Weed and driving

I woke up this morning to find another of "the most popular" headlines on USA Today website about weed and driving. I should have known from the get go it would have a negative spin, it had the word "pot" in the title. Everyone knows driving under the influence of any mind altering substance is bad, but that article just sucked.

Now I had a career with a scientific background (weather forecasting) and had to take a lot of science and statistical math in school. I think I can say with some authority MOST of the science written about these days is very biased with causation totally ignored. There is always some sort of bias and looking to support conclusions going in rather than the true scientific method which is an unbiased analysis of data. The only real thing I saw was, when they said:
"However, one expert cautioned against inferring too much from this study, which was not designed to capture cause and effect.
"We can't really say yet that marijuana increases the risk by two or three times," said Chuck Farmer, director of statistics at the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety in Arlington, Va. "Most of their studies pointed to a very strong bad effect of marijuana on driving, but there are other studies out there that actually go the other way."

They made references to the growing MMJ movement. What a HUGE leap. Definitely biased and designed to support a negative spin. I have grown to just despise most main stream media. They're the just the voice of the power elite and seek to control minds more and more.

there is a guy in ottawa, canada, a real stand up looking guy from what I remember

he was caught driving high and he contested it

I never found out what happened but he got all his professional friends to chime in and stuff

I agree that sometimes being high (or stressed out) can cause your attention to be less focused

and at the same time, (maybe some strains in particular ?) sometimes weed will cause you to be super focused

I know I drive much slower when i'm high

The new driving while stoned, irish ad

http://vimeo.com/30327554



i read somewhere that it was recommend to wait an hour after smoking before driving, do clubs or any of the various canna organization in med states have recommendations for best practice, or is it a gray area ?

lol @ 1 hour. just dont drive when your high. once your sober its cool again, but i doubt one hour is enough. in germany there was a study which claimed a person needs ~4 hours to have normal reactions.

I for one get high while driving. I got me a neat travel sized oil rig.
Great way to medicate

We are all different and you shouldn't drive period if you are impaired. The alcohol crowd is slowly getting it but they still kill thousands every year.

We are smarter then that aren't we.

Once a person is used to being high it has no effect whatsoever. Just wait till you get your wings and everything will be alright.

How the hell can you sext in the car if you're high?

My squinty eyes make if hard to see the buttons...and auto-correct just makes it worse

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700188349/Pot-use-may-nearly-triple-crash-risk.html


Pot use may nearly triple crash risk

Drivers who have been smoking marijuana are more than twice as likely as other drivers to crash their vehicles, according to research published this month in Epidemiologic Reviews. And if they've been drinking alcohol, as well, the risk climbs higher.

That might have implications in states that allow medical use of marijuana, said study senior author Dr. Guohua Li, a professor of epidemiology at Columbia University Mailman School of Public Health in New York City.



Click to enlarge

Associated Press

In this photo taken May 13, 2009 marijuana grown for medical purposes is shown inside a greenhouse at a farm in Potter Valley, Calif.

The study notes that 16 states and the District of Columbia have passed laws to decriminalize marijuana for medical use. "Although marijuana is the most commonly detected nonalcohol drug in drivers, its role in crash causation remains unsettled," they wrote.

The researchers looked at nine earlier studies published in English in six countries that focused on marijuana use in motor vehicle crashes. All but one of them showed increased risk of crashes when the driver used marijuana. That one, from Thailand, was small, they said.

One of the studies said driving skills suffer for three or four hours after marijuana use.

Using a "random effects model," the researchers calculated the overall odds of a crash at 2.66 times higher than for those who were not using marijuana.

They said the heightened risk of crash involvement associated with using pot persisted after they adjusted for confounding variables and it increased based on the amount of marijuana used and the frequency.

"This meta-analysis suggests that marijuana use by drivers is associated with a significantly increased risk of being involved in motor vehicle crashes," the researchers wrote.

An article in USA Today on the research noted that "a large U.S. survey in 2009 estimated that more than 10 million people aged 12 and over had driven while under the influence of illicit drugs in the previous year. And testing has revealed that 28 percent of drivers who die from a crash and more than 11 percent of drivers in general test positive for drugs other than alcohol. Marijuana is the most commonly detected drug in drivers after alcohol."

It could be a problem among the young, as well. A study published earlier this year in the Journal of Addiction Medicine found that 4 in 10 high school students have tried marijuana and more than 30 percent have used it in the past year.

Among the problems associated with heavier marijuana use cited in that research were poorer sleep, breathing issues, learning, memory and attention deficits, poor school performance and a higher likelihood of dropping out.

With the new research, experts told USA Today that marijuana may increase the risk of crashes because it could interfere with reaction times and coordination, among other things.

Authors of the new study said research must look at the crash risk and whether it changes with different doses, strengths and methods of using pot. And they pointed out that none of the studies they examined looked specifically at medical marijuana.

USA Today said one expert "cautioned against inferring too much from this study, which was not designed to capture cause and effect."

http://www.bmj.com/content/331/7528.press-release.html

(1) CANNABIS ALMOST DOUBLES RISK OF FATAL CRASHES

Online First
(Cannabis intoxication and fatal road crashes in France: population based case-control study)
http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/rapidpdf/bmj.38648.617986.1F

Driving under the influence of cannabis almost doubles the risk of a fatal road crash, finds a study published online by the BMJ today. However its share in fatal crashes is significantly lower than those involving alcohol.

The study took place in France and involved 10,748 drivers who were involved in fatal crashes from October 2001 to September 2003. All drivers underwent compulsory tests for drugs and alcohol.

A total of 681 drivers tested positive for cannabis (7%) and 2096 for alcohol (21.4%), including 285 for both (2.9%). Men were more often involved in crashes than women, and were also more often positive for both cannabis and alcohol, as were the youngest drivers, and users of mopeds and motorcycles.

The risk of being responsible for a fatal crash increased as the blood concentration of cannabis increased (known as a dose effect). The odds increased from 1.9 at a concentration of 0-1 ng/ml to 3.1 at or above 5 ng/ml. These effects were adjusted for alcohol and remained significant when also adjusted for other factors.

These results give credence to a causal relationship between cannabis and crashes, say the authors.

Samples show that the prevalence of cannabis (2.9%) within the driving population is similar to that for alcohol (2.7%) at or above 0.5 g/l, they add. However, in France, its share in fatal crashes is significantly lower than that associated with alcohol (2.5% compared with 29% for alcohol).

Interesting debate, clearly everyone is different though. I drive baked all the time and have never had an issue or anything close to it. As many will say, I pay more attention, don't use my phone unless stopped, etc.
I thought the Speed Channel? did an actual test of this, believe they used a baked driver who determined that being high did not adversely his reaction time etc. (typed this out before finding the video)
Another good point they bring up is that since weed stays in your system for so long there is no real PROVEN correlation between crashes and drivers testing positive for weed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IA7_ajF741I

Yes.

Reposts are always interesting,great for bandwidth too

Before i started toking, i was involved in 3 accidents with one totaling the vehicle. Couple speeding tickets.

After i started toking, no accidents, no tickets.

If u see me behind the wheel, there is a 99.99% chance i just toked up

Is being around cats as deleterious to your driving as being stoned?


http://blogs.howstuffworks.com/2010...-with-toxoplasmosis-be-allowed-to-drive-cars/

"Drivers with toxoplasmosis were more than twice as likely to be involved in a car accident than those who were parasite-free."


http://drugdiscoveryopinion.com/2009/06/toxoplasmosis-linked-to-traffic-accidents/

Toxoplasmosis Linked to Traffic Accidents
Posted by SR in News, tags: neurology

Toxoplasmosis is a parasitic disease caused by infection with the protozoan, Toxoplasma gondii, whose primary hosts are members of the cat family. Infection of humans usually results from consumption of contaminated water, unwashed vegetables or undercooked meat, or from contact with cat faeces. The incidence of human infection varies widely in different countries and, in both acute and latent infections, symptoms are typically mild and often go unnoticed. The latent phase in humans has, however, been associated with behavioural changes and neurological disorders, including increased reaction times. Recent studies have suggested a protective effect of the rhesus factor (RhD antigen) against the negative effects of latent T. gondii infection on reaction times, especially in heterozygous individuals. Uninfected RhD negative men have faster reaction times than uninfected RhD positive men, but heterozygous men with both positive and negative alleles are protected from prolongation of reaction times caused by T. gondii infection.

A study published in the journal BMC Infectious Diseases now suggests that drivers who are rhesus factor (RhD antigen) negative and infected with T. gondii are more likely to be involved in road traffic accidents. Although this is not the first time that an association between toxoplasmosis and driving impairment has been suggested, it is the first prospective study to examine the link, and to consider the effect of RhD phenotype. Almost 4000 Czech male military drivers were tested for T. gondii infection and RhD phenotype at the beginning of a 12-18 months period of compulsory military service. The men were not told whether they were infected or not and were also not told that the incidence of traffic accidents would be monitored. By correlating infection data and RhD phenotype with subsequent traffic accidents reports from military police records, the authors confirmed an increased risk of accidents in infected men, and also demonstrated a protective effect of being RhD positive against this risk. When corrected for factors such as the age of the driver and date of military service, the probability of a traffic accident was found to be higher for RhD negative drivers with high titres of antibodies against T. gondii than for uninfected drivers or for drivers who were RhD positive. Whilst recognising the absence of genotypic data as a limitation of the present study – earlier studies had shown that protection against the deleterious effects of T. gondii infection is largely restricted to heterozygotes – the authors suggest that RhD negative individuals with occupations that need fast reaction times, such as pilots and air traffic controllers, should be regularly tested for infection with T. gondii.


http://www.edge.org/3rd_culture/sapolsky09/sapolsky09_index.html

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]"I just remembered back when I was a resident, I was doing a surgical transplant rotation. And there was an older surgeon, who said, if you ever get organs from a motorcycle accident death, check the organs for Toxo."[/FONT]

Journalist almost always, without fail, butcher scientific papers/findings. It's just the way it is.

You have to take what you read in USA today or whatever with a grain of salt. A perfect example of this butchering is whenever journalists say that so and so people have the "gene" for obesity/alcoholism/whatever. Everyone has that gene. The affected people have the "allele" that predisposes them to obesity/alcoholism/etc. Two completely different things, and in terms of genetics you'd have to be an idiot to mix them up.

On the issue of driving baked... to play devil's advocate... when you're driving drunk (I'm sure all of us have driven when we've had 1 too many and in hindsight know we probably shouldn't have driven) you feel invincible. You feel you can take that curve at 60mph and pull through. You feel fine. So to say that "I drive fine when I'm high" kind of carries no weight. You can't be an accurate judge of your own self.

Drive high, drive sober, drive stressed. Whatever you feel comfortable doing. Just don't put other people's lives in danger.

Crusader Rabbit said:

http://www.bmj.com/content/331/7528.press-release.html

(1) CANNABIS ALMOST DOUBLES RISK OF FATAL CRASHES...
...These results give credence to a causal relationship between cannabis and crashes, say the authors.

Samples show that the prevalence of cannabis (2.9%) within the driving population is similar to that for alcohol (2.7%) at or above 0.5 g/l, they add. However, in France, its share in fatal crashes is significantly lower than that associated with alcohol (2.5% compared with 29% for alcohol).

Click to expand...

so usage of cannabis and alcohol are closely correlated except for the results of the study?

what type of chicanery is this?...

it appears that alcohol is at least 26% more responsible for fatal traffic accidents than cannabis.

$0.02

driving high makes you drive slower and more cautiously.

they should do a side by side ........ the stoner driver vs. the xanex popper who needs two ambians a night to sleep. i bet cell phones cause as many accidents as weed

greenmatter said:

they should do a side by side ........ the stoner driver vs. the xanex popper who needs two ambians a night to sleep. i bet cell phones cause as many accidents as weed

Click to expand...

so what ? even if youre right that doesnt make smoking & driving any better. because everybody fucks up driving responsibly its not right for you (all the stoners...) to do so. lose someone close to a traffic accident and you understand me.

cars are weapons so if your not 100% clear dont use it.

I don't remember the last time I drove completely sober going on 17 years now. I'm sure there were a few times in there somewhere. No accidents but a few speeding tickets. I don't advocate driving high but I do it all the time. On the other hand I know a couple of people who have a hard enough time walking while high let alone driving. So, your mileage may vary.