to do whole plant water dips. It's easy, you can even dip a 5' tall plant with two people and a trough of water.

Problem with all kinds of chemicals against spider mites is they eat chemicals for breakfast. They're not insects. IIRC, no insect can feed on more than about 50+ crops, but some species of spider mite prey on more than 100 different crops. They evolve immunity fast, so we always rotate chemicals.

Things like water, diatomaceous earth and vacuum cleaners are mechanical methods that mites have a harder time evolving around, so they're more effective.

Unfortunately, the water won't really eliminate them either because eggs. If you hit them every 3 days, you interrupt their breeding cycle and that may not eliminate them, but will knock them silly. Double dips will get the eggs but take at least twice the time. First let them stand a while (in the dark) with a strong soap or neem solution, then rinse with water.

Friction is important with dipping, so a lot of swishing or lifting the plant in and out of the water does a better job than just soaking.

Also, people worry about the water washing, or knocking the trichomes off. I've found that, either it doesn't really happen, or maybe the trichomes reform after dipping. Either way, it doesn't seem to do anything bad to the potency.

I've gone into some big commercial grows where the boss was ready to throw the whole web covered crop away, water dipped all the plants and they're ready to harvest the next day. From bust to boom in one simple move.
 

Ringodoggie

Well-known member
Premium user
It is impossible to water dunk this crop..... LOL I am always way crowded like this.


However, I am definitely going to try the vacuum cleaner. LOL


Thanks for the idea.


EDIT: Oops, wrong picture. Here is my current crop.
 

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Compost tea spray every other day until week four, bio film is a real thing. You still have em pop up after week four but just start picking leaves. Safest method as an organic or conscious gardener.
 

Mr. Greengenes

Re-incarnated Senior Member
ICMag Donor
Veteran
Ringodoggie, I've used those computer mini hose thing kits that attach to your regular vacuum. They work excellent with a brush tip. Very satisfying method!
 

Iffy

Nil Illegitimus Carburundum
ICMag Donor
Veteran
I would go with Mr Greengenes and whole-plant dunk them if you don't want to spray them but I would and I would use this;

1 oz Peppermint Oil
1 oz Rosemary Oil
2 oz Neem Oil
1 oz Unscented detergent
2 Cups warm water
Mix together and shake vigorously to emulsify and mix into 5L of water, creating your high-strength base. Dilute to 4% for a foliar spay or for your 'dunking' solution. In foliar use, care must be taken to completely soak the infected plant/s with the solution, making sure to spray under all the leaves and stems.
 

Ringodoggie

Well-known member
Premium user
I am almost 4 weeks into flower and it's way too late to spray anything now. I just ordered 4000 predatory mites. Hopefully, it will slow them down a little.

Still contemplating the CO2 thing. So far, all I have read is people who 'know' it works but never tried it and... people who tried it and said it didn't work.

I have not found even ONE person who actually did it and says it works. :(
 

AgentPothead

Just this guy, ya know?
I am almost 4 weeks into flower and it's way too late to spray anything now. I just ordered 4000 predatory mites. Hopefully, it will slow them down a little.

Still contemplating the CO2 thing. So far, all I have read is people who 'know' it works but never tried it and... people who tried it and said it didn't work.

I have not found even ONE person who actually did it and says it works. :(
There are a couple papers detailing it, one is in japanese and I don't read japanese, but the other is online. https://doi.org/10.1093/jee/88.2.331 redirects to the abstract which is
Diapausing adult twospotted spicier mites, Tetranychus urticae Koch, were exposed to various controlled atmosphere treatments at different temperatures, to determine estimates of treatment times for 50% (LT50) and 99% (LT99 mortality. When the O2 concentration was reduced, greater reductions in lethal time estimates were achieved than when the CO2 concentration was increased. At 20º C, an O2 concentration of 0.4% combined with a CO2 concentration of 20.0% resulted in the lowest mean LT99 (113 h). An increase in treatment temperature under this atmosphere (0.4% O2, 20.0% CO2) significantly decreased lethal time estimates. At 40 ºC (the highest temperature tested) the mean LT99 was 15.5 h. Although a high temperature (40 ºC;) pretreatment advanced mortality under subsequent controlled atmosphere treatment, the effect was small.
I am 99% sure they mean spider mites and the OCR software just replaced that with spicier mites.
 

Ringodoggie

Well-known member
Premium user
That's interesting. Unfortunately, I don't have access to the full text :(


But in summary, all I need to do is wrap a tiny plastic bag around their little tiny heads and cut the O2 off, eh?

Still, this whole concept of choking them has to have some merit. It's the idea behind soaps as well.

How else does one drain the O2 from a room? And, how long does it take before the little fucker suffocates to death?
This is some fucked up shit for sure. I don't just want to kill them now.... I want to hurt them. LOL
 

Andyo

Active member
Veteran
phytoselius persemillis

phytoselius persemillis

They work fine for spider mite applied 2 weekly in 3 batches at begining of crop.
Ideal conditions is 75/80% humidity which i got away with in veg .
The reason for succesive introduction of persemillis is its 3 stage life cycle.
I had 24 x 1000w total in 6 rooms, infestation so after that crop i just planned new start with cuttings
used ultrasonic mister with humidistat and up the temperature for veg.
The reason for humidity is so persemillis eggs dont dry out!!!
25c temp for rate of egg hatching!!!

I saw spider mite white spots but by 8 weeks nothing just the ocassional adult persimillis.
I also never saw mites again in successive crops !A
 

Hookah79

Active member
What about green cleaner??.Could be safe for flowering??.

When i stick to the program spraying every 5-7 days until post stretch i have no issues with any mites PERIOD!!!.

If i slack off here and there they start popping up.You have to be deligent about it, if you think they’re gone think again.

I never use the same product twice in a row,always rotate.
 

Ringodoggie

Well-known member
Premium user
I don't believe you have to rotate with Green Cleaner. The reason for rotating poisons is because the mites build a resistance to them almost immediately so switching around is advised.
However, the Green Cleaner is simply soap and it suffocates them. Can't build a resistance to suffocation. LOL

Still, look at the picture of my plants. There is no way you could spray that and get complete coverage.... it's simply too dense of growth.

And, spraying ANYTHING into an area that dense is just begging for mold. Especially this time of year when my grow rooms are never below 50 to 60% RH.

I am afraid I'm going to have to ride this out for 5 more weeks and use predators and hope for the best.

I imagine having all these bugs eating on my plants is going to affect the potency? Or yield?

Fucking mites. Now, I know why they call them the borg.

Thanks to everyone for your fabulous input.
 

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Ringodoggie

Well-known member
Premium user
Something else I have added to the mix.... ultrasonic pest devices.

I ordered a dozen of them so I can have 4 in each of the 5x5 grow tents. I'm not sure if these will do anything but from what I have read, ultrasound does not hurt the plants so it's worth a try.

However, these things don't kill, they just annoy and chase away.... where would the mites go? They can't fly and it's a long fucking walk upstairs to the closest house plant.

It would be great to get some pictures of the little fuckers running around, screaming, holding their hands over their ears. LMAO

If I can't kill them, torturing them is the next best thing.

Anyone ever try ultrasound?
 
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