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BioBizz anyone.

Ez Rider

Active member
Veteran
Nice to see so many people chiming in on this. Thanks to everyone:tiphat: I've been laying low for a few weeks, but I'm just a few weeks away from beginning my first flower run with the BIZZ. So far, the veg has looked really good. FishMix has a definite ODOR, but the ladies love it. After consideration, and talking with the BioBizz people, I've decided to PH my feed at ~6.3, using organic PH+. My feed is in the low 5's before adjustment. BioBizz says you want to avoid using PH-, because it kills the microbes. Hoping to have some pics to rival vStagger in a few months. Maybe I'll do a grow diary.
 

Luxman

Member
Nice to see so many people chiming in on this. Thanks to everyone:tiphat: I've been laying low for a few weeks, but I'm just a few weeks away from beginning my first flower run with the BIZZ. So far, the veg has looked really good. FishMix has a definite ODOR, but the ladies love it. After consideration, and talking with the BioBizz people, I've decided to PH my feed at ~6.3, using organic PH+. My feed is in the low 5's before adjustment. BioBizz says you want to avoid using PH-, because it kills the microbes. Hoping to have some pics to rival vStagger in a few months. Maybe I'll do a grow diary.

Yes, the ladies DO love that smelly fish mix!

The folks at BioBizz have been really helpful. I realize that many people pride themselves over not adjusting ph and whatever works for you guys, but after talking to them I began to adjust all liquids to 6.4. From what I was told, you want to keep your soil ph between 6 and 6.5 for maximun P and cal mag uptake. If your soil mix stays this high already this requires less or no ph adjustment, but my mix (half Ocean Forest and half Sunshine #4) drops to mid to low 5 ph if I don't adjust, and that really translates to less on the scale at the end. I've done side-by-sides that confirm this.

I also started topdressing with soil sweet (lime) at the end of week 4 to counteract the lowering ph trend in my soil mix. I end up with a zone at the top that is about 6.8 and a zone at the bottom that runs 5.7 to 6.0 - that dual zone seems to really please the girls.

For those arguing that less is better: I know that you can grow fantastic plants on much less with organics. Note that I'm adding a pretty small amount of additional PK via the two guanos that I use; it's about diversity of food sources as well as bulk-building and resin-boosting. I would venture one thing to consider: you can't create something from nothing. The plant converts nutrients into flower mass, and minimal nutrients will not give the biggest yields IMO. If your particular strain likes less, though, go for it. If it ain't broke, don't fix it, right? :tiphat:
 

Well

Member
I only use biobizz bloom right now, just felt like i wanted to try bio instedof CANNA.
Only on week 1 with biobizz, so not much to tell yet, but i think i will love it :)
 

Breeder X

New member
My results with BioBizz have been good. Its pretty low smell, even the fish mix. I use BioBozz grow, fish, and bloom in an even spread in both veg and bloom phase. I start using 2.7 mL per gal (of each of the 3) for rooted cuttings and work up to 5.5 mL per gal by finish, which is low but I also supplement with 2 guano (mixed type) tea feedings during flowering phase. Initially the water/fertilizer mix had a pH of 5.6 but the soil pH always averaged 6.5, probably the effect of nitrate converting to ammonium in the soil. However, I ran into Iron deficiency problems, which required the use of a supplement that drops the water pH down to 4.5, so I am required to adjust the pH (but only because the supplement).
 

Breeder X

New member
Initially the water/fertilizer mix had a pH of 5.6 but the soil pH always averaged 6.5, probably the effect of nitrate converting to ammonium in the soil.
Sorry, I meant the pH probably raised from the organic Nitrogen(-NH2) converting to Ammonium (NH4) in the soil.
 

Ez Rider

Active member
Veteran
So I'm into about week 3 of veg under 1K's, and the plants seem to be slowing down and getting a little pale. I've been ph'ing to ~6.2 before watering, and I've tried a few foliar's with fish mix. Maybe I'm just being paranoid, but I haven't had a GOOD run since I started with organics. Biobizz info desk sort of disowned me when I mentioned using RO water, as they say this(RO water) is outside their experience. Any of you peoples using RO with the Bizz? How do you do it? I'm using BioBizz Light-Mix, straight out of the bag, in fabric pots in case anyone forgot/didn't know. Feeding per BioBizz schedule. I add GeneralOrganics ca/mg and nutes to my water, then ph to ~6.2 using ph+ crystals from earth juice. Maybe I should be going higher? Like maybe 6.4-6.5? It's in the mid 5's if I don't adjust, and the one time I watered without adjustment, the leaves all curled up for a day. Anyway, here's a few pics under a t5...
 

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Ez Rider

Active member
Veteran
Well, Granger2, nice to hear from you :biggrin:

No, I haven't tried the tap. They put chlorine and other nasties in the water supply here. Also the sodium count is ~200ppm according to the water report. Just for grins, I filled a bucket with tap last night and checked it with a meter today. PH is ~7.8 and tds is ~420. For curious parties, it's ~6.4ph and ~5tds after RO. Maybe I'll add BB to the tap, and see what the meter says...

Info I've received from BioBizz is a little confusing. If you look at the BB website, it'll tell you "no ph/ec adjustments are necessary".

When I contacted their info desk, they told me this: "There is normally no need to lower the pH. If your water is pH 6,4 add the Biobizz nutrients and see what pH level you get. This is because Biobizz products have a pH of 5,0 to 5,5. This will lower the pH a bit. We prefer you stay at around 6,0-6,3. If you end at 5,8 after adding Biobizz: that can work as well. The idea to use water with a pH of 7,0 is indeed a good advice because the pH after adding Biobizz would be around 6,5. The soil would do the rest. If you can avoid using pH down, do that for sure. It will only kill the bacteria in our products."

Another recommendation they gave was: "An old trick we used in Holland: Start with a pH of 5,8, slowly up it over the weeks to until you end in the final weeks around 6,5".

5.8-6.5 is a pretty wide range. The Light-Mix I'm using is peat cut with pearlite as far as I can tell. There's no compost or EWC in it, so I wonder if peat alone can really buffer the PH throughout this range. I've always been told that peat is naturally acidic. I have noticed that the lower the PH of my feed, the less the plants like it. The leaves will all droop for a day, before perking back up.

I'm thinking if I can get the ph issue dialed in, things will go very well indeed. I'll keep you(all) posted.
 

Luxman

Member
Well, Granger2, nice to hear from you :biggrin:

No, I haven't tried the tap. They put chlorine and other nasties in the water supply here. Also the sodium count is ~200ppm according to the water report. Just for grins, I filled a bucket with tap last night and checked it with a meter today. PH is ~7.8 and tds is ~420. For curious parties, it's ~6.4ph and ~5tds after RO. Maybe I'll add BB to the tap, and see what the meter says...

Info I've received from BioBizz is a little confusing. If you look at the BB website, it'll tell you "no ph/ec adjustments are necessary".

When I contacted their info desk, they told me this: "There is normally no need to lower the pH. If your water is pH 6,4 add the Biobizz nutrients and see what pH level you get. This is because Biobizz products have a pH of 5,0 to 5,5. This will lower the pH a bit. We prefer you stay at around 6,0-6,3. If you end at 5,8 after adding Biobizz: that can work as well. The idea to use water with a pH of 7,0 is indeed a good advice because the pH after adding Biobizz would be around 6,5. The soil would do the rest. If you can avoid using pH down, do that for sure. It will only kill the bacteria in our products."

Another recommendation they gave was: "An old trick we used in Holland: Start with a pH of 5,8, slowly up it over the weeks to until you end in the final weeks around 6,5".

5.8-6.5 is a pretty wide range. The Light-Mix I'm using is peat cut with pearlite as far as I can tell. There's no compost or EWC in it, so I wonder if peat alone can really buffer the PH throughout this range. I've always been told that peat is naturally acidic. I have noticed that the lower the PH of my feed, the less the plants like it. The leaves will all droop for a day, before perking back up.

I'm thinking if I can get the ph issue dialed in, things will go very well indeed. I'll keep you(all) posted.

It really largely depends on what your soil mix is. That varies widely with their customers so they have good overall advice.

The ideal ph range for broad nutrient uptake in organic soil is from 6 to 6.5. Anything from 5.7 to 6.5 seems to work great for me, but YMMV.

Note that most nutrient uptake charts show P being mostly taken up from 6.3 on upwards; calcium and magnesium also get taken up at this higher ph level. Their advice to range upward with ph is likely because the buds want a PK boost during weeks 5-6 so they can bulk up. So if your ph is well below that level it may cause a slower uptake and an accumulation of these nutrients and eventual problems - although this is less of a problem with bio-organic nutrients because the microbes handle it all pretty well, and the molassis in BioBizz is a great cheleting agent.

I found it really helpful to test my soil's ph (not the runoff) at various times throughout flowering. I dig down into the root zone and get a sample and test it with a LaMott soil test kit. Amazon has them.

I use a mix of half FFOF and half Sunshine #4 organic, and at the start before even fertilizing it tests at around 6.0 ph, but even adding my Biobizz nutrients at 6.4 every time it ends up being in the mid-5 ph region by around the end of week 4.

At that time I topdress and mix into the top 4 inches some Lily Miller soil sweet (finely milled dolomite; I use 3/4-1 cup per #15 pot) and that brings it up to 6.4 or so in the top zone, and it stays a bit lower ph towards the bottom for a dual-zone ph effect. Seems to work well. :tiphat:
 

Granger2

Active member
Veteran
EZ, yeah, that's a lot of sodium. I see your problem. Have the CalMag and EJ Microblast ready to go with the RO as needed. Are you all healed up yet? Good luck. -granger
 

Ez Rider

Active member
Veteran
The ideal ph range for broad nutrient uptake in organic soil is from 6 to 6.5.

So what I'm wondering is: Does light-mix, which is mostly peat with pearlite and probably some lime/oyster shell(BioBizz doesn't list the ingredients) count as an"organic soil", wanting a PH of 6-6.5 or is it more of a hydro mix wanting ~5.8 PH? When I use H&G nutes in lightmix I keep it at 5.8 or the plants suffer. When I apply BB at 5.8, the plants don't seem to like it. The leaves "fist" up for several hours afterwards. Applying BB at ~6.3 seems to keep the plants happier(no curl), but they wont green up as much as I'd like. Maybe I should bump it up to 6.5 and see what happens?

I have been considering getting an electronic PH soil probe, as they are becoming quite reliable, and almost reasonably priced.



EZ, yeah, that's a lot of sodium. I see your problem. Have the CalMag and EJ Microblast ready to go with the RO as needed. Are you all healed up yet? Good luck. -granger

Mostly healed, still a little sore. However I've got a new bike on the way to help ease the pain :woohoo: . Thanks for asking.

What I'm looking at now is mixing 1/2 and 1/2 tap and RO water. This should put my water at ~7.0 PH and 200ppm, which the BB people say is pretty much ideal as a base. The feeding schedule I'm using calls for a weekly foliar with the alg-a-mic once flowering starts. I'm shooting for start of flower sometime this week. Hopefully this cuts it...I tossed all my EJ products except the PH crystals. I already feel that things are much closer to being dialed in with BB than was EVER going to happen for me with EJ.

The strain I'm growing is prone to excessive foliage/branching. I just had to do a major thin out followed by tying them down/spreading them out. As soon as these bitches hit 24"...it's ON. I am hoping to get them a little greener, but overall I'm happy.

Here's a few pics. I normally shoot through my method 7's, but added one without for contrast.
 

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Luxman

Member
So what I'm wondering is: Does light-mix, which is mostly peat with pearlite and probably some lime/oyster shell(BioBizz doesn't list the ingredients) count as an"organic soil", wanting a PH of 6-6.5 or is it more of a hydro mix wanting ~5.8 PH? When I use H&G nutes in lightmix I keep it at 5.8 or the plants suffer. When I apply BB at 5.8, the plants don't seem to like it. The leaves "fist" up for several hours afterwards. Applying BB at ~6.3 seems to keep the plants happier(no curl), but they wont green up as much as I'd like. Maybe I should bump it up to 6.5 and see what happens?

I have been considering getting an electronic PH soil probe, as they are becoming quite reliable, and almost reasonably priced.

Well, the light mix is mainly soilless, but you are adding bio with the BioBizz... that's a good question that I can't honestly answer. I like to have some EWC and compost in my mix to sustain the microbes even more and add more nitrogen, and that makes my mix more 'half-soilless' (since Sunshine #4 is similar to light mix). I also use BioBizz Fish Mix in the first 3 weeks of flower to sustain nitrogen levels; there really isn't very much nitrogen in just the combo of BioGrow and BioBloom IMO. After that you will want the nitrogen levels to drop off.

I don't think you would see any negative effects by getting your liquid's ph to around 6.4-6.5. Iron is usually taken up in soil from about 6.6 downwards, so an occasional feeding of micros down at ph 6 might be a good idea just for some balance, or you could try a foliar feeding with a product that has some iron in it if you see issues. They really go ape shit with Alg-a-Mic foliar feeding every week in veg, too. But that isn't usually used in flower.

Different strains have slightly different preferences, so make decisions based upon general garden health rather than pissed-off individuals. I'm at a point now where almost any issues I develop are self-corrected as long as I hit them every time with food. Whenever I use a food/water/food/water regimen I get problems; they seem to demand food every watering.

Below is what I give my plants throughout veg. I do add some expensive additional products; you may not want to do that, but it will definitely pay for itself many many times over. My philosophy is don't jump over the dollar to get to the dime.

I can assure you that you will see extreme health so give it a try:

Continuous feed - hit them with this at every watering, per gallon (about every 4 days):

5 ml BioGrow
5 ml Bio Fish (aka Fish Mix)
10 ml BioHeaven
10 ml Roots Trinity

ph adjusted to 6.5.

And when I near the transition week I also add 5 ml of Roots HP2 for some extra P and bump the BioHeaven up to 15 ml/gallon.

People don't like to pay for BioHeaven; my clients constantly bitch about it. But the stuff WORKS. Personally I wouldn't grow without it, but YMMV. I also hit them with GH's CaMg+ every 2nd watering or so for cal/mag and micros.

There is a ph pen by Rittenhouse on Amazon that looks really nice, I've been meaning to grab one. The LaMott soil test kits are a bit expensive but seem to be accurate. I try not to get too obsessed with checking ph; you can drive yourself a bit crazy with it. But when my soil was down in the low 5 range I knew I had to move in with the lime topdress.
 

Ez Rider

Active member
Veteran
Well, the light mix is mainly soilless, but you are adding bio with the BioBizz... that's a good question that I can't honestly answer. I like to have some EWC and compost in my mix to sustain the microbes even more and add more nitrogen, and that makes my mix more 'half-soilless' (since Sunshine #4 is similar to light mix). I also use BioBizz Fish Mix in the first 3 weeks of flower to sustain nitrogen levels; there really isn't very much nitrogen in just the combo of BioGrow and BioBloom IMO. After that you will want the nitrogen levels to drop off.

Allegedly, the fish-mix "brings the light-mix to life" by dent of its microbial activity. Going on this assumtion, I'll treat it like soil. Thus far(veg), I've been using only fish, heaven and rootjuice at 8ml/gal each, with a weekly foliar of fish at 8ml/gal. I did apply a foliar of fish/alg-i-mic at 2.5/2.5ml/gal a few days ago. this seemed to green them up some. I'm going to do a full strength(8ml/gal) foliar of alg-i-mic tonight, after I water. I'm thinking that I may be low on micro-nutes.
I don't think you would see any negative effects by getting your liquid's ph to around 6.4-6.5. Iron is usually taken up in soil from about 6.6 downwards, so an occasional feeding of micros down at ph 6 might be a good idea just for some balance, or you could try a foliar feeding with a product that has some iron in it if you see issues. They really go ape shit with Alg-a-Mic foliar feeding every week in veg, too. But that isn't usually used in flower.
One of the charts I have recommends a weekly foliar of alg-i-mic every week in flower. Fish every week in veg. I'll attach the chart, hopefully I'm not breaking any rules.
Different strains have slightly different preferences, so make decisions based upon general garden health rather than pissed-off individuals. I'm at a point now where almost any issues I develop are self-corrected as long as I hit them every time with food. Whenever I use a food/water/food/water regimen I get problems; they seem to demand food every watering.

Below is what I give my plants throughout veg. I do add some expensive additional products; you may not want to do that, but it will definitely pay for itself many many times over. My philosophy is don't jump over the dollar to get to the dime.

I can assure you that you will see extreme health so give it a try:

Continuous feed - hit them with this at every watering, per gallon (about every 4 days):

5 ml BioGrow
5 ml Bio Fish (aka Fish Mix)
10 ml BioHeaven
10 ml Roots Trinity

ph adjusted to 6.5.

And when I near the transition week I also add 5 ml of Roots HP2 for some extra P and bump the BioHeaven up to 15 ml/gallon.

People don't like to pay for BioHeaven; my clients constantly bitch about it. But the stuff WORKS. Personally I wouldn't grow without it, but YMMV. I also hit them with GH's CaMg+ every 2nd watering or so for cal/mag and micros.
I keep hearing about cost. Where I'm at, I can get a 5 liter of all 6 products(grow,bloom,fish,topmax,bioheaven, and alg-i-mic) for $750 +tax. About 1/3 of that cost is bioheaven. I can get 2 runs out of the 5 liters, so about $400 per run or $200 per 1K HPS. Next time I'll get the 10L's and save another 30%. Get it down to under $150/1K HPS Unless you're doing lucas or some shit like that, I think $150 per light per run for nutes is pretty reasonable. Especially when it's all organic. If you buy 1L at a time it's going to kill you with any brand. I may incorporate some additional products next run, just trying to keep it simple for now.
 

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Luxman

Member
I keep hearing about cost. Where I'm at, I can get a 5 liter of all 6 products(grow,bloom,fish,topma x,bioheaven, and alg-i-mic) for $750 +tax. About 1/3 of that cost is bioheaven. I can get 2 runs out of the 5 liters, so about $400 per run or $200 per 1K HPS. Next time I'll get the 10L's and save another 30%. Get it down to under $150/1K HPS Unless you're doing lucas or some shit like that, I think $150 per light per run for nutes is pretty reasonable. Especially when it's all organic. If you buy 1L at a time it's going to kill you with any brand. I may incorporate some additional products next run, just trying to keep it simple for now.

Agreed! My food costs run about 6% of my returns. The quality is totally off the hook, and each crop is very consistent.
 

habeeb

follow your heart
ICMag Donor
Veteran
can anyone put more input onto ca/mg.

I know the folks over at UK boards have to add ( can't remember, Ca or Mg ) as there is something too low in the bottle, and also I think they were mixing the veg and bloom in flower???

wondering people's water quality starting with ( tap or R/O )
 

Ez Rider

Active member
Veteran
can anyone put more input onto ca/mg.

I know the folks over at UK boards have to add ( can't remember, Ca or Mg ) as there is something too low in the bottle, and also I think they were mixing the veg and bloom in flower???

wondering people's water quality starting with ( tap or R/O )

Water quality/content is dependent on where your water comes from. In my area, the municipal supply is well water, and is high in minerals. My latest newsletter says we average: 123ppm calcium, 60ppm magnesium, 130ppm sodium to site a few. My water is ~7.5PH tap, and ~6.4PH RO. I've been using 60/40 tap to RO water to cut down on the sodium. The PH of the water stays much more stable when you leave some minerals in it. I've found that the PH of RO water alone is prone to fluctuate wildly when adding organic nutes. So far, the tap/RO mix seems to be working well. I've got some GO ca/mg on hand in case a ca/mg deficiency pops up.

I'm on the left coast, usa, so I've got no idea about UK water. According to BB, ca/mg are present in the nutes themselves to some degree.

All the charts/schedules I've seen recommend using the grow and bloom in conjunction during. Organic grow doesn't inhibit flowering the way synthetics will. Something to do with the N in organics being amino based I believe. I'm better with concepts than details:biggrin:
 

Piff Rhys Jones

🌴 Hugging Trees 🌴
Veteran
I've used biobizz since I started and have been using a pack that I purchased about four years ago with good results. It's about to run out and I notice they have changed their packaging and the formula of the nutes since I bought them last.

The grow used to be 8-2-6 but is now 4-3-6. The bloom ratio has changed slightly too. I wonder why they did this as I had very good results with the original ratio.

Are you guys still using yoiur biobizz and getting good results?

Thanks!

Peace
 

LasergunJesus

New member
Well seeing as I cannot send you a PM Mister D I can respond here. About to switch to these nutes from the Canna line. Growing in RO Greenlite soil. Had some issues with canna this time around I did not like. Was not a good grow for me. I would like to know more about your feeding plans a bit if you dont mind.
 

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