Fresh Frozen... Lets Chat :)

live resin said:

I think buds should not be frozen in contact with ambient atmosphere. GW recommended packing the tube before freezing so less air contacts the buds, but I think no air is better.

I've had success doing cyro temp live resin soak extractions in a homemade glove box thats been purged and filled with co2 before freezing the buds with dry ice/IPA. No air contacts the buds and forms ice, the water in the buds remains ice, and no ice builds up on the outside of the extraction container. You could also use a Schlenk line for the same purpose.

Distill and dry your butane, use thermometers to make sure temps at -40C. I never use any heat so the fresh frozen is always wax instead shatter due to all the terps. Its not light yellow like PHO, but definitely not dark either

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CLSn00b said:

Should I be packing the tube with material straight from the freezer and putting it back in the freezer with caps on for a time? Or straight connect it to the system and fill the cryo sleeve with di/ipa and letting it chill before filling it with solvent?
Really appreciate all the input thus far.

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live resin said:

I think buds should not be frozen in contact with ambient atmosphere. GW recommended packing the tube before freezing so less air contacts the buds, but I think no air is better.

I've had success doing cyro temp live resin soak extractions in a homemade glove box thats been purged and filled with co2 before freezing the buds with dry ice/IPA. No air contacts the buds and forms ice, the water in the buds remains ice, and no ice builds up on the outside of the extraction container. You could also use a Schlenk line for the same purpose.

Distill and dry your butane, use thermometers to make sure temps at -40C. I never use any heat so the fresh frozen is always wax instead shatter due to all the terps. Its not light yellow like PHO, but definitely not dark either

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live resin said:

GH is this 10-11% off trim or nugs? It might take 2-3 soaks depending on the length but I think 15-20% yield is pretty attainable.

Given equal quality buds yield should be comparable to winterized room temp runs.

If you're only getting 10-11% do you repurpose the leftover material somehow or extract it again with another solvent?

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gholladay said:

CLSn00b,

To reword what live resin is saying, when you freeze the bud and then transfer it to the columns later (like you're doing), moisture from the air will condense on the outside of the cold buds when it is exposed to atmosphere. To prevent this, pack the column with room temp buds, seal it, and then freeze it. This will help with your moisture problem and probably help with you color. Also make sure your tane is nice and cold when injecting as well.

RulaTone,

Yields are generally pretty low on these type of runs. In my experience, 10-11% is pretty typical. Could be more or less, but there are so many variable in that equation (number of trichome heads present, temp of tane, temp bud, soak time, etc.)

GH

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CLSn00b said:

Thanks for the reply, I'm not prefreezing dried cured material, I'm keeping fresh material frozen not dried cured material. I have always had success with fresh frozen material by keeping it vac sealed and frozen in the chest freezer then transferring it to a SS thermos for soaking. I assumed this was the same concept. It's coming out a greenish brown vs a deep amber so I'm pretty sure I'm pulling chlorophyll. Is there a way to run this and get good results without cryo Temps? I only have viton gaskets atm and am cautious as hell. Am I to take what you said as packing the columns straight away then freeze? That's going to be a challenge seeing as the farm and I are 40 minutes apart. I can't see that being the answer.

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gholladay said:

CLSN,

Packing the buds straight from the plant into the columns and then freezing them would be ideal, but everyone has to make the best of their own situation. The amount of moisture that will condense on the buds also really depends on your relative humidity, air temp, and the exposure time of the bud. This might not be your issue, but I'd be willing to bet your issue is related to water content. Water in the tane will pick up more undesirables (aka chlorophyll and other polar molecules that darken the color).The ways to prevent this are by keeping the extra water from condensing on the bud during transfer, making sure your tane doesn't have water in it (if it's coming from a tank instead of a can), making sure the tane is cold and the bud is frozen, limiting soak time, and limiting the heat exposure to the oil/tane mixture during finishing processes.

If you do all those things correctly you should get blonde oil. It's already been mentioned, but tri-chome color plays a big factor into the color of your finished product as well. I would inspect the buds with a hand microscope to see the color of the trichomes. If they are already a dark amber color, the oil will keep that color (this will vary with strain type, process, crop time, etc). There are so many variables in this equation that it is hard to answer these types of questions without seeing every step of the process specifically.

Hope this helps!

GH

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CLSn00b said:

I will have to try freezing the butane, ice bath won't get it cold enough I assume, and the thought of putting a 30LB. tank in a chest freezer is a scary thought. I suppose a DI/IPA slurry is the best to achieve the desired temps? I've seen discussions about using 50' coils submersed in a slurry to drop the tane temp without needing to keep the tank itself in a bath, I guess that works as well? How would I make sure my tane has no water in it besides a filter drier?
Thanks again for all your input, I really appreciate it.

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live resin said:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cooling_bath

Ice and salt will get you to -20C, still I'd go with di/ipa.

Drying butane, your options are molecular sieve or chemical drying agent (calcium chloride, sulfuric acid, the list goes on...)

If bubbling thru sulfuric acid makes sure you've removed any iso-butane as it will react

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GarrettGreens said:

Help me out if I'm lost somewhere but, anything under 30 degrees on my recovery tank n butane has an extremely hard time pushing through my system, will most the time come to a halt if goes under zero and starts recovering more than its pushing through and I start going backwards anyone care to chime in? Would love to have butane colder than 30-40 degrees push through. I'm still producing about 15% off 4 month old trim colors vary.

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Gray Wolf said:

We use a counter flow heat exchanger at the butane injector, instead of super chilling the tank.-- thats a an mt coil, right? Do you super chill with co2 or just h2o ice?

You can also keep a second butane tank at higher temperature, and valve its vapor side to the vapor side of the cold tank, so as to provide more push pressure.

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kimc_ext said:

what temp would you ideally start with to run through material?

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Gray Wolf said:

I cut mine using scissors, and pack it immediately for freezing.

I formerly froze them in a bag, and then pummeled the bag to break them up easily frozen, before packing, but we have a lot of humidity here, and ice forms on the frozen trichomes during transfer.

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Abbazabba710 said:

How tightly should the column be packed?

Just toss buds in there?

Lightly tamp?

Or pack hard?

Thank you for your infinite wisdom GW

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Gray Wolf said:

Depends on the material.

Material reduced to <10/15% water content and reduced to 10 mesh packs at around 4.1 gm/cu in and prime bud broken into 1/2" chunks packs at around 3.8 gr/cu in.

I ram about every foot of column and push firmly on the ram but don't pound. I lean on it and when it glides to a firm stop, I call it good.

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