3x3 vs 4x4 lit by hlg 260/550 - Heat?

olday · Jan 28, 2020

Previous grower (HPS cabinet) looking to start again in tents / LED

It seems like there is a big jump between 3x3 which could be lit by a hlg 260 and the 4x4 lit by a 550 in terms of cost but my concern is heat. Either way I’d be going with a 6” fan/filter (cloud line on amazon but I’m open) would be the choice either way

Tent would be setup in the basement in the northern Midwest (IL) but I would prefer to not have to get into ac units if I don’t have to.

So for those who know, does the 4x4 with the larger light set me up for cooking my plants vs the 3x3 being a regret for wishing I went a little larger.

** I’m flexible on brand of anyone has strong opinions on led lights, HLG chosen based on reviews

MedFaced · Jan 28, 2020

I would prefer the largest/tallest tent and the 550. I use a 260 in a 3x3 and 3x4. They do generate some heat but it’s manageable. I live in a warm area and can generally keep my tent in the low 80’s when it’s around 76ish degrees outside the tent. I mount the driver outside the tent because that’s the hottest component. Also set up my exhaust ducting directly on the heat sink to help both cool light and extract hot air.

olday · Jan 28, 2020

Ty for the reply

I take it you feel you could pull off the 550 in a 4x4 where you are at?

Just fretting because it’s unfairly big price jump if I can’t be happy with the temps

MedFaced · Jan 28, 2020

Wow. I just looked at the price tag. They run sales on it a couple times a year. I think it was around $200 cheaper during the holidays. Maybe hold out until 4/20 for another sale or go over your other options.

f-e · Jan 28, 2020

I believe the hlg260 is 240, and Kingbrite will deliver one in a few days for $150

I would put a couple in the 4x4 and don't see how 200w could change a basements temperature much. Though your basements size and structure are as beyond me as your weather.

Koondense · Jan 28, 2020

4x4 - get 3x qb260 with dimmer(run at 180w each)

3x3 - get 2x qb 260 dimmed at around 160w

When needed increase the power and follow the temperatures, with leds the plants thrive in 28-32°C range.

Cheers

olday · Jan 29, 2020

Thanks all - the multi light option is interesting as it leads to more flexibility later - that makes the 3x3 option more appealing as the tent is really the cheapest piece. Thank you for that

art.spliff · Jan 29, 2020

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olday · Jan 29, 2020

Thank you - checking it out now

LostTribe · Jan 31, 2020

Koondense said:
4x4 - get 3x qb260 with dimmer(run at 180w each)

3x3 - get 2x qb 260 dimmed at around 160w

When needed increase the power and follow the temperatures, with leds the plants thrive in 28-32°C range.

Cheers

Hey!

I was asking kingbrite about lighting for a 4x4 footprint and they said 1x240w hlg?? Said it was a similar output to my HPS 400w.

Koondense · Jan 31, 2020

Actually 2 will do the job if running at 100% power, only one will be good for veg, not enough for flowers. With three you can have higher efficency and more even lightning, if you have the money go with 3.

The hps is irrelevant here and a 400W hps is not enough for a 4x4 in the first place, people run 600 or even 1000w hps in such tents.

Cheers

f-e · Jan 31, 2020

A 600 with it's 90,000 lumen is 'just' enough for a 4x4. Just. A 400 isn't as efficient as a 6, so you don't just loose a third, there is quite a gap between them.

3 of them would be nice, if the option is on the table. Then you have about 500w a meter to play with. Kingbrite even do them with the two boards on separate heatsinks, sharing the driver. It's about $10 more, but a better spread and they then fit in a typical size cardboard box.

Here is 3 of them over a meter

olday · Jan 31, 2020

f-e said:
A 600 with it's 90,000 lumen is 'just' enough for a 4x4. Just. A 400 isn't as efficient as a 6, so you don't just loose a third, there is quite a gap between them.

3 of them would be nice, if the option is on the table. Then you have about 500w a meter to play with. Kingbrite even do them with the two boards on separate heatsinks, sharing the driver. It's about $10 more, but a better spread and they then fit in a typical size cardboard box.

Here is 3 of them over a meter
[URL=https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=78998&pictureid=2005563&thumb=1]View Image[/url]

Well, those plants don’t lie - nice and healthy and plump.

@LT - the HLG site lists the 260 for flower over a 2x4 and a 3x3 but puts forward the 550 (and like above I’m sure multiple 260s) over the 4x4. I also has the veg specs that are like above where the 260 would slide in for a 4x4.

I know we “aren’t supposed” to go Watts per foot anymore, but it seems like 30 per foot is a good rule of thumb for the QBs (all internet research and no first hand experience... yet)

I kind of like the option of a 2x4 by now with the 260 which makes for an easier upgrade to double it later. Other funds could go for a 2x2 with a 4K for vegging that would get the pipeline rolling and help me get things dialed in before I make a bigger mess. Not a first time grower but this would be a newer/different and larger setup than what I was working with before

TrichomeDome420 · Feb 2, 2020

I am also in the market for quantum boards for a 4×4. Currently running a 315cmhin a 3×3 and a 600hps in a 2×4. Want to ditch the hps and the 3×3 and use the 4×4 for flowering and the 2×4 for mother/clones. Really considering the kingbrites on alibaba, same components as hlg at half or quarter the price. Was gonna get a 3k 480 watt panel with IR but am considering two separate 240 panels to be more flexible. Anybody running the Kingbrites now and how are they compared to hlg? They also have a spider farms knockoff that's rubber coated and has all the wiring covered and seems to be made better than the kingbrites and comes with UV diodes on top of the IR. It only comes to $267 with shipping! That's half the price of the spider farms lite. Are they legit though? Are the drivers real meanwell or some cheap knockoff guts shoved into a meanwell casing?

olday · Feb 2, 2020

I’m in the same boat as you, hard to look at the hlg and not take a peek at the Kingsbrite

I may get my first from hlg and when I expand, give the kingsbrite a try. I know it sounds “extra” but I don’t want to burn my house down over $200

Koondense · Feb 3, 2020

Hlg are much cheaper than just buying parts a few years ago, these chinese kits have ridiculous prices. Just get any of these lights and start growing, no need to overthink it.

Cheers

Mars Hydro Led · Feb 4, 2020

olday said:
Previous grower (HPS cabinet) looking to start again in tents / LED

It seems like there is a big jump between 3x3 which could be lit by a hlg 260 and the 4x4 lit by a 550 in terms of cost but my concern is heat. Either way I’d be going with a 6” fan/filter (cloud line on amazon but I’m open) would be the choice either way

Tent would be setup in the basement in the northern Midwest (IL) but I would prefer to not have to get into ac units if I don’t have to.

So for those who know, does the 4x4 with the larger light set me up for cooking my plants vs the 3x3 being a regret for wishing I went a little larger.

** I’m flexible on brand of anyone has strong opinions on led lights, HLG chosen based on reviews

Hi buddy, if you want to save some money on light cost, check out our TSW2000 for 3x3 tent and TS3000 for 4x4 tent. :biggrin:

guide: hit my signature "marshydro system" into our website. :tiphat:

f-e · Feb 4, 2020

TrichomeDome420 said:
I am also in the market for quantum boards for a 4×4. Currently running a 315cmhin a 3×3 and a 600hps in a 2×4. Want to ditch the hps and the 3×3 and use the 4×4 for flowering and the 2×4 for mother/clones. Really considering the kingbrites on alibaba, same components as hlg at half or quarter the price. Was gonna get a 3k 480 watt panel with IR but am considering two separate 240 panels to be more flexible. Anybody running the Kingbrites now and how are they compared to hlg? They also have a spider farms knockoff that's rubber coated and has all the wiring covered and seems to be made better than the kingbrites and comes with UV diodes on top of the IR. It only comes to $267 with shipping! That's half the price of the spider farms lite. Are they legit though? Are the drivers real meanwell or some cheap knockoff guts shoved into a meanwell casing?

Kingbrite offer the boards with UV and IR if you want them. It's getting into marketing though. A single UV LED of the right band, costs more than the whole damn light. They are for use in medical equipment, for skin treatment. We are not getting them. If you look to the aquarium market for UV, you will again see they are not getting them. Substantial amounts of UV come from Mercury vapour, within a cfl realistically. However it still isn't regarded as useful photons by the masses. It's niche.
IR or rather far red can cause some much needed stretch, and aid transpiration, a driving force behind xylem movement. In the photo above, there is an emitter hanging in the middle. Most people will of missed it, and seen a general service lamp instead.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incandescent_light_bulb
^^spectrum charts.

Edit: Using a separate emitter for your IR means you can power it for 15 mins each side of your light cycle. I don't though, as while it can shorten the night requirement, it's also calling for a shade response. Growth associated with growth, not flower. I don't need a shorter night, so I haven't got involved. Yet.

Edit2: I'm not convinced the additional 660nm reds are worth it. Our plants didn't respond well to just red+blue and so we have moved to white. So the logic of adding red again needs some proof. What I do like about it though, is the pattern they draw on the floor when shining through a tiny crack. Worth the extra $10? I'm not sure. I could of had more lm301 with it's ~3umol but instead have some 660s I can't account for.

Edit3: Lighting is a huge topic that we will never reach the end of in our lifetimes. At some point, you just have to buy a light. Without one, you could be loosing $100 a week buying smoke you could of grown. So just grab 25-50w a foot of known diodes that everyone is using, and get on with it

TrichomeDome420 · Feb 7, 2020

f-e said:
Kingbrite offer the boards with UV and IR if you want them. It's getting into marketing though. A single UV LED of the right band, costs more than the whole damn light. They are for use in medical equipment, for skin treatment. We are not getting them. If you look to the aquarium market for UV, you will again see they are not getting them. Substantial amounts of UV come from Mercury vapour, within a cfl realistically. However it still isn't regarded as useful photons by the masses. It's niche.
IR or rather far red can cause some much needed stretch, and aid transpiration, a driving force behind xylem movement. In the photo above, there is an emitter hanging in the middle. Most people will of missed it, and seen a general service lamp instead.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incandescent_light_bulb
^^spectrum charts.

Edit: Using a separate emitter for your IR means you can power it for 15 mins each side of your light cycle. I don't though, as while it can shorten the night requirement, it's also calling for a shade response. Growth associated with growth, not flower. I don't need a shorter night, so I haven't got involved. Yet.

Edit2: I'm not convinced the additional 660nm reds are worth it. Our plants didn't respond well to just red+blue and so we have moved to white. So the logic of adding red again needs some proof. What I do like about it though, is the pattern they draw on the floor when shining through a tiny crack. Worth the extra $10? I'm not sure. I could of had more lm301 with it's ~3umol but instead have some 660s I can't account for.

Edit3: Lighting is a huge topic that we will never reach the end of in our lifetimes. At some point, you just have to buy a light. Without one, you could be loosing $100 a week buying smoke you could of grown. So just grab 25-50w a foot of known diodes that everyone is using, and get on with it

I'm already growing, just trying to get more efficient and I'm done paying for HPS bulbs. I found a 240 QB on Alibaba today for $104 with free shipping! I'm grabbing 3 next week. Getting rid of my 315 and 600 now and going full LED. They come with the 660nm diodes too. They claim they are the LM301b chips. Never seen free shipping on alibaba to the states either. 3 units come to $312 total.

HerbChambers · Feb 7, 2020

TrichomeDome420 said:
I'm already growing, just trying to get more efficient and I'm done paying for HPS bulbs. I found a 240 QB on Alibaba today for $104 with free shipping! I'm grabbing 3 next week. Getting rid of my 315 and 600 now and going full LED. They come with the 660nm diodes too. They claim they are the LM301b chips. Never seen free shipping on alibaba to the states either. 3 units come to $312 total.

Can you share the link or keywords I should search to find this great deal?

3x3 vs 4x4 lit by hlg 260/550 - Heat?

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