Register ICMag Forum Menu Features Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
You are viewing our:
in:
Forums > Marijuana Growing > Organic Soil > Soil amending/mineralization question

Thread Title Search
Post Reply
Soil amending/mineralization question Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 10-11-2018, 01:12 AM #1
Fiddynut
Senior Member

Fiddynut's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Six feet under
Posts: 1,502
Fiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really nice
Soil amending/mineralization question

Greetings friends.

I want to move toward a more natural approach to my grows. I've been getting what I think are calcium and magnesium deficiencies in all of my grows so far. After a couple years of growing I want to improve my results and quality. If I add liquid cal/mag it seems to make things even worse. I'm using RO water because my tap water is very poor for growing.
After reeding some of what slownickel has written and others I think more available calcium is a must for my grows to improve. I keep thinking about a post by budrunner on high brix growing where he talks about using a mix of 6-5-3 CaCo3-soft Rock phosphate-gypsum to mineralize and charge the soil. I'm hoping that I can use this formula or something similar to get my bag soil working better. His recommendation is to use 1 cup of the 6-5-3 mix for 2 cubic feet of soil.

Does anyone have any experience with this type of mineralization that can share thoughts with me?

I'm having problems finding the CaCo3 but I picked up a box of crushed oyster shell that I was hoping to substitute for the CaCo3. Any input on this would be appreciated.

Last question is how will adding this mix to my bag soil affect the soil pH and do I have to correct for this? I've been using happy frog soil but find its gotten really hydrophobic and have a couple bags of roots original and 707 that I want to mineralize.

Thanks in advance for any thoughts or suggestions...Fiddy.
Fiddynut is offline Quote


Old 10-13-2018, 04:51 AM #2
thailer
Newbie

Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 19
thailer will become famous soon enoughthailer will become famous soon enough
what type of compost are you using? adding the compost/biology that is needed helps to balance pH along with the lime sources. Using a premium compost brand or homemade will really up your game. I would avoid buying compost from home depot type stores and hydro stores that sell Ancient Earth. You might have to search for it but two brands that are decent are Malibu Compost and Olyfish Mountain Compost. Most compost you find in stores are made from wood products and its not as good as compost that uses a better variety of inputs.

When i first started I bought bagged dirt, some raw meal type fertilizers and that was it. my plants looked awful. Compost is essential.

If you are using compost, you could considering focusing on watering. that will help make nutrients available because if your pots are hydrophobic, that is going to cause plants to have problems like you're describing. wet dry cycles only worked when I was using bottled fertilizers but when i switched to raw meal fertilizers i noticed my plants grew better and were lush green if i didn't allow the soil to get so dry that it wouldn't take water readily. These two things really changed everything for me and solve similar issues.

you can find CaCO3 at any big box home center or garden center and its very affordable. When you find a bag of it, be sure to check the label and see if it's 93% or higher CaCO3. if not, it's a different type of lime like dolomite or hydrated lime. I've used the 6-5-3 and also the typical 1 cup per cubic foot of oyster shell or CaCO3 and noticed no difference.
thailer is online now Quote


1 members found this post helpful.
Old 10-13-2018, 07:33 PM #3
Fiddynut
Senior Member

Fiddynut's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Six feet under
Posts: 1,502
Fiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really niceFiddynut is just really nice
Quote:
Originally Posted by thailer View Post
what type of compost are you using? adding the compost/biology that is needed helps to balance pH along with the lime sources. Using a premium compost brand or homemade will really up your game. I would avoid buying compost from home depot type stores and hydro stores that sell Ancient Earth. You might have to search for it but two brands that are decent are Malibu Compost and Olyfish Mountain Compost. Most compost you find in stores are made from wood products and its not as good as compost that uses a better variety of inputs.

When i first started I bought bagged dirt, some raw meal type fertilizers and that was it. my plants looked awful. Compost is essential.

If you are using compost, you could considering focusing on watering. that will help make nutrients available because if your pots are hydrophobic, that is going to cause plants to have problems like you're describing. wet dry cycles only worked when I was using bottled fertilizers but when i switched to raw meal fertilizers i noticed my plants grew better and were lush green if i didn't allow the soil to get so dry that it wouldn't take water readily. These two things really changed everything for me and solve similar issues.

you can find CaCO3 at any big box home center or garden center and its very affordable. When you find a bag of it, be sure to check the label and see if it's 93% or higher CaCO3. if not, it's a different type of lime like dolomite or hydrated lime. I've used the 6-5-3 and also the typical 1 cup per cubic foot of oyster shell or CaCO3 and noticed no difference.
Greetings thailer.

Thank you for sharing some of your knowledge with me. You bring up a great point about the compost and biology that makes things work. I have very limited knowledge about the soil biology and soil food web but have been doing some reading here on the mag. Thank you for the compost brand recommendations as well. My original plan was to focus on mineralizing the soil and stick with the bottled nutrients for a couple more grows as I learn more and move into a more natural method. But of I can get my hands on some good compost maybe I can get off the bottle so to say sooner. I have a feeling that just adding the rock powders to the soil without the microbes and biology isn't going to get me where I want to be anyway.
Your point about the biology helping with pH makes sense too. And I've also heard form others about how it's best to keep things moist with a living soil as well. The wet/dry works ok with salt based frets sometimes but seems to be a big cause of stress with my plants.
Thanks again for sharing this with me. I hope this is the beginning of my jurny to more natural grow methods and better results...Fiddy.
Fiddynut is offline Quote


Old 10-14-2018, 04:17 PM #4
Ratzilla
Member

Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 461
Ratzilla is just really niceRatzilla is just really niceRatzilla is just really niceRatzilla is just really niceRatzilla is just really niceRatzilla is just really niceRatzilla is just really niceRatzilla is just really niceRatzilla is just really nice
Hello If i had some oyster shells i would put them in a sack and pulverize them ,the smaller the size of the particles the more readily uptake happens.
I buy the powered oyster shells myself.
I am of the opinion that 80% of ones base mix should be 65-70% Ca & 10-15% Mg.
If you get close to this 80% of your base mix being of this ratio your pH will be right where you want it 6.2-6.4
I also think that if there is a way for you to recycle your mix that you should to get the microbe-life working for you.
Adding back in a complete fertilizer or in your case Calcium and a magnesium after every grow.
I also add back all the leaves and stems from the previous grow ,after all these contain every thing that the plant wanted.
I also believe that being a good grower in using true living organic techniques that you must know that ultimately the plant is the conductor in deciding what it wants by what exudes it sends to the roots.
I build my pots with buried treasures of a complete fertilizer that feature low ratios of things trying not to go over anything that has higher ratios then a 8 IE; 3-8-8 bulb food or 0-3-0 soft rock phosphate a teaspoon or 3-4 on the bottom of your pots going into flower will give the roots the choice over mixing them in globally.
I also opine that liquids bypass the microbes which in turn retards their growth.
I mean if someone brought you a TV dinner every time your hungry would you bother working for a hamburger?
I also do a wet dry kind of cycle in using TLO techniques For I never let the medium dry out COMPLETELY.
Here is how I do it ,I look at a pot as having 3 layers a top a middle and the bottom.
I'll let the top go completely dry the middle will be going from moist to dry with the bottoms just going from wet to moist.
I know this from using a probe showing these dry-moist -wet levels.
I also water every time with a tea design to bring in more microbe life and see this new influx of bacteria eating the carcass of the life that died from the dry down.
In time you will discover what works for your growing techniques and you will think of it as your style.
Now we all need some style!
RatZ
Ratzilla is offline Quote


2 members found this post helpful.
Old 10-15-2018, 02:23 AM #5
OkieSmokie
Member

Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 294
OkieSmokie is a glorious beacon of lightOkieSmokie is a glorious beacon of lightOkieSmokie is a glorious beacon of lightOkieSmokie is a glorious beacon of lightOkieSmokie is a glorious beacon of lightOkieSmokie is a glorious beacon of lightOkieSmokie is a glorious beacon of lightOkieSmokie is a glorious beacon of lightOkieSmokie is a glorious beacon of lightOkieSmokie is a glorious beacon of lightOkieSmokie is a glorious beacon of light
Ill second the homemade compost. Start ASAP! I compost everything i can.

Vermicompost is even better. You can vermicompost indoors if you live in a small space.

I picked up a bag of oyster shells (the kind you feed chickens) for dirt cheep at the feed store. I add that to the compost pile to up the calcium content.

I also add calcium straight to the mix. Equal parts oyster shell powder, gypsum, and dolomite lime. Then used at whatever liming rate you desire. If you wanted a simpler liming mix, drop the dolomite and go with oyster shell and gypsum. Dolomite gets better if you recycle your mix...

If you are using organic soil, everything gets better as you recycle.

Vermicompost for the win!
OkieSmokie is offline Quote


1 members found this post helpful.
Old 10-15-2018, 02:27 AM #6
Avinash.miles
Caregiver Extraordinaire


Avinash.miles's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 8,179
Avinash.miles is a survivorAvinash.miles is a survivorAvinash.miles is a survivorAvinash.miles is a survivorAvinash.miles is a survivorAvinash.miles is a survivorAvinash.miles is a survivorAvinash.miles is a survivorAvinash.miles is a survivorAvinash.miles is a survivorAvinash.miles is a survivor
i prefer gypsum over oystershell meal/flour for Ca, gypsum doesn't push ph up like the ca carobonate
Avinash.miles is offline Quote


3 members found this post helpful.
Old 10-15-2018, 03:05 PM #7
Smith111
Newbie

Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 20
Smith111 will become famous soon enough
If a higher ph is needed, I would us lime rather than oyster shells. Oyster shells take a while to become available.
Smith111 is offline Quote


1 members found this post helpful.
Old 10-15-2018, 03:42 PM #8
MJPassion
Observer

MJPassion's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: uni-verse
Posts: 6,507
MJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avinash.miles View Post
i prefer gypsum over oystershell meal/flour for Ca, gypsum doesn't push ph up like the ca carobonate

^^^THIS^^^


The sulfur in the gyp will also add to your terps.
MJPassion is offline Quote


1 members found this post helpful.
Old 10-15-2018, 03:45 PM #9
LadyGuru
Member

Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 77
LadyGuru has a spectacular aura aboutLadyGuru has a spectacular aura aboutLadyGuru has a spectacular aura aboutLadyGuru has a spectacular aura aboutLadyGuru has a spectacular aura about
You should take a picture of the plant that looks worse after Cal Mg. Maybe your problem isn't low Ca, but ph?
LadyGuru is offline Quote


2 members found this post helpful.
Old 10-15-2018, 04:10 PM #10
MJPassion
Observer

MJPassion's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: uni-verse
Posts: 6,507
MJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond reputeMJPassion has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyGuru View Post
You should take a picture of the plant that looks worse after Cal Mg. Maybe your problem isn't low Ca, but ph?

There is either a Ca issue or a Mg issue. There is no such thing as a cal/mag issue. Those two minerals are antagonistic to one another and need to be adjusted/added separately. Liquid Cal/Mag WILL mess up your soil because there is always way to much Mg.


Excess Mg will cause a pH spike.
MJPassion is offline Quote


2 members found this post helpful.

Post Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 08:32 AM.




This site is for educational and entertainment purposes only.
You must be of legal age to view ICmag and participate here.
All postings are the responsibility of their authors.
Powered by: vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.