Drip cycles for anyone using the Halo Rings?

juggernaut · Jan 26, 2020

I'm going to use the Halo watering rings for the first time and I was hoping to find out how long to run them and # of times a light cycle? Also if you have to turn them on at night to avoid the roots from drying out. I'm running 12l buckers with the clay pellets.

f-e · Jan 26, 2020

Just expanded clay pebbles in a drip system? If I found that in use, I would say leave it switched on all the time. I don't suggest you set out to do that if you haven't already. Buy some coco to mix in, so you can get an even spread of water, that will drain off. If you use just pebbles, the water will take the easiest route though, with very little wicking action. What you do get, will lead to salt problems. Pebbles are for flood drain, and even then you get a toxic layer you shouldn't jug down if you get a pump failure.

Edit: Halo's are a ring of perforated pipe yes? People often struggle to run a few, unless using quite a pump.

juggernaut · Jan 26, 2020

Little Giant PE-2h. 300gph. I hope it can feed 12 halo drippers, if not I'll add a pump.

I have used clay pellets with drippers or cones with great success for 30 years. My only complaint is they clog to easy. I'm going to try the halo system and I'm going to make a few diy halos using black hose a 1/2" Tee connector and drill holes in black hose + a timer.

mrlucky405 · Mar 12, 2020

I used the Halos for a year or two in DTW. Here's the rub... The flow rate is crazy high because of the big pump needed, which creates its own issues. Digital timers were out, because they do a minimum of one minute. If I only fed once a day, i guess it would have been easier, but I like to feed 3x. So I had to use mechanical timers, which were terribly inconsistent. The ring holes are also small enough that they do plug up, and unless you keep them clean, you'll get uneven feeds. And they take a major cleaning at the end of each crop cycle. I finally gave up on them and switched to drippers. Same issues you were having, plus bigger plants weren't always getting enough while smaller plants were having tons of run off. Last year I had a brainstorm. I've now switched to micro valves instead of drippers. Upon initial set up, I slide a small paper clip into the valve and close it down around the clip, reducing the size of the opening. Small enough to allow for multiple minute feeds, but large enough to not clog. And because they're adjustable, flow rates can be slightly altered to accommodate varying plant sizes/needs. I've only had one clog over the last year+. I'm surprised more people don't do this.

f-e · Mar 12, 2020

There are timers that run to the second https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DIGITAL-...LY-ACCURATE-1-SECOND-INCREMENTS-/162327780226

There are also second timers. Basically a monostable timer. It plugs into your 15 minute mechanical timer, but will only pass power for an adjustable duration. So in operation, each time your 15 minute timer comes on, the device allows power to pass for an adjustable duration.
Someone has packaged them together here, but the price is silly.. https://progrow.co.uk/product/iws-minutesecond-timer/

These are just a fiver, but require a little wiring

Don't judge me.. I'm just playing with them. They do sell a box for a few quid, and cable glands cost little. Chop an extension lead in half, and your there. Though I would always use a contactor for a pump. These are the 12v model, so no fear of electrocution

DARKSIDER · Mar 17, 2020

juggernaut said:
Little Giant PE-2h. 300gph. I hope it can feed 12 halo drippers, if not I'll add a pump.

I have used clay pellets with drippers or cones with great success for 30 years. My only complaint is they clog to easy. I'm going to try the halo system and I'm going to make a few diy halos using black hose a 1/2" Tee connector and drill holes in black hose + a timer.

Hey juggernaught I use the same,, Clay balls and home made halo rings and bog standard timers and its one of the best things I have done.

as the blue drippers where a nightmare. With my home made ones i get a lot more coverage and no clogs at all even spread more or less go for it.. i also use a 800gph, was using bigger but one packed in so went with these instead best of luck with your choice. :tiphat:

juggernaut · Mar 17, 2020

DARKSIDER said:
Hey juggernaught I use the same,, Clay balls and home made halo rings and bog standard timers and its one of the best things I have done. as the blue drippers where a nightmare. With my home made ones i get a lot more coverage and no clogs at all even spread more or less go for it.. i also use a 800gph, was using bigger but one packed in so went with these instead best of luck with your choice.

Yeah I'm making my own next time. What size drill bit for drip holes?

Also what is your drip/watering cycles?

DARKSIDER · Mar 17, 2020

juggernaut said:
Yeah I'm making my own next time. What size drill bit for drip holes?

Also what is your drip/watering cycles?

I just use t connectors no drill bit needed and my drip cycle is up to the plant they let me know so all in all a win win best of luck :tiphat:

f-e · Mar 17, 2020

I have seen peoples attempts at halo rings. The problem was always the same. Water would come out the holes, then rather than drip, would run along the bottom of the pipe. They tried to keep the pipe perfectly level, but destiny doesn't play that way.

Darksider, are you basically pouring water through everywhere? Like the tide came in.

Edit: So, for clarity, this is a kink in a hose: https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-mBzX8cFKg78/UgCPQETr9mI/AAAAAAAAKFg/zK5IbfXacGg/s1600/GardenHose-Kink.jpg
If your ring had kinks in it, then it would have low points. Ones that could be punctured. You could also place something inside the tube, to stop the kinks going totally flat. The kinks themselves could be formed not by kinking, but by heating the tube and pinching in. Perhaps with a peg. Frankly I wouldn't bother though. It's not going to be a good system.

Edit2: We have all seen the 16mm black pipe, punctured with the tool, to take the 3mm pipe that comes fitted to certain drippers. You could make your loop with the 16mm, puncture with the tool, then just put in the shortest of bits of 3mm line. That would be quick and easy. It could look like a centipede biting it's own arse.

DARKSIDER · Mar 17, 2020

f-e said:
I have seen peoples attempts at halo rings. The problem was always the same. Water would come out the holes, then rather than drip, would run along the bottom of the pipe. They tried to keep the pipe perfectly level, but destiny doesn't play that way.

Darksider, are you basically pouring water through everywhere? Like the tide came in.

Edit: So, for clarity, this is a kink in a hose: https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-mBzX8cFKg78/UgCPQETr9mI/AAAAAAAAKFg/zK5IbfXacGg/s1600/GardenHose-Kink.jpg
If your ring had kinks in it, then it would have low points. Ones that could be punctured. You could also place something inside the tube, to stop the kinks going totally flat. The kinks themselves could be formed not by kinking, but by heating the tube and pinching in. Perhaps with a peg. Frankly I wouldn't bother though. It's not going to be a good system.

Edit2: We have all seen the 16mm black pipe, punctured with the tool, to take the 3mm pipe that comes fitted to certain drippers. You could make your loop with the 16mm, puncture with the tool, then just put in the shortest of bits of 3mm line. That would be quick and easy. It could look like a centipede biting it's own arse.

f-e this is the way mine is set up, works well connected to a pond pump instead of the mj maxi jet pump :tiphat:

f-e · Mar 17, 2020

I see. A means of high volume top feeding. This and flood/drain are the only ways I would try and make pebbles work. They are really good in flood/drain, but I reckon that air exchange could be mimicked. I have been playing about with little 12v blower fans, and even the 50mm one's can send quite a draft down a hosepipe. I was blowing into a box that had 7 hoses leave it, and each made a draft you could feel a couple of foot away. Plenty to push fresh air into the bottom of a pot, to get a nice updraft through pebbles. Moving something like what your doing, towards aeroponics. It could, in fact, be a game changer.

delta9nxs · Mar 22, 2020

here is one of my home made rings. all you need is 1/2" and .177 id black tubing and the little irrigation fittings. one 1/2" T. you can make holes with an irrigation tubing punch and then just push the fittings in.

the advantage of doing it this way instead of drilling or burning holes is that the fittings give you the same flow rate per outlet as they are all the same id.

the container is 22" across for reference. the medium is pumice and is 6" deep.

the plant is a dr. who.

studies have demonstrated that small frequent pulses of solution will grow a better plant than fewer events per 24 hour period even if the
total volume delivered in the 24 hour period is the same.

this is because you are maintaining a more even, stable, water status within the medium.

also, the more frequent pulses exchange the gases in the medium more frequently maintaining higher overall o2 availability.

the air filled porosity of hydroton is too great to maintain a perched water table and it has very little capillary rise capability so tends to dry out very fast.

i suggest a pulsed dose of solution about every 15 minutes in hydroton.

you should use a pump with a high enough flow rate to put the solution out on top of the medium in the shortest time frame possible.

this causes the solution to spread more laterally than a slow delivery of the same amount.

a pulsed, intermittent, application is preferable to a continuous drip as a continuous drip tends to reform subsurface into a column and "channels" through the medium. this can cause dry areas in the medium as the water tends to follow the same course.

i hope this helps, d9

tilopa · Jun 19, 2020

juggernaut said:
Little Giant PE-2h. 300gph. I hope it can feed 12 halo drippers, if not I'll add a pump.

I'm also planning on doing halos in 12 buckets, but I was thinking of doing more pumps, like 3, 1 pump per 4 buckets. What I'm having trouble working out is, I know (actually I think this is true but not sure) that if I run one line of tubing in a linear layout the first bucket in the line will get a higher stream (higher pressure) of water than the last bucket. Unless each connection from the main line to the buckets had a pressure compensating valve in them, which I cannot find for this application.

delta9nxs said:
the advantage of doing it this way instead of drilling or burning holes is that the fittings give you the same flow rate per outlet as they are all the same id.

So Delta, what if you took that 1/2" hose and straightened it out, and plugged the end of it. So, you have a straight line of tubing with a pump at one end and the other end is plugged, and you have those little T-fittings coming out of the hose, would the volume of water coming out of each T be the same?

Hugh Glass · Jun 22, 2020

That's cool I would of never thought of that .
There are dripper systems on ebay for 20 25$ that work well .
I like the ring better though if your going to use a dripper looks like it would water the plant with more uniformity.

DunHav`nFun · Jun 22, 2020

Tilopa…..D9 `s not been here in awhile , but to answer your question , you can make ANY piece of straight pipe capped on 1 end a manifold with holes punched and feedtubes all of equal lengths , but why not use a "loopfield manifold" as I made clear in your thread , but the main thing that matters is ALL manifolds once pressurized with equal length feedtubes to each plant , is consistency from the pump to make sure the juice flows as needed to each plantsite from beginning of pump coming on till shutdown...… to do that.....

Pump size is paramount , and although hydro store pumps may work if properly sized , all my old head
bros always opted for oversized pond pumps and used a "bypass" with a ball valve to "completely" control pressure above fluid level but still inside the rez to dial in exactly the right amount to provide equal flow and pressure to each plantsite…..anyways....Good luck and 12 buckets only need 1 pump IME...…..

Peace.....DHF..... :ying:

…….

tilopa · Jun 23, 2020

DHF, I googled "loopfield manifold" and it only pointed me back to this site. I read Pico's thread from 2007. His setup is pretty basic stuff. Maybe I'm overthinking it, but I did something very similar a several years back, I used poly tubing and not pvc, and had uneven flow to my plants. What does "loopfield" have to do with anything. Just because you have the setup in a loop should not make a difference.

It seems like the variable that makes all the difference is the pressure inside the manifold? If I took a 10 foot piece of 1/2 pvc, plugged one end, and put a powerful enough pump at the other end. Then made holes for 1/4 tubing, and put 10 equal length tubing in the holes, would the water flow out of each 1/4 tubing be exactly the same? If not what is missing to make it so?

Thanks.

DunHav`nFun · Jun 23, 2020

tilopa said:
DHF, I googled "loopfield manifold" and it only pointed me back to this site. I read Pico's thread from 2007. His setup is pretty basic stuff. Maybe I'm overthinking it, but I did something very similar a several years back, I used poly tubing and not pvc, and had uneven flow to my plants. What does "loopfield" have to do with anything. Just because you have the setup in a loop should not make a difference.

It seems like the variable that makes all the difference is the pressure inside the manifold? If I took a 10 foot piece of 1/2 pvc, plugged one end, and put a powerful enough pump at the other end , then made holes for 1/4 tubing, and put 10 equal length tubing in the holes, would the water flow out of each 1/4 tubing be exactly the same? If not what is missing to make it so?

Thanks.

The simple answer is yes..... the pressure held and maintained while the pump`s on is the ONLY variable to deal with , but the pump you choose will determine how you dial your feed sequences....and since there`s no exact formula on what size pump to pick for consistent flow is the X factor , how you determine that is with an oversized submersible pump that you add a "bypass" above fluid level , and ball/control valve above that outside of rez as I posted earlier...…. all it takes is...…

A tee with a short straight piece added to that tee sticking out sideways , then attach a 90 degree elbow so all the "blowback" will blast down back to rez while adding O2 to solution and keeping solution constantly stirred if doing recirculating.....I always ran 3/4 and 1" cpvc for my feed setups but I imagine 1/2" would work on only 12 buckets....

The ball valve/control valve goes directly above and outside of rez so as to have easy access and control of from there , so the EXACT flow and pressure it takes to equally feed each container the exact amount of juice will be dialed with a simple turn of said ball valve.....

If you only employ a "choke valve/ball/control valve" to restrict flow of the oversized pump so as to control all flow without the "bypass" discussed , your pump will burn out from being choked down .... anyways..... Holler if there`s somethin you don`t understand....

I ran recirculating and timed fed setups a long time....Good luck and......

Peace....DHF..... :ying:

…..

PetFlora · Jun 23, 2020

juggernaut said:
I'm going to use the Halo watering rings for the first time and I was hoping to find out how long to run them and # of times a light cycle? Also if you have to turn them on at night to avoid the roots from drying out. I'm running 12l buckers with the clay pellets.

How long you can run them depends on what media and grow pots you are using

I have a background in High Pressure Aeroponics. I have applied lessons learned into low pressure with excellent success. The biggest lesson is roots can handle more frequent feedings when there is no media, but since media is necessary in drip systems all you need is a media that is fast draining(see below) in a grow pot that is also fast draining: I used Air Pots

First get rid of hydroton, it's messy. I used lava rock, which was less messy, but now there is a ceramic alternative called Bright Water, which should be excellent for drip systems

Combine with a analog short cycle timer and you can provide short blasts every ~ 15 minutes to achieve unbelievable growth

tilopa · Jun 23, 2020

DunHav`nFun said:
...is with an oversized submersible pump that you add a "bypass" above fluid level , and ball/control valve above that outside of rez as I posted earlier...…. all it takes is...…

A tee with a short straight piece added to that tee sticking out sideways , then attach a 90 degree elbow so all the "blowback" will blast down back to rez while adding O2 to solution and keeping solution constantly stirred if doing recirculating.....I always ran 3/4 and 1" cpvc for my feed setups but I imagine 1/2" would work on only 12 buckets....

The ball valve/control valve goes directly above and outside of rez so as to have easy access and control of from there , so the EXACT flow and pressure it takes to equally feed each container the exact amount of juice will be dialed with a simple turn of said ball valve.....

Thanks DHF, I'm trying to visualize what you are saying, but I'm not quite getting it. So, you have a pump sitting on the bottom of your rez tote, and coming out of the pump you have a pvc pipe that goes straight up vertical and then does a 90 turn just above the water line. Then you connect a tee with a piece of pvc pipe coming out of it sideways, and a 90 connected to the end of that pipe and pointed down?

And the ball valve above that outside of the rez is just a regular ball valve that acts as a control valve by restricting the flow?

DunHav`nFun · Jun 24, 2020

tilopa said:
Thanks DHF, I'm trying to visualize what you are saying, but I'm not quite getting it. So, you have a pump sitting on the bottom of your rez tote, and coming out of the pump you have a pvc pipe that goes straight up vertical and then does a 90 turn just above the water line. Then you connect a tee with a piece of pvc pipe coming out of it sideways, and a 90 connected to the end of that pipe and pointed down?

And the ball valve above that outside of the rez is just a regular ball valve that acts as a control valve by restricting the flow?

Real close Bro.....See.....you HAVE to have a way to get rid of the excess pressure from the oversize pump , but it acts in your favor by blasting O2 enriched juice straight back down as well as keeping shit stirred up that prevents precipitation and nutrients falling outta suspension , especially in a recirculating setup but I digress......and …..

Totes aren`t very tall to be able to implement said setup , so now we`re back at square 1 , unless you can find something similar for a rez but taller to accommodate the bypass allowing the "waterfall" effect ....and yeah …..The ball valve on the outside of the lid is exactly just a regular pvc ball valve to restrict flow and control pressure to each plantsite….. white fitting with red twist handle thingy on top....simple.....babyshit…..and.....

Most larger pumps have 3/4" hose pipe fittings like sump pumps , so whatever you come up with , here`s how you do it.....from the pump , run straight pipe up to as far above the solution level as possible but still under the lid , and put a "tee" in …..then add a short straight piece sideways depending on size of the rez , and put a 90 degree elbow on pointed straight back down for the waterfall effect , or even a 45 if larger size rez , and then install a small straight piece from the top of the tee inside the rez , to come out to right above the rez and install the ball valve to restrict flow that controls pressure to each plantsite , …..

From there , hook to the manifold of your choice for the grow area and you`re off to the races....that is once you dial down the flow it takes for each plant to receive EXACTLY the same juice EVERY timed feed sequence , or even totally recirculating that I really don`t suggest from yrs of experience in what not to do , but far be it from me to tell someone howta run their setup so......Good luck and take care.....

Peace.....DHF..... :ying:

…...

Drip cycles for anyone using the Halo Rings?

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