Got some problems.

10k · Nov 7, 2007

One question stitch I have for you...does fish tank dechlorinator remove the hard minerals in the water too. If so can it cause the problems my plant is showing.

Fishtank dechlorinator adds sodium to the water. Never use it for your plants.
Throw that fishtank chem crap away, its much better to just aerate a barrel of tap water for a day or two to remove chlorine. If your tap water has chloramine, you're pretty much stuck with it, because the fishtank treatment chem is worse, causing unwanted sodium in the water.

I think I'd be more concerned about those top leaves curling tubular like they are in the picture, heat stress or maybe the sodium salts ???

but anyway...did you flush the plant with this 'sodium water' too ?

Feeding twice a week. But one is at 1/4 dosage 1/4 ounce pbp flower, 1 tsp LK, just added 1 tsp calmag first and second weeks. Going into the 3rd week so I bumped her up to at least half ounce pbp flower with 2 tsp LK no calmag this go round. The other feeding is an extremely watered down version of a normal feed that I give her. The soil is fox farms ocean forest with light warrior mix 1/2 perilite. PH testing is done with a pen not the cheap ones its nice...direct in soil type. The leaf is a lower fan. As far as water goes it tap...dechlorinated and ph buffered to about 6.9 to 7 the pbp brings it down to 6.8-6.6.

Ok so I made a new mix of nutes... 1/2 oz of pbp flower, 2 tsp LK, and an advanced feeding of calmag which was recommended at 2 tsp. The PH of the mixture this time was at 6.7.It has been 3 days since I flushed with a gallon of water. The pot felt relatively light, and the roots are more than established. I fed with 2 and a half solo cups full of the mixture. Enough so just a little was in the drip pan. So now I will wait and give it 4 days of no watering to see what she does.

I'm just about beating my head against the monitor here, bouncing all over this thread trying to figure out what ratio of nute concentrates to water you are mixing. I mean, you mention quantities (in more than a couple posts) of pbp etc but never say how much water you're mixing it into ??
Is that per gallon ?

MynameStitch · Nov 7, 2007

I'm just about beating my head against the monitor here, bouncing all over this thread trying to figure out what ratio of nute concentrates to water you are mixing. I mean, you mention quantities (in more than a couple posts) of pbp etc but never say how much water you're mixing it into ??
Is that per gallon ?

LOL! 10k that is why I was going to choose not to help out, because he could not give me a straight forward answer and he was splitting up his answers into several different posts..... and I could not understand which was what. I told him to stop using that mineral reducer.... but did not know it replaced it with sodium..... ewww very bad!

MynameStitch: I would not use fish dechlorinator, I have heard people use this and cause some problems; the only way do get it out is to let the water sit out for 24 to 48 hours.

The only way you are going to remove hard minerals or remove some is getting a filter system or put in a REverse osmosis system (RO).

Nope that is all the info I need, if it does not say safe for plants on the back of the bottle, I would not use it, cause if it takes minerals out of the water, I am sure it will affect other minerals as well.... so I would stop using it and see what happens. cause everything else is checking just fine with your grow.

Is that the first time you used this?

This is the only post that has single handily drove me nuts too 10k!

KushaNator · Nov 7, 2007

No I did not flush with that stuff, just plain water that had been sitting for 24 hours as stitch had suggested. But that crap is currently in the trash can. The ratio is mixed in with a gallon and maybe give or take an extra 1/4 of a gallon but I mix as if I was putting it into a gallon container. So I am not overfeeding I know that, no burns or anything. Sorry for not mentioning that, I think thats the only thing I have failed to mention as far as mixing the nutes go. I apologize again I know I am scatterbrained but you have to feel my anxiety from this situation. But I took another PH sample of the runoff in the bottom of the container and it was at 6.7 so it has since gone up.

As far as the fish tank stuff goes it was purchased at a hydro store and said that it was ok to use...so either I was bsed or ripped off.

The new mix of nutes was minus the fish tank crap. Again with water that had been sitting out for roughly 36 hours and the PH was 6.8-6.9. Again I will say it was mixed with a gallon of water plus an extra give or take 1/4 of a gallon. I added an advanced treatment of calmag 2 tsp as recommended, 1/2 oz pbp, and 2 tsp of LK.

As far as feeding goes to clarify things I flushed with a gallon...maybe a little more and this is the first time in 3 days she has been fed. The upper soil was dry and pot was relatively light. Fed her I would guess 1/4 of a gallon.

But to 10k, I have never had a problem with heat stress the canopy level is at 76 degrees and my box temps usually never get above 77. Cool tubed 250 with intake of 85 cfms, outtake of 145 cfms.

But hopefully this will answer your questions. Sorry again for not clarifying this is my first time doing some major posting any future posting I will be sure to be straight forward.

KushaNator · Nov 7, 2007

What STRAIN are you growing? Female Seeds NL

What was the establishing technique? (seed or clone?) Seed

What is the age of your plants? Almost 2 months old

What PHASE (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in? Flower, week 3

What Technique are you using? (SOG, SCROG etc) LST

What size pots are you using? (Include how many subjects to pot) Gallon 1/2, 1 plant in the pot

What substrate/medium are you using? (percentage of perlite,
vermiculite...etc?) Fox Farms Ocean forest 1/4, fox farms light warrior 1/4, perlite 1/2

What Nutrient's are you using? *Knowing the brand is very helpful* PBP, clearex, Cal mag, Hydroguard.

What is the TDS/EC/PPM of your nutrients used? Uncertain

What is the pH of the "RUN-OFF"? 6.7

What method of pH test was administered? Newly adopted ph pen

When was your last water? yesterday

When was your last feeding? yesterday

What size bulb are you using? 250 watt HPS

What is the distance to the canopy? roughly 6-7 inches (Cool tubed)

What is your RH Factor? (Relative Humidity) 55%

What is the canopy temperature? 77 degrees

What is the Day/Night Temp? (Include fluctuation range) Day 75, night 64, 11
degrees variation.

What is the current Air Flow? (cfm etc.) Intake 85 cfms, out take 145 cfms, with 175 cfm duct fan for the cool tube, with a canopy cooling fan.

Is the fan blowing directly at plants? Somewhat, blowing of the top colas.

Is the grow substrate constantly wet or moist? Moist

Is your water HARD or SOFT? HARD

Has plant been recently pruned, cloned or pinched? Negative

Have any pest chemicals been used? If so what and when? Negative

Are plant's infected with pest's? NO

Ok this will make things easier instead of looking all over the forum. :spank:

MynameStitch · Nov 7, 2007

I think your main problem was using that crap; whenever you add something else to the picture that is not original it always going to offset a balance.

So I would see now what happens. Remember how I said it looked like a P deficiency?
Well later on in my 2nd grow, I started having that same spotting and then realized it was my water; I had sodium in it the local water company; since I lived in a small town and the town had it's own company...... they were using water softners.
So it totally screwed up my plants. THey only used it in the summer/fall times.... why is beyond me. It caused me to have major P issues and crispy leaves.... it also caused me to ruin about 10 seedlings they would get about 2 sets of leaves and stop growing.

So I had to cart RO water and suppliment and the issues went away.
So your situation is sorta like mine was.......

I woulda used a bit more water to flush out that soil...... but we will see if it goes away now.. hopefully it will

Sorry to say you were BSED, those hydro guys are so full of crap it seems anymore.....
They get you in there and talk to you; try to be buddy buddy.. the ones that want to help..... and they try to sweet talk ya and get you to buy stuff.

Sounds like a used car salesman.

Anyways; do not feel bad; now you know how they work !

KushaNator · Nov 8, 2007

Yea it seems as after that feeding she seemed to respond well. The spots slowed dramatically, but the affected leaves are worse now. So should the next nute batch I mix be higher in P to give it more of what she needs or just leave at the current nute mix of 1/2 oz pbp per 1 and 1/4 gallons of water.

KushaNator · Nov 8, 2007

By the way shes starting to put on a snow show...its gonna be a frosty Christmas!

MynameStitch · Nov 8, 2007

Why are you using hydroguard when you are growing in soil? Pitch that.... that helps prevent root rot/fungus issues; it's harder to get root rot in soil than hydro. Also your plants are bigger now; your plants have built up to where they can have a better fighting chance to fight off root fungus if they got it; severe cases is when you would need to step in.... and the main cause would be you over watering/ high humidity.

You can get root rot; but it's rare. The clearex, I would use it once a month; It would seem if used to much it may leech other benifical nutrients that are in need in the soil. nutrient's do not build up over a week unless you are bashing them with nutrients; you are not. So stop using that for now.

Just use the pbp and cal-mag.

How do you know your water is hard without testing it with a TDS meter?
If your water is hard, depending on how hard; you would not need to use Cal-mag.....
Cal-mag is needed for semi soft water or for people who use RO,distilled water.

Btw, how often were you using that clearex?

KushaNator · Nov 8, 2007

I don't I was just saying that to clarify what I have as far as my nute lineup and supplements go. The bottle has never been opened just came in the bundle of clearex and cal mag. I called my utilities provider and they said that they have hard water... failed to mention they soften it over the winter and spring months, so the water processing plant said. The clearex was only used when I flushed my soil and thats it. In veg I only used pbp veg, and in flower I usually give my plants a small dose of calmag, hit her with lk, and pbp flower.

KushaNator · Nov 8, 2007

Hmm your seedling issue is strikingly similar to mine. The water quality is more than likley to blame here and me using that crap. I went through about 10 bagseeds, before finally getting my NL out and she made it so I was shocked. But they would get their 2nd leaves and all the sudden die...just turn yellow and crap out. No feedings or anything just using plain water. I wonder if my water company is doing something different this year because I have never had ANY problems with it. Oh well would you suggest using RO, bottled water...not distilled I hear that has a lower ph 5.5ish, or stick with my tap.

MynameStitch · Nov 9, 2007

ailed to mention they soften it over the winter and spring months, so the water processing plant said.

They did the same shit to me!!! Craziness you are in the same situation I was in......
If your plants do not clear up after a bit looks like you are going to have to start hauling in water. Ok good, that clearex should help get rid of some of the sodium left in the soil rinsed out.

Ya, the ph of the RO and stuff has low ph; just add some lime to your soil and that will fix the ph issue.

Here is a pic of one of my sick bogglegums... never recovered to much sodium in the water. I let that thing live for 3 months and it just started to yellow around 2 1/2 months... did not take up much water either. So I just plucked it.

KushaNator · Nov 10, 2007

Isn't that some shit. Thats exactly what my plants looked like I had 10 bagseed babies running and they would have the droopy leaves and would just turn yellow, they also showed extremely slow growth.

But as far as my NL girl goes...she honestly seems to be responding better. Still some slight spotting but nothing near as bad as it was. Since the last feeding which was 2 days ago I think I know what may be contributing to my problem. She seems to be a nute hog because she sucks up all the water in the soil. I checked on her yesterday and the top inch of the soil was dry and the pot has at least enough moisture for a day or two before a plain watering.

I also called the water processing plant and they said their water has a low sodium content, but switched this year to softening their water as much as they have.

On another good note, she is starting to return back to her normal dark green color. The full body shot that I included she is more lime greenish on the top. I added a small amount of pbp grow to my last mix "failed to mention that". But it seems as if she just needed a little N, by a little I mean about 1/4 of a tsp.

She shows no signs of slowing down and is starting to pack on some weight. Getting a nice coating of trichs too which I have to say at day 29 is impressive. Sadly to say I did not take of clone of this pretty lady, Def the keeper out of my 4 pack I had. But I do not think the spotting is effecting her flowering at all, I can still tell a big difference in flower production. The main colas are starting to make their final stretch and should finish out at about 4 to 5 inches or so, gonna be dense too. I will take a pic next week for you to see.

MynameStitch · Nov 10, 2007

But as far as my NL girl goes...she honestly seems to be responding better.

OMG I am so freaked right now; I will have to find the other picture; I was also growing NL at the same time of this grow and they too were growing fine with minimal issues.....

FREAKED! how scary is that lol.

You can't judge how much water she takes because the top layer of soil is dry; you want to lift the pot before and after a good watering to find out when she needs to be watered and when she does not.

10K has a link about it you can read it here:
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=47761

THats good to hear; sodium is some bad crap for plants!

Ya water companies are crap sometimes they could have posion in your water and not tell you about it.. they getting as crooked as other companies are.

We live near a toxic waste dump 2 miles away and these ****ers wanted to expand and they are RGHT OVER ARE WATER SUPPLy sanosky water supply which supplies out entire area; these ****ers test our water 4 times a year; so by the time there is a spill it's to late because it takes years for that to leech down into the soil and down into the water.

We have the higest cancer rate in our city for our state; out of the entire damn state!
Thank god them punks will be closing down in 5 years; these fags take in stuff from out of state and have a licence to store toxic waste, but no radioactive waste. So everything but Nuclear waste.

KushaNator · Nov 10, 2007

After seeing her today I honestly cannot tell if she is recovering or still deficient. I know the old leaves that were spotted are going to die. But on some of the new leaves the spots are appearing just not as bad. Bud production is not a problem as I have stated before. The PH is the same as it was 4 days ago 6.7. Should I flush again or let it go out.

MynameStitch · Nov 11, 2007

Sodium is something that is going to take a little time; flushing helps but what is already in the plant is going to take a little time.
So it will slowly heal; at least the plant is big and not small......

NL kicks ass!

Here is a picture of my tree; I had 2 different phenos one was small and bushy and the other was a tree :tup:

You are going to have some serious smoke ahead of ya

I am a light weight lol Never smoked it rec use; I started to grow for med purposes.

Guest · Nov 11, 2007

I'll chime in with the crew,,

Adding one thing to remove anothe thing will most always make a whole new thing.

Don't think the hydro store is full of good things for your garden and always remember the clerk is paid to sell, so it's your job to do your homework.

You may get quicker recovery if you re-pot and replace the contaminated soil. I had a pH issue, due to a double strong batch of pH down, that didn't get checked--- anyway cught the problem when the garden went to shit - nursed the girls for a couple watering cycles - and finally repotted with fresh soil - that seems to have turned the corner with most of them.

KushaNator · Nov 11, 2007

How do you suggest repotting. When I say this girl is fully rooted I mean you can pull her out of the pot and see her huge root ball. If I felt safe enough to do that I would but in all honesty I think I would just do more damage that way. Yes I know that would solve the problem immediately, what would you do rinse the root ball under water?

Stitch what would you suggest I do if the spotting doesn't go away.

Guest · Nov 11, 2007

For my girls - I waited till they were due to be watered and pulled them from the pot, got pretty phisical with the roots to remove a lot of the soil/pearlite. ( I also use FF and pearlite mix) Put a fresh layer in the bottom put the plant in and filled w/ fresh - it helped with in a couple days

If yours are really full of dense roots, - you may be due for a re-pot anyway - could be a contributung factor.

MynameStitch · Nov 11, 2007

I would not take the plant out of the pot unless it's rootbound; I would just flush her with more water; but you would also be removing nutrients from the soil as well.....

so give her a little more time; if the spotting continutes post a pic here so we can see.
Cause you said you used like a gallon of water? A normal through flush consists of 2x the amount of water to the size of the pot. 5 gallon size pot needs around 8 to 10 gallons of flushing;

KushaNator · Nov 12, 2007

Ok so heres the good news. Seems as if she is starting to come around :jump:

. She has since packed on more flowers than ever before...grew about half an inch. The spots are still appearing, seems as if its localized to the leaf "area" of all the affected leaves I removed.

I wish I could post a pic of the new progress because I would love for you to see if she is right where she needs to be for day 30. She has about 25-30 days left I cannot wait to see how chunky and skunky she gets. :joint:

Until then I will smoke one for you stitch you have been a great help! :rasta:

I will try to get a pic up asap because man shes frosting out hardcore.

Got some problems.

burnt out og'er

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