LEC ? Ceramic

2 Legal Co · May 7, 2015

I know this sub forum is for LED. Since I haven't seen anything on ICMag about LEC, I am asking this question from the closest audience....

Has anyone done any research on these?
Had a salesman in a Hydro Shop try to sell me one of these..... model was 315 watts?

Always something new to look at. Or is this just the progression of the LED tech.?

Jhhnn · May 7, 2015

2 Legal Co said:
I know this sub forum is for LED. Since I haven't seen anything on ICMag about LEC, I am asking this question from the closest audience....

Has anyone done any research on these?
Had a salesman in a Hydro Shop try to sell me one of these..... model was 315 watts?

Always something new to look at. Or is this just the progression of the LED tech.?

"LEC" is Sunsystem's terminology ( light emitting ceramic) for the Philips 315w CDM Elite, a ceramic metal halide system discussed here-

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=299165

Supposedly the best tech currently available, if pricey. I have the parts on order.

Somebody else may be using the same terminology to describe something entirely different.

Avinash.miles · May 7, 2015

yes, what jhhhn said, i suggest checking out the 315w ceramic metal halide AKA light emiting ceramic.

personally i dislike the sunsytem model because the bulb is vertically oriented, imo it should be horizontally hung in hoods.

2 Legal Co · May 7, 2015

thx guys

IIRC This was by Phillips.

Beta Test Team · May 7, 2015

What was by Philips? Are you writing Phiilps called their CMH (which they call CDM), a LEC? If so can you please post where you found this? Also, just wondering why you posted this in the LED forum?

As Jhhnn pointed out, "LEC" is used by SunSystems (and as I pointed out it's a lame marketing ploy, in that thread he linked to), sadly though it's not a correct term at all.

Jhhnn · May 7, 2015

Beta Test Team said:
What was by Philips? Are you writing Phiilps called their CMH (which they call CDM), a LEC? If so can you please post where you found this? Also, just wondering why you posted this in the LED forum?

As Jhhnn pointed out, "LEC" is used by SunSystems (and as I pointed out it's a lame marketing ploy, in that thread he linked to), sadly though it's not a correct term at all.

He thought the guy was trying to sell him some sort of LED system, that's all. That's why he asked here.

2 Legal Co · May 8, 2015

Indeed, I did think it was another step up in the LED TECH progression.

I believe And that is why I started a new thread 'just in case' it belonged elsewhere. Since then I have discovered a whole thread (18pages I believe), that is devoted to this particular item/system. I think I saw Jhhnn, that you have been there as well.

Looks like Beta Test Team is/was having a testy day that I posted it here. Sorry to have offended.... But since I am the OP.... either move it or don't read it. But I do appreciate the input....LOL.... at least I didn't hijack one of your threads to ask the Q...

And of course with my shitty memory, it may well have been Sun instead of Phillips... perhaps it just had a Phillips Argo/Agro, in it??? who knows. I think I may just go get one tomorrow to play with. Bit expensive but it sure sounds like it may be an answer for the winter basement grows. It sounds like it makes a bit more heat than I'm accustomed to, but for the cooler times? well who knows.

Avinash;
I presume your build is eminent? Are you doing yours horizontal,,, and what lamp are you going to use?

Sorry for neglecting my own thread, but I was busy elsewhere, reading other threads on ICMag.

Jhhnn · May 8, 2015

I'm just testing components until after this round finishes, probably the end of July. Then I plan on converting my 1000w supersun 2 reflector for two 315w lamps.

2 Legal Co · May 8, 2015

I'll be mostly done with lighting till this fall after memorial day,,, or there about. I'll be going up to my 'Fishing Shack' where I use the 'Big Bulb in the Sky' for the summer. I've got a little old shed that has grown a clear roof.

Operating expense is the juice it takes to run 5 airstones. LOL ... but I only have room for 4 plants... one per homer and a control bucket. Keeps me out of trouble, ya know. Didn't do too well last summer only ended up with 21 oz. after they were cut and dried..... but the price was definitely Right.

I really do enjoy the folks here on the Forums. Lots of knowledge to be gained here. I've found growing to be very interesting now that I'm retired (keeps me out of trouble... well mostly).

By the way if anyone else is offended by my thread please let me know and I'll report myself to a Mod and have it removed. Not looking to be the Adam Henry (AH) here.

EDIT: I reported myself to the Mods., requested they move it to a more appropriate venue.... no one else has said anything... and I do appreciate that.

Avinash.miles · May 8, 2015

2 Legal Co said:
Avinash;
I presume your build is eminent? Are you doing yours horizontal,,, and what lamp are you going to use?

Sorry for neglecting my own thread, but I was busy elsewhere, reading other threads on ICMag.

no plans immediately to add more of these lights to my room, really i just can't afford to convert at the moment, after my... "restart".
but if i COULD i would do them vertical in econo-wing style reflectors, but would also LOVE to drop some bare bulb 315w's down into the canopy for supplemental side lighting...

Beta Test Team · May 8, 2015

2 Legal Co said:
Indeed, I did think it was another step up in the LED TECH progression.

Looks like Beta Test Team is/was having a testy day that I posted it here. Sorry to have offended.... But since I am the OP.... either move it or don't read it. But I do appreciate the input....LOL.... at least I didn't hijack one of your threads to ask the Q...

By the way if anyone else is offended by my thread please let me know and I'll report myself to a Mod and have it removed. Not looking to be the Adam Henry (AH) here.

EDIT: I reported myself to the Mods., requested they move it to a more appropriate venue.... no one else has said anything... and I do appreciate that.

Not at all. I didn't care at all you posted this in the LED forum, I simply asked why. Not sure why asking a simple question evokes such a response from you; it seems you think you're a victim of my outrage (huh?).

If asking a simple question makes you respond in such a way I think maybe you're a little too touchy.

Good luck with your grows, and good choice with the Philips 315W CMH.

2 Legal Co · May 8, 2015

Beta
Perhaps I do read too literally..... I've found over the years that the printed word is easily taken literally and beyond.

I've endeavored to 'soften' my printed communication to make up for the lack of eye contact and body language. If you were to read your tirade of Qs from my point of view, or a 3rd person, i expect you'll see what I mean. lol

NO harm No foul. :tiphat:

Beta Test Team · May 8, 2015

Sorry if my questions seemed like a "tirade" to you, I can assure you they were not meant that way.

When you wrote "LEC" was used by Philips is why I asked where you read it, not to challenge you, but to see what was being stated by Philips.

I agree, inflection is tough on the interwebs. It's all good.

If you go with the Philips 315W CMH I think you'll be happy. I prefer the MasterColor Elite 942 (T12) in an open fixture, but the GreenPower (aka MasterColor Elite Agro 930) as T9 or T12 is also really good. The main difference is spectra between the two lamps, but the differences are not large.

2 Legal Co · May 8, 2015

With any luck I'll have one of the SunSystems? units in hand by COB today. Looking forward to using it this fall after the temperature cools down a bit.

This particular one has the Phillips lamp @ 3100k.

By the way. Is there a 4100k that is safe to use in that socket/reflector? From what little I've gleaned (that I can remember), I think that might be an even better fit for what I'll be using it for.

I'm planning on pushing my Big T5s down the line... or maybe selling them eventually. I'm thinking I will lose some weight, but dropping from 864= 2x432,,, down to 350 will also lower my electric usage somewhat.... I hope.

My current little setup stays in the lower 70s F, so I have some headspace for a bit more heat. May also add an R or an Aero, to the DWC. LOL I'll Never get dialed in at this rate... but that's all right, sort of. I have some F3 Bubblegum (SS), that needs to be revisited. That and the F3 AK47 are getting to be in short supply.

Cheers

Saving Genetics seems to be a 'hobby' all by itself!

Beta Test Team · May 8, 2015

I think the 3100 K lamp you're referring to is the GreenPower, which used to be called the MasterColor Elite Agro 930. Then there's also the non-Agro MasterColor Elite 930, but that's not the one that ships with the SunSystem "LEC" luminaire.

The T9 version is for enclosed fixtures, the T12 is rated for open fixtures or not using a fixture (reflector) at all.

I think the 4100 K lamp you're referring to is the MasterColor Elite 942, that's the lamp I use. If I understand you're question correctly, yes, you can use the 942 in your SunSystem reflector, and IMO it's the better of the two (Agro 930 vs. 942), for all growth stages due to its spectrum.

2 Legal Co · May 9, 2015

Tell me what you think of this one.

http://denver.craigslist.org/grd/4969563945.html

I've emailed for details.

Is this a recognizable package? ....

2 Legal Co · May 9, 2015

Couldn't/didn't make contact on the SunSystems unit. On CL for $250. We'll see.

Perhaps I should be asking. What are the parts worth to DIY your own? I'm not above a bit of 'assembly'.

Some store down here on Countyline rd has an add on Cl as well. Their "major discount" price is $500. LMAO

Beta Test Team · May 9, 2015

The thread by rives (that Jhhnn posted) has lots of info about DIY using Philips 315W CMH. Advanced Technology Solutions (http://advancedtechlighting.com/products.htm) seems to have gotten a lot better about filling orders in a timely manner and better customer service, and their prices are very low.

If you haven't read rives's thread yet i'd suggest starting there.

Both Jhhnn and rives (and many other people) know much more than I about DIY luminaires.

2 Legal Co said:
Tell me what you think of this one.

http://denver.craigslist.org/grd/4969563945.html

I've emailed for details.

Is this a recognizable package? ....

That CL ad is full of a bunch of bunk claims, such as:
- comparing a 315w to a 600w and a 1,000W (totally not true, and sounds like typical LED marketing lies)
- greatly reduced heat production (again, not true to the extent they seem to claim)
- open fixture use, which is a very important point, that you should not use that lamp without the glass shield (as that lamp is not open fixture rated, from the looks of it).
- claiming the "Philips 315w MasterColor technology is FAR more efficient than other lights for growing plants," which isn't true at all, that title goes to DE HPS lamps, like Philips 1,000W DE HPS.

Furthermore, while it's hard to tell from the pictures, I bet you'll need a 240-277V power source for the ballast, or a converter for a 120V power source. A convertor isn't cheap, as you want 3x the wattage of the system (at 339W) for the converter, so, at least about 1,000W converter (which is like $150-200).

That price is way more than you should pay, as it's a cobbled together system, that's all it is, nothing special, and you still need to buy more components; and after reading the idiocy in that CL ad I would stay far away from that person and their "expertise."

Jhhnn · May 9, 2015

2 Legal Co said:
Couldn't/didn't make contact on the SunSystems unit. On CL for $250. We'll see.

Perhaps I should be asking. What are the parts worth to DIY your own? I'm not above a bit of 'assembly'.

Some store down here on Countyline rd has an add on Cl as well. Their "major discount" price is $500. LMAO

If you're not going to use it until next fall, there's plenty of time to hold out for the right deal. I've watched deals come & go on CL for used sunsystems & others in the $300-350 range.

What are you using now & how tough would it be to bring in 240v?

It was easy for me- the breaker panel is on the other side of the outside wall from the grow space.

I haven't done this, so take it with a grain of salt, but I see no need to massively oversize a voltage converter because it doesn't switch the load like a timer. It's just a transformer with the usual high inrush current to build the magnetic field. As rives pointed out elsewhere, you might need a slow blow fuse rather than the standard. Hell, you can get a 1000w model for under $50-

http://www.amazon.com/Goldsource-ST...1431141089&sr=8-22&keywords=voltage+converter

If you already have a mogul base reflector, the cheapest new equipment answer is a mogul base 315w lamp & philips ballast from ATL, a voltage converter & a few bits and pieces as discussed here-

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=6936864&postcount=503

The mogul base lamp has basically the same features & performance as a pgz18 T12 942 lamp in a different wrapper.

Beta Test Team · May 9, 2015

Jhhnn said:
I
I haven't done this, so take it with a grain of salt, but I see no need to massively oversize a voltage converter because it doesn't switch the load like a timer. It's just a transformer with the usual high inrush current to build the magnetic field. As rives pointed out elsewhere, you might need a slow blow fuse rather than the standard. Hell, you can get a 1000w model for under $50-

http://www.amazon.com/Goldsource-ST...1431141089&sr=8-22&keywords=voltage+converter

Nice pricing, I guess I was thinking of much larger converter (looking over notes I think I was thinking about 5K watt).

About the oversize converter, the 3x figure is what is claimed by Simran (I'm pretty sure it's their claim), something I wrote to you in PM I think(?). I too haven't used a step up converter for a luminaire, though 'better safe than sorry' may not be a bad rule to follow in this case, especially considering your point about lowish cost for a 1K watt converter.

LEC ? Ceramic

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