American landrace?

agent_nugjar · Jan 15, 2013

I think thats technically what this would be . I got 3 seeds from a friend who grows in denver. it is a killer chemdawg crossed with wild weed that grows in Ohio (I think), that is called fruitpunch I guess for obvious reasons. So if it grew wild then its American landrace, yes?

FuhQ · Jan 15, 2013

American landrace is called ditch weed, it grows wild in like Indiana, Kansas and Nebraska and Im sure other places.

red rider · Jan 15, 2013

No offense but I'm pretty sure a non Mexican wild North American landrace would be hemp. If you grew out the cross it would not be a landrace but if you grew out the pure "fruit punch" then it would be landrace. Interesting non the less.

Peace

agent_nugjar · Jan 15, 2013

Yea no offense taken at all haha.....I felt like it was a stupid question cuz who would want ditch weed...however someone has done this, and I know its from a breeder that won a cup in the last two years with a different new strain, from a company that never actually sold any of the beans haha. Mixing this ditch weed with some chemdawg must have been just some experiment or something

But anyway, I put a few pics of it in a new album in my profile. The flower pic is from my friend who gave me the seeds

trichrider · Jan 15, 2013

http://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/ncnu02/v5-284.html

Probably indigenous to temperate Asia, C. sativa is the most widely cited example of a “camp follower.” It was pre-adapted to thrive in the manured soils around man’s early settlements, which quickly led to its domestication (Schultes 1970). Hemp was harvested by the Chinese 8500 years ago (Schultes and Hofmann 1980). For most of its history, C. sativa was most valued as a fiber source, considerably less so as an intoxicant, and only to a limited extent as an oilseed crop. Hemp is one of the oldest sources of textile fiber, with extant remains of hempen cloth trailing back 6 millennia. Hemp grown for fiber was introduced to western Asia and Egypt, and subsequently to Europe somewhere between 1000 and 2000 BCE. Cultivation in Europe became widespread after 500 ce. The crop was first brought to South America in 1545, in Chile, and to North America in Port Royal, Acadia in 1606. The hemp industry flourished in Kentucky, Missouri, and Illinois between 1840 and 1860 because of the strong demand for sailcloth and cordage (Ehrensing 1998). From the end of the Civil War until 1912, virtually all hemp in the US was produced in Kentucky. During World War I, some hemp cultivation occurred in several states, including Kentucky, Wisconsin, California, North Dakota, South Dakota, Minnesota, Indiana, Illinois, Ohio, Michigan, Kansas, and Iowa (Ehrensing 1998). The second world war led to a brief revival of hemp cultivation in the Midwest, as well as in Canada, because the war cut off supplies of fiber (substantial renewed cultivation also occurred in Germany for the same reason). Until the beginning of the 19th century, hemp was the leading cordage fiber. Until the middle of the 19th century, hemp rivaled flax as the chief textile fiber of vegetable origin, and indeed was described as “the king of fiber-bearing plants,—the standard by which all other fibers are measured” (Boyce 1900). Nevertheless, the Marihuana Tax Act applied in 1938 essentially ended hemp production in the United States, although a small hemp fiber industry continued in Wisconsin until 1958. Similarly in 1938 the cultivation of Cannabis became illegal in Canada under the Opium and Narcotics Act.

no indigenous cannabis or hemp ever came out of ohio, so no.

komboloi · Jan 15, 2013

I harvested a couple units of OD Iowa "landrace" in 1976. It wouldn't get you high to save your life. Sure looked good though. It was growing on a turkey farm, and all the turkeys had "lollipopped" the plants as high as they could reach. They looked like happy turkeys.

red rider · Jan 16, 2013

Turkey

Turkey

komboloi said:
I harvested a couple units of OD Iowa "landrace" in 1976. It wouldn't get you high to save your life. Sure looked good though. It was growing on a turkey farm, and all the turkeys had "lollipopped" the plants as high as they could reach. They looked like happy turkeys.

I think it's a well established fact that turkeys are light wieghts and get a buzz even off hemp lol

Peace

komboloi · Jan 16, 2013

One day I might be stupid like a turkey, and I too will enjoy that fine Iowanna or another North American landrace. I just hope I don't drown by looking up when it rains.

Greenheart · Jan 16, 2013

Perhaps it is an attempt to recapture lost cannabinoids.

Kcar · Jan 16, 2013

Might be a 'landrace' in the Hawaiian islands by now...

red rider · Jan 16, 2013

All joking aside really the plant doesn't have to be a "drug" strain to qualify as a landrace. If its been growing in north America since 1606 that seems to me it could be called a landrace. I know that stuff to when I was in N. Dakota, my friend took me out to a huge field of it beside the road. I was in heaven, man the plants were giant, brisiling with fat seeded buds. I filled garbage bags with the ripe colas took it home and carefully dried it. Dollar signs in my eyes I bagged it up and then I smoked it.....I did everything with it and nothing (of course). Ended up throwing it out after giving away some to some soon to be ex friends.
I'm almost sure there are no Hawaiian island landrace.

Peace from Colombia!

komboloi · Jan 19, 2013

Kcar said:
Might be a 'landrace' in the Hawaiian islands by now...

As in other parts of the world, I think any Hawaiian landraces are being slowly hybridized away.

But is cannabis native to Hawaii? Or was it transported there? If the latter, when?

thatonedude · Jun 20, 2014

so if someone grew out a large room for seed and planted the seed, im talking 20 lbs+ of seed. in a remote area of the usa and just let it reproduce naturally and reseed itself. how long would that line have to be around before it was considered a landrace?

I think someone or several people should do this. with landraces from other parts of the world that are suitable for their geographic region. then maybe some really killer hybrids could be made in the future from collecting seeds from wild seeds from around the usa

komboloi · Jun 20, 2014

One thing we DON'T want is lots of mystery pollen flying around and seeding our grows.

That's one thing the antis don't get when they oppose industrial hemp production. All those plants with no THC genetics pumping out clouds of pollen would ruin many outdoor grows, and some indoor ones too. The antis should LOVE the idea of industrial hemp and require that males be allowed to mature.

And if the cops really wanted to fuck up the outdoor grows, they'd just get a bunch of hemp pollen and spray it like a cloud all over any areas likely to have MJ operations.

So, no. We do not want uncontrolled pollen released into the environment.

oldchuck · Jun 20, 2014

thatonedude said:
so if someone grew out a large room for seed and planted the seed, im talking 20 lbs+ of seed. in a remote area of the usa and just let it reproduce naturally and reseed itself. how long would that line have to be around before it was considered a landrace?

No it would not. It would become a feral type, that is a variety once cultivated and then left to it's own development. A landrace is an indigenous cultivar, a local variety grown year after year for agricultural use, open pollinated and only lightly selected. How many generations are needed to qualify as a landrace is a matter of opinion.

oldchuck · Jun 20, 2014

komboloi said:
One thing we DON'T want is lots of mystery pollen flying around and seeding our grows.

...

So, no. We do not want uncontrolled pollen released into the environment.

Farmers deal with pollination issues every day. Drug weed farmers need to learn to do it too.

Hemp will be the major crop in terms of acres planted. It won't take many acres of drug weed to fill the recreational and medical demand.

I'm running a little experiment this summer to explore just how difficult an issue controlling hemp pollen really is.

SBGoldendome · Jul 7, 2014

Sorry I know this is a couple weeks old but had a question. Would it be possible to turn feral hemp into something useful.
Say smeone found one of these wild plots, watched it, removed all males and then took pollen from good strains and pollenated the hemp what are the chances the next generation would produce anything remotely useful?
I understand it wouldn't be nearly as good(strong) as most modern strains but would it produce something weak but smokable or would it take several generations of killing the males and only pollinating with known drug strains to finally get something with 5% THC?

Only Ornamental · Jul 8, 2014

It's rather simple:
A: Hemp is homozygous for CBDA synthase (BD/BD) whereas drug type cannabis is homozygous for THCA synthase (BT/BT).
B: Hemp produces a lesser amount of cannabionoids than drug varieties. This is at least in part inherited by the females (cytosolic factor or non-nuclear DNA).
You will have a hard time getting 'feral' drug cannabis with your approach. It would be easier to find a plot with no hemp at all and plant different drug type varieties (which are to some degree suitable for the local climate) and then just wait until nature does the trick. Or simply stick to gorilla growing

.

Jhhnn · Jul 8, 2014

oldchuck said:
No it would not. It would become a feral type, that is a variety once cultivated and then left to it's own development. A landrace is an indigenous cultivar, a local variety grown year after year for agricultural use, open pollinated and only lightly selected. How many generations are needed to qualify as a landrace is a matter of opinion.

I think you're right. Specimens within a population will self select on the basis of their adaptability to local conditions.

I suspect that grower selection may be stronger than you surmise- they can readily recognize individual females having more of the qualities they want from the general population, use that seed. As you say, open pollination tends to limit the results, but they're still real over longer time frames.

I seriously doubt that ancient wild cannabis had anywhere near the potency of landrace cultivars developed over thousands of years. The tool that farmers had to bring that out was selection.

I also suspect that cannabis & cannabis seeds have been items of trade for a very long time, leading to some hybridization among landrace cultivars. When ancient travelers & traders encountered varieties better than those from their native lands they would quite naturally take seeds home with them and native farmers would grow them along with their usual stock. The resulting diversity lends itself strongly to the process of selection.

oldchuck · Jul 8, 2014

Jhhnn said:
I think you're right. Specimens within a population will self select on the basis of their adaptability to local conditions.

I suspect that grower selection may be stronger than you surmise- they can readily recognize individual females having more of the qualities they want from the general population, use that seed. As you say, open pollination tends to limit the results, but they're still real over longer time frames.

I seriously doubt that ancient wild cannabis had anywhere near the potency of landrace cultivars developed over thousands of years. The tool that farmers had to bring that out was selection.

I also suspect that cannabis & cannabis seeds have been items of trade for a very long time, leading to some hybridization among landrace cultivars. When ancient travelers & traders encountered varieties better than those from their native lands they would quite naturally take seeds home with them and native farmers would grow them along with their usual stock. The resulting diversity lends itself strongly to the process of selection.

I agree with you...mostly. I did say lightly selected. Let's put it into perspective.

Since the 1970s there has been an escalating frenzy of Cannabis breeding. The global gene pool is being stirred up at a fantastic pace. Out of all the new mixing, especially in Europe and the US, only a very few products can be called heirloom varieties, probably almost heirloom is more accurate. There are no new landraces that I know of.

For example, I am growing a few Skunk #1 from open pollinated seed I made that are pretty much the same as their Skunk #1 parents. They are growing with about the same variability as I expect from any of the other heirloom veggies I grow. So I think Skunk #1 is a good candidate for open pollinated heirloom.

The concepts of landrace and heirloom are relatively modern developments of scientific agriculture. Likewise is the concept of hybrid varieties. Before the 19th/20th century people just planted the seed they had saved. Sure, they saved seeds from their best plants when they could and sure, that caused varietal improvement but it wasn't very scientific and changes came very slowly.

That's enough for now but I would love to talk about "ancient wild Cannabis."

American landrace?

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