Powdery Mildew - Large scale Greenhouse

Pepé The Grower · Apr 7, 2019

https://www.nj.gov/health/eoh/rtkweb/documents/fs/1482.pdf

If you grow for yourself, it's your choice to spray that kind of stuff on your plants. If you grow commercially, that's plain insane and criminal. Who want to smoke flowers sprayed with a cancer hazard chemical?

TnTLabs · Apr 7, 2019

yeah fuck handling that stuff...
what MK is saying though is that once it degrades its just peroxide and acetic acid...
im in no way saying its ok to use... but either way for me there are safer and better ways to deal with PM...
but i still want to hear / see some info on the chelated micros

Elmer Bud · Apr 8, 2019

Again -

Look up Peroxyacetic Acid.

You can wave bye to PM.

Mountain Kine said:
Yes the raw PAA is extremely dangerous and must be handled with correct PPE. We mix a 15% concentrate at a 1:2500 ratio.

Check out how many industries PAA is used as a CIP agent. It's about the safest thing you can use.

G `day MK

That`s a lot more complicated than buy this stuff and wave good bye to PM . No ?

And what about the not compatible with - Peroxyacetic Acid is not compatible with ALKALIES;
HEAVY METALS; METAL SALTS;

Thanks for sharin

EB .

mexcurandero420 · Apr 8, 2019

Coconut water contains the metals you need, even Sea-Crop sea water extract (95% Na reduced) contains the metals you need.

About the use of PAA in horticulture

Hyperox is registered with the CTB under no. 12731, Hyperox is approved as a surface disinfectant and for use as a footwear dip. Hyperox is a combination of peroxyacid and hydrogen peroxide, the unique formulation means there is a higher level of these active substances, which means a more powerful effect.

About CTB
The task of the Dutch Board for the Authorisation of Plant Protection Products and Biocides (Ctgb) is to assess whether plant protection products and biocidal products are safe for humans, animals and the environment before these products can be sold and used in the Netherlands.

So PAA is not for use on plants as a foliar spray.

Fourtay · Apr 8, 2019

Pepé The Grower said:
https://www.nj.gov/health/eoh/rtkweb/documents/fs/1482.pdf

If you grow for yourself, it's your choice to spray that kind of stuff on your plants. If you grow commercially, that's plain insane and criminal. Who want to smoke flowers sprayed with a cancer hazard chemical?

Zerotol
Oxidate
Sanidate

Are examples of PAA containing agriculture products.
PAA is an organic peroxide, an oxidizing agent. It instantly breaks down into air and water. You don't have to rinse anything because there is nothing to rinse. There is no residue.

If still in doubt:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MCxxdgXom4w

Fourtay · Apr 8, 2019

Also, for OP, by now you have learned that once you see pm throughout the greenhouse, it exponentially increases by the hour. If you swing your humidity and temps or try and spray in an effort to save the harvest, it only makes the PM worse. The best and most profitable course of action is to cut down your affected plants, clean the building and start over with a better strategy.

Pepé The Grower · Apr 8, 2019

Fourtay said:
Zerotol
Oxidate
Sanidate

Are examples of PAA containing agriculture products.
PAA is an organic peroxide, an oxidizing agent. It instantly breaks down into air and water. You don't have to rinse anything because there is nothing to rinse. There is no residue.

If still in doubt:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MCxxdgXom4w

I had no clue poultry were the same as cannabis :laughing:

https://www.biosafesystems.com/assets/zerotol-2.0-specimen-label.pdf

This pesticide is toxic to birds who eat treated seed exposed on soil surface

This pesticide is toxic to fish

ZeroTol 2.0 is a liquid bactericide/fungicide used to treat and control plant pathogens on ornamental plants and turf

The safety of ZeroTol 2.0 has not determined on all plants and crops. Plants grown in greenhouses vary greatly from those grown under field conditions. Determine if ZeroTol 2.0 can be safely used prior to appli-cation.

https://www.nj.gov/health/eoh/rtkweb/documents/fs/1482.pdf

There is limited evidence that Peroxyacetic Acid causes cancer in animals. It may cause cancer of the lungs. * Many scientists believe there is no safe level of exposure to a carcinogen. Such substances may also have the potential for causing reproductive damage in humans.

Q: Should I be concerned if a chemical causes cancer in animals? A: Yes. Most scientists agree that a chemical that causes cancer in animals should be treated as a suspected human carcinogen unless proven otherwise. Q: But don't they test animals using much higher levels of a chemical than people usually are exposed to? A: Yes. That's so effects can be seen more clearly using fewer animals. But high doses alone don't cause cancer unless it's a cancer agent. In fact, a chemical that causes cancer in animals at high doses could cause cancer in humans exposed to low doses.

And you peeps do spray that on your plants? :crazy:

Did you ever read that data sheet or do you just listen to the blurb of your sales man??

There's no need for such products when you grow cannabis. If ever you do have to need to use such product, then you're doing it wrong (growing cannabis).Period.

I'm afraid you guys will use any arguments possible to justify your irresponsible comportment. With peeps like you, we don't need big tobacco/alcohol/pharma to screw-up cannabis reputation as a safe medicine...

TnTLabs · Apr 8, 2019

Fourtay said:
Also, for OP, by now you have learned that once you see pm throughout the greenhouse, it exponentially increases by the hour. If you swing your humidity and temps or try and spray in an effort to save the harvest, it only makes the PM worse. The best and most profitable course of action is to cut down your affected plants, clean the building and start over with a better strategy.

sorry, but from my point of view that may not be wise.
of course depending on how far into the cycle he is and how quickly he has noticed PM spreading. but if he still hasnt gotten in control since starting this thread, then yeh too late.
but if its only on a few plants say 5 from 100 then there will hardly be a problem, if he puts effort into it... if 50 from 100 are effected then sure, might be wiser to start over.
it will need work, and one can finish a crop with a minor % of loss, depending on some important factors of course that we dont know

no idea if mesures were taken to filter the incoming air for one,
also if he has very cold air coming in from outside, this will cause problems as well.
best to have day & night temps as close as possible +/- 5 *C
so most prob will need a heater in there for the night...
plus other factors

but lets say theres only limited visual infection, then

1 - get rid of plants that are the most infected
2 - pluck leaves from plants that are slightly infected
3 - add ventilation
4 - use potassium silicate with feeds
5 - spray horsetail, citric acid, lactic acid, compost teas, beneficial bacteria like in og biowar or (potassium silicate, not sure if its regarded as organic )
6 - clean walls and workspace
7 - keep plucking leaves that seem infected

but to say once you see PM its too late and one has to start over, is a bit over the top

THC123 · Apr 8, 2019

I know I keep repeating myself, but I never worry about PM, I just use my uvc light and relax

and then I harvest clean and safe cannabis and enjoy

Fourtay · Apr 9, 2019

So, do the vegetable producers need this product? What about hospitals or food industry?

Do you know what paa mode of action is?
Do you know why and when it is dangerous?
Rei and why? Phi and why? Ld50?

moses wellfleet · Apr 9, 2019

THC123 said:
I know I keep repeating myself, but I never worry about PM, I just use my uvc light and relax and then I harvest clean and safe cannabis and enjoy

Is it only for veg, I read it destroys trichomes?

THC123 · Apr 9, 2019

Nope it does not destroy trichomes or damage the plant. Not with this system. A buddy of mine once made his own uvc light, it was powerful as fuck but even shining the light for 3 seconds burned the plants. I never ever had problems with the cleanlights system and once even used it after trimming just to be safe.

GMT · Apr 9, 2019

I saw that skimmed milk was useful. What's wrong with full fat milk?

THC123 · Apr 10, 2019

It is not really usefull and you have to rinse the plant or it will smell bad and forget about spraying milk in flowering.

Mountain Kine · Apr 10, 2019

Elmer Bud said:
G `day MK

That`s a lot more complicated than buy this stuff and wave good bye to PM . No ?

And what about the not compatible with - Peroxyacetic Acid is not compatible with ALKALIES;
HEAVY METALS; METAL SALTS;

Thanks for sharin

EB .

Hi - they’re not sprayed in combination so there’s no issue. The chelated metals are their own spray that happens 2X per week. PAA is used when there are visible signs of fungal pressure. Our fertilizer formula puts enough CA to the plants that we RARELY have an issue.

Fourtay said:
So, do the vegetable producers need this product? What about hospitals or food industry?

Do you know what paa mode of action is?
Do you know why and when it is dangerous?
Rei and why? Phi and why? Ld50?

PAA is a broad oxidizer. Vegetable producers absolutely use PAA. Same with breweries and hospitals.

The only issue with it seems that it’s too professional of an option to the participants on this thread.

:tiphat:

THC123 · Apr 10, 2019

LOL we are producing GMP certified cannabis and have aces to everything we want but we choose simply NOT to spray anything on our plants ever! The reason is that our product is heavily tested for any contaminants. Another reason is because I know that I would not spray anything on a flowering plant that I would consume myself...we are not talking about apples with a skin here that can be washed.

So stop that condescending tone dude!!! The best and safest cannabis is produced without spraying ANYTHING on the plant!!

ANother producer in holland, bedrocan, also does not use fungicides or pesticides, it is possible with the right setup, procedures and integrated pest management.

In my country Paa is not allowed in the cultivation of vegetables.

I have no doubt that Paa works very well, but i do have my doubts about the safety and quality of your cannabis. But hey go ahead whatever works for you...... spraying is the easiest most practical way of combatting PM, no argument there, but it is not the safest or best....In the US using these things is allowed, but in canada and europe the product is tested and no contaminants are allowed and for very good reason. In the US you can do what you want as long as you put it on the label.

mexcurandero420 · Apr 10, 2019

Mountain Kine said:
PAA is a broad oxidizer. Vegetable producers absolutely use PAA. Same with breweries and hospitals.

The only issue with it seems that it’s too professional of an option to the participants on this thread.

Probably its difficult to understand that PAA is used not to spray vegetables, but to use in the guidelines of HACCP.In the food industry its used as cleaner to avoid contamination of certain microorganisms.Btw vegetables are meant to be eaten, not to be smoked. :tiphat:

Mountain Kine · Apr 11, 2019

mexcurandero420 said:
Probably its difficult to understand that PAA is used not to spray vegetables, but to use in the guidelines of HACCP.In the food industry its used as cleaner to avoid contamination of certain microorganisms.Btw vegetables are meant to be eaten, not to be smoked.

IT leaves no residue so not really sure why you keep bringing up the eaten vs smoked factor. I'd be much more concerned with things passing in to the liver but that's just me.

Is absolutely used in production as well as post process and cleaning.

:tiphat:

Fourtay · Apr 11, 2019

PAA is in zerotol 2.0. Zerotol is meant to be sprayed on fruits and vegetables. As well as chemigated, and used for cleaning. George Cervantes suggests a hydrogen peroxide bath for post harvest remediation of PM affected cannabis branches as a dip and rinse.

My only hesitation would be the interaction between the organic peroxide and the oil glands. But I'm not chemist.

prune · Apr 11, 2019

Fourtay said:
PAA is in zerotol 2.0. Zerotol is meant to be sprayed on fruits and vegetables. As well as chemigated, and used for cleaning. George Cervantes suggests a hydrogen peroxide bath for post harvest remediation of PM affected cannabis branches as a dip and rinse.

My only hesitation would be the interaction between the organic peroxide and the oil glands. But I'm not chemist.

Most people do not get any smarter as they get older, and Cervantes would seem to be centered on that bell curve...

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