Is there an OMRI listed liquid nutrient that will work in hydro?

Obviously if you run organic matter in a liquid with air your going to have bacteria. This leads me to believe that there can probably never be a truly organic liquid fertilizer for hydroponics. Mind you it is possible to do organic hydroponics, I have yet to see a uniform system that will produce consistent results.

I have never seen a true hydro organic run ever in my life. I've also never seen an OMRI listed product that I think would work in a system like DWC or NFT.

Does someone actually know of a true organic hydro product?

For the love of god don't say PBP, its not fudging organic and never will be, if it was it wouldn't have calcium carbonate, potassium carbonate and 1 other mineral and would be OMRI listed.

I don't know much about biodigestion, but I understand it reduces whatever is being digested to a stable mineral product. I don't know that one is commercially available, so you may have to make it yourself.

If you consider coco hydro, then the simple answer is yes, but you already knew that, so I guess you want a system with active reservoir.

Isn't aquaponics a true organic hydroponics?
Organic matter (fish waste) converted to nitrite's and other substances by several types of friendly bacteria, then by other types of friendly bacteria on to nitrate's useable by plant's (bacterial waste).

Mr Celsius said:

For the love of god don't say PBP, its not fudging organic and never will be

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I dont know why, but that just mad me rofl.

I have never seen a true hydro organic run ever in my life.

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I used to see those all the time when I worked in the woods. Anywhere there was slow flowing or standing water I would see these pot plants just growing and thriving everywhere.

They would be just growing there floating on lily pads with their roots growing freely into the water below.

All the woodland animals would be doing various tasks taking care of the plants. It was quite the beautiful wilderness musical. All the critters would stop from time to time and break into song and dance.

I was wondering if this would count as organic hydro?

Sorry. Couldn't help myself.

hydroflower said:

Isn't aquaponics a true organic hydroponics?
Organic matter (fish waste) converted to nitrite's and other substances by several types of friendly bacteria, then by other types of friendly bacteria on to nitrate's useable by plant's (bacterial waste).

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Ya, of course thats true hydro-organics, but I'm looking for a bottled nutrient that will give consistent results.

Thanks for the responses. I guess nothing really exists out there... o well. I'll stick with the good old soil for now.

well advanced has something called mother earth tea. it can be used as a stand alone 1 part fert. not recomended. also there iguana juice but i dont know if you can use that with hydro i think its for co co or soilless . BUT ima nube don't listen to me.

Mr Celcius

Is there a problem with Earth Juice?

This stuff runs well in hydro but medium beds are better for organic hydro than DWC as they house the bacteria. What do you mean specifically - mineral nutes ready to go that are organic?

Organic hydro from a bottle is possible but that isn't where the work is at - you know - mixing stuff up.

The work is getting a decent system together that is compatible with organics. If you want organics without bacteria you are talking through a hole and should do a lot more reading than you pretend to have done.

Basically, if your medium in your grow is sufficient and your plumbing has no cloggable rubbish like 6mm or smaller or drippers.... Add oxygen, circulation (should give you the oxygen) some Earth Juice and plants - wahey!

You've never seen a true organic hydro run??

What on earth do you mean? EJ run = hydro organics. Where is it not organic? If it's something to do with plastic containers or....?

Otherwise, please explain what you are looking for.

BongSong said:

Mr Celcius

Is there a problem with Earth Juice?

This stuff runs well in hydro but medium beds are better for organic hydro than DWC as they house the bacteria. What do you mean specifically - mineral nutes ready to go that are organic?

Organic hydro from a bottle is possible but that isn't where the work is at - you know - mixing stuff up.

The work is getting a decent system together that is compatible with organics. If you want organics without bacteria you are talking through a hole and should do a lot more reading than you pretend to have done.

Basically, if your medium in your grow is sufficient and your plumbing has no cloggable rubbish like 6mm or smaller or drippers.... Add oxygen, circulation (should give you the oxygen) some Earth Juice and plants - wahey!

You've never seen a true organic hydro run??

What on earth do you mean? EJ run = hydro organics. Where is it not organic? If it's something to do with plastic containers or....?

Otherwise, please explain what you are looking for.

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Hmm, dunno if you sound aggressive or thats just me. If its me, just disregard that last statement.

Organic = materials that have been broken down my microbes. Yes I realize that. Does that mean it has to happen in your actual system? No, companies can process these materials and stabilize them.

I fully consider the Ej line organic, I have never seen a DWC run with Ej line. I would be infinitely gracious if you could supply me with a link. From what I have seen/read, the Ej line will bubble up massively and overflow your reservoir; you say that circulation will provide enough O2... maybe, but I think that depends on the system.

Honestly I don't know nearly as much about organic-hydro as you do. Please put this guy in his place and show me the way. I want to learn and know.

Reading back - I probably was aggressive but not intending it to be aimed at you. Pissed off that I don't/didn't get it I guess.

I can be a shit in the mornings before my meds....

I see what you mean - Say you get ammonia - and nitrobacters make nitrite - and nitrosomonas make nitrate - you want that nitrate in a bottle! You don't want the bacteria to have to do their thing in order to make the nitrate for the plants, you want someone else to let their bacteria prepare it - and put it in a bottle for you?

This makes sense but is fraught with problems for the producer and grower.

The producer of said bottled nutes would have to have a system running in order to put the bacteria to work. He would then need to evaporate the water content off the nitrate and other substances without their degrading - (we'll not go into all the bacterial processes to 'process' all the nutes here I don't think even the scientists have got that far yet), and then the producer has to make the nutes stable in an organic matter, possibly alcohol, and then you would have a product that was very costly to make and would be inferior, which we'll get to shortly.

Organics, in essence, should be cheap. It's extract of dirt and rocks and green rubbish and literally shit we put in our grows, yet industry has managed to make it very expensive.

end rant.

Why would such a product be inferior?

This is theorising now, as is the above....

Lacking the bacteria, lets say you have a bottle of 'pre-processed organic' N-P-K. This would have cost an arm and a leg but you're planning to yield plenty more than an arm and a leg - one elbow = more than an arm and a leg hehe.

What you have brought is an isolate - be it a blend of isolates or one isolate, this doesn't occur in nature. It sounds more like chemical nutes and will likely act like chemical nutes however due to the 'organic' manner in which it was processed... Many of the processes that occur with 'conventional' organic hydro nutes will not occur in your grow.

There is no need for nitrifying bacteria and others as there is no job for them, this will make a far weaker plant. Virtually nobody home to process plant wastes and expel their own.

The CO2 production will be well down.
Pythium and other root disease will occur far easier.
pH will not be buffered.
Plants will suffer from heat and humidity more.

As for Earth Juice bubbling up massively and overflowing the reservoir I can't say I've ever experienced it. A pure Earth Juice run huh - got me wondering now....

All these mad scientists can't help themselves but add 10 types of stuff in the hopes to tweak something.

A virgin EJ grow may be hard to find indeed

The full gamut of bacterial processes that enhance a grow take longer than one grow to establish. It is/was common practise to clean/bleach everything though bio-buckets began to introduce the concept of not cleaning the lava rocks (then defeated the purpose by topping with chlorinated water, which though it only kills 'some' bacteria, takes out the most delicate and valuable ones).

Perhaps the right blend of sea salts? But I think you may be looking for one magic organic bottle. You want to 'feed the plant'. As you know in organics we "feed the soil not the plant". What we are feeding is the bacteria.

Organic hydro will develop better as we grasp this fully. It's about building a processing plant but the plant builds itself we just add the raw materials. Breaking it down again every grow is counter-productive imo.

Honestly, if you want to grow organic then love the bugs, go on, love them they are your friends!

Good info. I don't want to completely cut bacteria out of the process, but I don't really want to get into the balls that hold bacteria and process the nutrients. I've seen them in fish stores before.

I may try the full EJ line in DWC. I'll probably add some different bacterial cultures to keep the ph in check and make nutrients that aren't available yet. I just have my doubts about the Ej line.

Everything I grow is organic at this point, but always want to improve things and I used to grow with synthetics with hydroponics. The growth was very vigorous, but I'd love to marry those two elements of growing.

Your medium (hydroton, lavarock, coco, what you are comfortable with - replaces the balls you saw at an aquarium store. The medium is the bio-filter/processing factory, the nutes and light the input and the plants the output.

Adding bacterial diversity is a good thing, fungi too if you have access to it.

Ebb and Flow seems the easiest system to run organics in. Good aeration, good nutrient circulation, lots of buffering happens making it more forgiving than some other systems.

DWC is faster, but more pernickity!

Ya, Ebb n' flow just seems like the lazy gardeners way of watering. I would just stick to pots and hand watering. I don't really see it as true hydroponics.

NFT, DWC, aero & deep flow are the only methods I see as being true hydroponics. I find that Nature's Nectar added with Ej's micros would probably work in a true hydro system.

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www.organaponics.com

DR PONIX said:

www.organaponics.com

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Yup, thats the website. My only curiosity is their feeding recommendations (amounts).

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Hey man i no these guys personally and that feeding chart proved best in hydro but there tests are on tamatoes LOL i wouldnt use there chart. and it dosent mix well with hydrotron for some reason i have just been playin with it in soil....

DR PONIX said:

Hey man i no these guys personally and that feeding chart proved best in hydro but there tests are on tamatoes LOL i wouldnt use there chart. and it dosent mix well with hydrotron for some reason i have just been playin with it in soil....

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So, are you saying no go on the hydro applications with this stuff? If so, why?

hey man

hey man

i'll ask them why... its just not compatable with hydrotron, don't ask me why but i'll find out for u..... i saw a friends rockwool top fed grow using this stuff and it worked out great!! quality was really good and he didint use the ratios they reccomended if u have more ?'s pm me and ill do what i can to get them awnsered for ya!!

PBP = Close enough. Quit pbp hating.

for you Mr Celsius


this is a link to some info i think you will find very interesting
(and theyre OMRI yay!!.......i know you like that)

http://metanaturals.com/information.php


Gato rooski