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How long does Spinosad stay in plants?
- Thread starter KONY
- Start date
HazyBulldog
Member
I sprayed late July, before any flower clusters, and failed my concentrates.
So a long time, at least three months from what SC labs tested.
So a long time, at least three months from what SC labs tested.
That is fascinating the sun couldn't break it down in that amount of time. Did you only apply it one time, or multiple times? Any chance you submitted a control group that wasn't sprayed? You didnt happen to spray indoor plants near where the outdoor was drying did you?
Reason I ask is we submitted a concentrate test for organic solvents last year, trying to dial in our purging tek. However the samples all failed for acetone, which we dont and have never used, however is commonly used to clean lab equipment.
In short i'm 200% positive there was no acetone in our Shatter (when we dropped it off at the lab), however it failed for it.
One problem with these labs are they are not regulated in any meaningful way. But that is a rant for another day.
If spinosad is not corrupted or combined with something else and used correctly, the only residual would be endospores which would/should effect only insects which ingest them.
Bulldog; What is SC labs? What protocol did they use to test for spinosad? What format did they use to report their findings?
What does "failed my concentrates mean"?
For what it is worth, anecdotally, I have observed troubles establishing some predatory mites 3 weeks after using spinosad.
Has spinosad been deemed a harmful substance related to cannabis?
Bulldog; What is SC labs? What protocol did they use to test for spinosad? What format did they use to report their findings?
What does "failed my concentrates mean"?
For what it is worth, anecdotally, I have observed troubles establishing some predatory mites 3 weeks after using spinosad.
Has spinosad been deemed a harmful substance related to cannabis?
I certainly agree about the labs. Only use accredited labs for anything ever.
here is a sample picture of what SC labs normally test for (bottom left for pesticides/fungicides/pgr):
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C6XwL77VMAIZbRV.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C6XwL77VMAIZbRV.jpg
Thanks; I looked them up and from their statement, they could be accredited. I'm not 100% sure on the residuals which could be in spinosad but it seems that it should be included in the microbiological test results section.
It is good to see that they use liquid and gas chromatography.
MrBungle
Active member
" Spinosad is broken down rapidly by sunlight. In the presence of sunlight, half-lives on leaves are 2 to 16 days and less than one day in water. When applied to leaves, some spinosad can be absorbed. However, it does not readily spread from leaves to the rest of the plant. In the absence of sunlight, spinosad breaks down very slowly in water. Half-lives of more than 30 days to 259 days have been reported. However, it binds rapidly to sediment. The halflife in sediment, where no oxygen is available, ranges from 161 to 250 days.
Spinosad also sticks to soil and has a very low potential to move through soil towards ground water. In field studies, no break down products of spinosad were found below a soil depth of two feet. In the top layers of soil, spinosad is rapidly broken down by microbes. Soil half-lives of 9 to 17 days have been reported. After it is applied, spinosad is not likely to become airborne."
Spinosad also sticks to soil and has a very low potential to move through soil towards ground water. In field studies, no break down products of spinosad were found below a soil depth of two feet. In the top layers of soil, spinosad is rapidly broken down by microbes. Soil half-lives of 9 to 17 days have been reported. After it is applied, spinosad is not likely to become airborne."
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It looks as though I am wrong about the activity of spinosad being restricted to endospores like Bt is.
There is an option right in the post reply to add a quote, just put the quote you want in between the ]quote[ thingies. Makes it look all official. Or highlight the text and click the quote button.....
I have heard of people spraying spinosad in september and passing the tests, now i've heard of other people spraying in July and failing...
I am wondering if these people that are testing positive for this when only using it in veg, are using so much that is is leaking down into the soil, below the area where the microbes can process it? Seems one logical conclusion, unless they are actually applying later than they state or they are using it as a root drench and don't have much or any biological activity in their medium?
HazyBulldog
Member
Guys, spinosad is systemic. It sticks around. Doesn't matter about sun light breaking it down when it's inside the cell walls.
SClabs is very inconstant. I don't trust the labs at all, and yet the future of the industry in Cali depends on it. Soon, you fail a test and they will burn your crop......Lot to leave up to a seemingly error ridden laboratory.
I make SC labs retest every single test if it fails....... If in your case the acetone that you never used, you better believe I retest that. SC labs doesn't really like working with me, cause out of the 100 or so samples I have sent in, I have made them retest around 50. Mostly for fun. Sometimes cause I fail something I know I shouldn't. Part of the service they provide.
Then there was the shit show at the Emerald Cup. One of the biggest failures of a large event like that in history. No violence, no construction failures, but the pot heads running the show should have put the bongs down.....
SClabs is very inconstant. I don't trust the labs at all, and yet the future of the industry in Cali depends on it. Soon, you fail a test and they will burn your crop......Lot to leave up to a seemingly error ridden laboratory.
I make SC labs retest every single test if it fails....... If in your case the acetone that you never used, you better believe I retest that. SC labs doesn't really like working with me, cause out of the 100 or so samples I have sent in, I have made them retest around 50. Mostly for fun. Sometimes cause I fail something I know I shouldn't. Part of the service they provide.
Then there was the shit show at the Emerald Cup. One of the biggest failures of a large event like that in history. No violence, no construction failures, but the pot heads running the show should have put the bongs down.....
Cadfael
Active member
Certain labs can assay down to 1 ppb (part per billion), and people want to disqualify any detectable amount.
However, there are acceptable limits from the EPA for pesticide amounts on food and for tobacco. (after pulling numbers from a US GAO report on levels in tobacco...)
Sum of cypermethrin and permethrin; Residue limit (parts per million): 3.0; Approved for nontobacco use(s): Yes.
or 3000 PPB
So, yes, there is a wide range from "detectable" to "acceptable maximum" and labs have been carving a market niche for the in between. They want all product tested (more profit to them) anything tossed out if detected (which would never be done on a food or tobacco) and no method where the labs are tested for accuracy.
Anecdotal evidence was done by one dispensary in a legal state that requires all cannabis be shown with lab tested amounts of THC. After being sent to 17 labs, they received 17 different results. varying from 16% thc to 24% thc. By that state law, they have to use the first result given back, which might be completely inaccurate.
The emerald stated they had over 25% of all concentrates come up detectable for Mycobutizol (PM pesticide), with the about the same percentage of flowers coming up detectable for pesticides. A majority of the the growers stating that they didn't even use pesticides on their crop.
So, did all growers collude with the story that they didn't use anything. OR did all the growers get cuts that had been dipped in Spinosad from clone phase and there was that residual left behind from Many more weeks than we believe. OR did a growers neighbor spray and some residual came over the fence.
Too many variables to tell at present. I would agree that in Cannabis vs tobacco, we are a much more cleaner product.
However, there are acceptable limits from the EPA for pesticide amounts on food and for tobacco. (after pulling numbers from a US GAO report on levels in tobacco...)
Sum of cypermethrin and permethrin; Residue limit (parts per million): 3.0; Approved for nontobacco use(s): Yes.
or 3000 PPB
So, yes, there is a wide range from "detectable" to "acceptable maximum" and labs have been carving a market niche for the in between. They want all product tested (more profit to them) anything tossed out if detected (which would never be done on a food or tobacco) and no method where the labs are tested for accuracy.
Anecdotal evidence was done by one dispensary in a legal state that requires all cannabis be shown with lab tested amounts of THC. After being sent to 17 labs, they received 17 different results. varying from 16% thc to 24% thc. By that state law, they have to use the first result given back, which might be completely inaccurate.
The emerald stated they had over 25% of all concentrates come up detectable for Mycobutizol (PM pesticide), with the about the same percentage of flowers coming up detectable for pesticides. A majority of the the growers stating that they didn't even use pesticides on their crop.
So, did all growers collude with the story that they didn't use anything. OR did all the growers get cuts that had been dipped in Spinosad from clone phase and there was that residual left behind from Many more weeks than we believe. OR did a growers neighbor spray and some residual came over the fence.
Too many variables to tell at present. I would agree that in Cannabis vs tobacco, we are a much more cleaner product.
This lab looks like the real deal; Anresco Laboratories
http://anresco.com/cannabis/
The do not only test cannabis, are accredited and test a very broad spectrum.
http://anresco.com/cannabis/
The do not only test cannabis, are accredited and test a very broad spectrum.
HazyBulldog
Member
I called and asked if they do tissue/leaf samples. They said no.........
Are you looking for leaf tissue nutrient profile?
Just because something is safe to eat doesn't mean it's safe to smoke.
Hard to follow the thread so I dunno if this is what you are referring to, but I heard the reason spinosad is on the do-not-use list is because it damages(kills?) bees, I think it's supposed to be harmless for humans?
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