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Is a 600w de hps too much par for plants to utilize?

testing

New member
My veg is currently a few 600w de hps and one 630 Lec. Basically the multi unit mini split system I have cools both the veg and the flower. When the Ac is cooling the flower room it looses alot of its cooling power in the veg room and temperatures climb into the mid sometimes high 80s. Im trying to figure out how to cool down my veg, I figured I might be able to use some lower wattage lights to take some of the load off of the AC. Obviously LEC's are some of the best vegging lights out there and I love the one I have. If I replace the 600w de hps with 630 Lec's there wont be any decrease in heat load but 315 Lec's should do the trick.

Basically my question is do aggressively vegging plants need 600w to veg to their full potential? I know there is a limit of par that plants can use and once you go beyond that you are wasting energy, vegging plants need much less light than flowering plants to reach their optimal growth rate. Is 600w de hps overkill for veg? will an lec 315 be enough to push my plants to their limit? I usually try to get my plants to about 18"-24" before I put them into flower, I typically use 3 gallon fabric pots and sometimes 4-5 gallon plastic pots. Always in coco and perlite. I run a sealed room with co2 around 1200ppm.
 

MJINC

Member
What size area are you covering with each light. A 315CMH should cover a 4x4 area in veg depending on the hood
 

OldPhart

Member
Missing one key piece of info, what are you trying to light? Is it a shoe box or a football field? My go to number from back in the day is 50 watts/square foot. I wouldn't go over 60w/f² or under 40w/f².

What size area are you covering with each light. A 315CMH should cover a 4x4 area in veg depending on the hood

I know that is what they claim, but I would like to see it. That is only pushing 20w/f². I know those are the same type claims coming from LED's, and I don't believe them either.
 

testing

New member
Missing one key piece of info, what are you trying to light? Is it a shoe box or a football field? My go to number from back in the day is 50 watts/square foot. I wouldn't go over 60w/f² or under 40w/f².



I know that is what they claim, but I would like to see it. That is only pushing 20w/f². I know those are the same type claims coming from LED's, and I don't believe them either.


Im covering a 5x5 area. So by your guys advice the 315 would be too weak. However i may be able to only use the 315 over newly planted clones since their demand should be much less and since i have a perpetual system there's always 1-2 week old cuts. It would be weak lighting but the new clones would probably appreciate not being pushed too hard. The bigger guys can get under 600w. U guys think 1 week old cuts will still be able to use 40w a sqft?
 

OldPhart

Member
Im covering a 5x5 area. So by your guys advice the 315 would be too weak. However i may be able to only use the 315 over newly planted clones since their demand should be much less and since i have a perpetual system there's always 1-2 week old cuts. It would be weak lighting but the new clones would probably appreciate not being pushed too hard. The bigger guys can get under 600w. U guys think 1 week old cuts will still be able to use 40w a sqft?

Agreed, I wouldn't call that veg though. I personally run T5's for my babies, and no where near 40w/f². Once they are ready to go into serious veg (what I would call teenagers) I put them under HID's, and then target much higher light levels. I do want to play with one of the LEC/CMH one of these days, the color is quite nice; I bet the plants do love them.
 

Phaeton

Speed of Dark
Veteran
I post a fair amount due to my inquisitive nature. Over the last ten years (took six years to learn the basics) the budroom has stabilized at 5,000 to 7,000 watts covering 50 to 70 square feet.

Any less and production suffers, much more and diminishing returns for the labor begins in earnest. I read where many gardeners claim 50 watts/foot is good.
I do not find that. I am not good with nutrients other than instructions on merchandise so maybe it is me. Maybe so, but when using 100 watts/foot the plants do very well indeed.

By forum standards I do poorly in yields also, I do not break a gram per watt, in fact currently it is about a third of a gram per watt. Been that way since I first ran the numbers in 2010.

This discrepancy used to worry me, I use twice the power as anyone else and get half the yield of gardens in closets and refrigerators. If I got what others get, in the seven years since I quit my day job I would be rich enough to have a car and running water. Oh well, I do do have all the marijuana I can smoke.
 

OldPhart

Member
I post a fair amount due to my inquisitive nature. Over the last ten years (took six years to learn the basics) the budroom has stabilized at 5,000 to 7,000 watts covering 50 to 70 square feet.

Any less and production suffers, much more and diminishing returns for the labor begins in earnest. I read where many gardeners claim 50 watts/foot is good.
I do not find that. I am not good with nutrients other than instructions on merchandise so maybe it is me. Maybe so, but when using 100 watts/foot the plants do very well indeed.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Are you running CO2, I would think you could benefit from it? I've never gone higher than about 75/ft, and I didn't see any significant changes over 50/ft; so I went back down to 600w lamps. It was much harder to cool the 1k's properly, and temps may have been why I didn't see the benefits. All I know is that I'm quite happy at 50/ft, to each their own.
 

testing

New member
If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Are you running CO2, I would think you could benefit from it? I've never gone higher than about 75/ft, and I didn't see any significant changes over 50/ft; so I went back down to 600w lamps. It was much harder to cool the 1k's properly, and temps may have been why I didn't see the benefits. All I know is that I'm quite happy at 50/ft, to each their own.

The issue for me is it is kinda broke as far as cooling goes. My ac is able to keeps things around 77 but sometimes it just decides not to work properly and temps can climb into the high 80s. As far as veg goes this isn't a huge deal but id like to have more control over it. Hence why im trying to lower the wattage. I am using co2 around 1200 ppm
 
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