Delta force was ordered to stand down as were the CIA security detail which defied orders and went anyways.
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America
- Thread starter Mick
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Delta force was ordered to stand down as were the CIA security detail which defied orders and went anyways.
I don't think adding 10 trillion dollars in New debt, would be considered as creating a sustainable economy. Trump has actually decreased the national debt.
Keynesian economics is what Obama pushed Obama added more debt than every president combined. No way you can seriously belive that Obama didn't screw Americans, we will be paying for his debt for the next 100 plus years.
The Fed is a joke, they manipulate the value of the dollar, screwing us all.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subprime_mortgage_crisis
here is what obama inherited from the bush administration and fixed in his tenure as president
here is the financial stability oversight hearing with the fed with both democrat and republican parties stating their cases and grilling the fed. The fed is called out on misinformation but since all sides have an agenda it is best to watch and figure it out for yourselves.
Obama bailed out the banking industry and kept the USA from hitting a depression which was more important for national security than anything else. No politician is perfect but he seemed to have the whole of america (middle and lower class included)
https://www.c-span.org/video/?440283-1/treasury-secretary-mnuchin-testifies-senate-banking-committee
Wikipedia is an unreliable source. Bush did add to the debt, not denying that. What is not talked about, is Bill Clinton's fair housing act, directly contributed to the housing crisis. The fha mandated that lenders to loosen credit and income requirements for lenders. Then when interest rates jumped, those loans defaulted and sent property values plummeting. This is not Obama's fault nor is it Bush's. The housing collapse was directly responsible, as is Clinton.
When Bush left office we had 10 trillions in debt in 8 years Of Obama it was effectively doubled. 10 trillion to 19 plus trillion. Obama also presided over the first credit down grade of the United States.
Iknow the to leftist Obama was the Lord and savior to identity politics, but you should be honest about things. A community organizer with zero executive experience is not exactly a economic policy person. Obama has very little work experience, a couple years as a lawyer. A few years as a community organizer. He's never managed anytjing.the banks should have failed. We just sent them up to fail again. Why make hard choices when you can just get another bailout.
Trump has a degree in economics from PENN university. He's created a multi billion dollar Empire, without resorting to selling stock. The Trump family owns all of it. Their are no stockholders.
I get it that leftist hate people who have made their own way. I am sure you remember Obama's you didn't build it comments. Obama's out of office it's time to be real about it. Obama has no clue about sustainable economy policy. He was a great and charismatic speaker, but not an economists.
So for you Trump's success is measured in what he did outside of politics and obama is judged by the increase in deficit reached while maintaining traditional military industries and adding social programs
there is no such thing as balance and compromise where everyone gets maximum benefit but there is such a thing as sustainability which is essential for our economy
trump is using disruptive business practices as used in tech to create opportunity at a great expense to others and like the bush administration with cheney there are many old school pockets being filed and the American taxpayer will once again be on the hook for hte bailout
just like the mortgage crisis fucked the tax payer
how about the few holding all the dollars pay it off with the profits they control for the sake of materialistic fulfillment like trump?
American is being bled dry and the average American argues among themselves all the while
If you were one of the illuminati, a deep state person, someone with real global power, some elite and invisible puppet master behind the scenes of the Motherland or the Fatherland or any land, you would not want your front-man/fall-guy/cracked and flawed actor to be too smart now would you?..If he or she was they might get high-falut'in ideas, and not do what they were told to do...You would want him to be able to look good or at least bearable, and he would have to be an emotive speaker at least.
America, the vibe Lorrie Morgan/Beach Boys I die for this song,..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPJO_9a01ps
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPJO_9a01ps
I guess honesty is completely off the table here. Debt is down wages and GDP are up. We are having explosive growth not seen since Regan. Money is coming back from overseas, jobs are coming back. Black unemployment is at the lowest rates EVER.
I get it you can't argue facts so you parrot leftist talking points. I miss the days of conservative- liberal discussions. Now it's just leftist lies. Liberalism is dead, it died on the altar of multiculturalism
I can respect a liberal, not so much for a leftist. You guys just can't be objective. Obama doubled the debt. That is a fact.
St. Phatty
Active member
Our pseudo economy, AKA MOPE, Management of Perceptions Economy, is very much a joint effort. Unfortunately not a Cannabis Joint effort, I think the entire Congress would benefit from Passing the Bong (instead of passing the Buck.)
Brookesley Born:
"Brooksley E. Born is an American attorney and former public official who, from August 26, 1996, to June 1, 1999, was chairperson of the Commodity Futures Trading Commission"
She was in charge of regulating credit derivatives.
She was EXTREMELY concerned about them. She felt that what happened in 2007/8/9 was a huge danger, and tried to address it in the late 90's.
3 Banker / Banksters stood in her way: Greenspan, Rubin, and Summers.
They formed a brick wall, and absolutely stopped her from imposing any sane financial requirements on the un-backed insurance that credit derivatives basically are.
That's part of the story. America has Anarchy at the highest levels of business government & academia.
A friend was telling me about the TV show "Designated Survivor", where the President Vice President and Leader of the House disappear in some disaster, leaving leadership of the nation to the HUD director.
I think a good part of the nation would cheer if the Federal Government were to de-materialize, as in the TV show.
So now we have a p-Resident who loosened mental health restrictions on gun buyers a year ago. Tightening them back up.
Yes that's leadership /sarc
I am not liberal or conservative I don't vote party lines I vote issues
and there is no parrot, bipartisan investigations have proven the amount of economic stimulation you are touting is not real but rather projected
it isn't real until the general public is enriched as promised
at about 2:20 of the senate meeting is the information referenced
I am sure you watched all 2.5 hours and posted minutes after because your a speed reader and no parrot
Holy G, this new sativa, puh, check this is it real? ;-)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdDhwa3WYHo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdDhwa3WYHo
@weird- I'm not here to defend Trump, everybody's opinion on that is already out so its a waste of time.
You asked about Obama and metrics. I will give you credit for the fact that he inherited a mess from Bush.... but Bush's 2 wars turned into what, 8? While at the same time as we are marauding all over the middle east Russia makes power plays in Ukraine and also apparently "meddles in our election". China is hammering us on Intellectual property theft to the tune of billions. The amount of people on disability doubled. The debt doubled. He added HUGE future financial obligations to the gvmnt via Obamacare.
The facts aren't lost on me. He inherited a collapsed economy and for 8 years printed money to keep it afloat. This is where the debt came from. Growth was stalled at 2%. Our military mess oversees got more complicated. He was handed a shitty situation and left a shitty situation. I can admit he's not the root of all these problems but he certainly didn't make it better. In my world, borrowing $10 trillion from our grandkids to keep us comfortable is not a win.
You asked about Obama and metrics. I will give you credit for the fact that he inherited a mess from Bush.... but Bush's 2 wars turned into what, 8? While at the same time as we are marauding all over the middle east Russia makes power plays in Ukraine and also apparently "meddles in our election". China is hammering us on Intellectual property theft to the tune of billions. The amount of people on disability doubled. The debt doubled. He added HUGE future financial obligations to the gvmnt via Obamacare.
The facts aren't lost on me. He inherited a collapsed economy and for 8 years printed money to keep it afloat. This is where the debt came from. Growth was stalled at 2%. Our military mess oversees got more complicated. He was handed a shitty situation and left a shitty situation. I can admit he's not the root of all these problems but he certainly didn't make it better. In my world, borrowing $10 trillion from our grandkids to keep us comfortable is not a win.
I don't have an issue for people wanting change and trump representing the change they desire, some if not a majority of what he promised America on I agree with or at least agree isn't against American interest.
I have a problem with his motives and integrity, which to me at this point in time seem disturbingly questionable. It seems to me that the problem is so much bigger than any individual that accepting it as a fact is simply more overwhelming.
I don't have answers other than looking for sustainable answers in our near future which can't happen if we don't accept the problem at hand.
Activism is so much more potent than people think but is costly however this is how pot was legalized. It can challenge the government and even win.
Bush did add to the debt, not denying that. What is not talked about, is Bill Clinton's fair housing act, directly contributed to the housing crisis. The fha mandated that lenders to loosen credit and income requirements for lenders. Then when interest rates jumped, those loans defaulted and sent property values plummeting. This is not Obama's fault nor is it Bush's. The housing collapse was directly responsible, as is Clinton.
When Bush left office we had 10 trillions in debt in 8 years Of Obama it was effectively doubled. 10 trillion to 19 plus trillion. Obama also presided over the first credit down grade of the United States.
Iknow the to leftist Obama was the Lord and saviorlol You post the most non-factual "alternate facts" imaginable.
You took one tiny sliver of truth and ran wild with an entire field of manure. I will try to help you out as you really have zero understanding of the housing crisis.
The small sliver of truth you somehow snuck in there with the voluminous "alternate facts", was that when Pres. Clinton was in office, he directed FHA to loosen up some requirements to spur home sales - UNDERSTAND that when the requirements were loosened, there was ZERO opposition from the GOP.
What you fail to grasp is that FHA loans were/are a small percentage of overall housing loans = the foreclosures of FHA loans DID NOT CAUSE THE HOUSING CRISIS. The guilty parties are as follows, in order of responsibility :
1) The American citizens who were stricken with the "affluenza" disease, taking repeated refinances & spending far beyond their actual means = gross abuse of personal responsibility.
2) FANNIE MAE & FREDDIE MAC = virtually NONE of the banks could have done what they did without FREDDIE & FANNIE buying their loans - the obscene greed of these PRIVATELY owned secondary loan buying organizations, with loans such as no -document, 100% -125% equity loans, etc was the hugest factor ( outside of the above). Then, they greatly accelerated the collapse, by dumping a huge volume of foreclosed homes on the market, causing prices to collapse further - they changed some of their methods only AFTER the main damage was done. As criminal as anything you will EVER see.
3) The Foreclosure mechanism itself - this criminally very accelerated foreclosure process was set up during a good housing market to basically steal someone's equity - rapidly appreciating real estate made it the huge target of GREED.
The GREED backfired after things started going south and 'they" were too stupid to correct it until they took huge loses.
4) The Banks - If required due diligence was applied, many of the foreclosed homes would hav enever been given loans in te first place. Banks are notoriously cheap for paying qualified people, many banks had/have know-nothings approving loans under pressure of $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ .
To have some huge banks bailed out - the FIRST BAILOUTS - was an obscene criminal act, they should have folded due to their GREED. But the Wall Street owners of that WH, got their bailout , at huge taxpayer expense, before ANYTHING was done for the American people.
5) Bank & Mortgage Loan "officers" - just follow the $$$. Massive fraud, massive greed - huge pressure on appraisers for inflated values.
6) FHA foreclosures - definitely added to a huge problem.
7) Some bad appraisers - many appraisers could not resist the easy money of inflating values for unethical loan "officers"
Your comments on Obama did make me laugh, some uninformed and spoon fed nonsense as laughable as possible.
Barack Obama took over with the worst economy since the Great Depression. He took over 2 wars that were not his doing.
That is what caused the majority of the deficit rising further, your "statistics" are garbage with zero analysis.
Barack Obama did a fine job, if you could not be successful in the last 6-7 years, you never will be successful = he was a million times better than the raging dumpster fire we have now.
Which brings us to the current raging dumpster fire.
Your "heroes" had a chance to lead the way and show us that they were "CONSERVATIVES" and that, after 8 years of bullshitting us about the DEFICIT, they were going to be "different"
Instead, they punted and were ultra-liberals, repeating the Duhbya fiasco & doing far worse - giving a temporary income tax cut, while increasing spending and giving the ultra rich & giant corporations HUGE tax breaks ( it will be changed back again soon). Blowing up the deficit with FAR LARGER amounts than what they are saying ( shitting out)
I tried to help you
Bush did add to the debt, not denying that. What is not talked about, is Bill Clinton's fair housing act, directly contributed to the housing crisis. The fha mandated that lenders to loosen credit and income requirements for lenders. Then when interest rates jumped, those loans defaulted and sent property values plummeting. This is not Obama's fault nor is it Bush's. The housing collapse was directly responsible, as is Clinton.
When Bush left office we had 10 trillions in debt in 8 years Of Obama it was effectively doubled. 10 trillion to 19 plus trillion. Obama also presided over the first credit down grade of the United States.
Iknow the to leftist Obama was the Lord and saviorlol You post the most non-factual "alternate facts" imaginable.
You took one tiny sliver of truth and ran wild with an entire field of manure. I will try to help you out as you really have zero understanding of the housing crisis.
The small sliver of truth you somehow snuck in there with the voluminous "alternate facts", was that when Pres. Clinton was in office, he directed FHA to loosen up some requirements to spur home sales - UNDERSTAND that when the requirements were loosened, there was ZERO opposition from the GOP.
What you fail to grasp is that FHA loans were/are a small percentage of overall housing loans = the foreclosures of FHA loans DID NOT CAUSE THE HOUSING CRISIS. The guilty parties are as follows, in order of responsibility :
1) The American citizens who were stricken with the "affluenza" disease, taking repeated refinances & spending far beyond their actual means = gross abuse of personal responsibility.
2) FANNIE MAE & FREDDIE MAC = virtually NONE of the banks could have done what they did without FREDDIE & FANNIE buying their loans - the obscene greed of these PRIVATELY owned secondary loan buying organizations, with loans such as no -document, 100% -125% equity loans, etc was the hugest factor ( outside of the above). Then, they greatly accelerated the collapse, by dumping a huge volume of foreclosed homes on the market, causing prices to collapse further - they changed some of their methods only AFTER the main damage was done. As criminal as anything you will EVER see.
3) The Foreclosure mechanism itself - this criminally very accelerated foreclosure process was set up during a good housing market to basically steal someone's equity - rapidly appreciating real estate made it the huge target of GREED.
The GREED backfired after things started going south and 'they" were too stupid to correct it until they took huge loses.
4) The Banks - If required due diligence was applied, many of the foreclosed homes would hav enever been given loans in te first place. Banks are notoriously cheap for paying qualified people, many banks had/have know-nothings approving loans under pressure of $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ .
To have some huge banks bailed out - the FIRST BAILOUTS - was an obscene criminal act, they should have folded due to their GREED. But the Wall Street owners of that WH, got their bailout , at huge taxpayer expense, before ANYTHING was done for the American people.
5) Bank & Mortgage Loan "officers" - just follow the $$$. Massive fraud, massive greed - huge pressure on appraisers for inflated values.
6) FHA foreclosures - definitely added to a huge problem.
7) Some bad appraisers - many appraisers could not resist the easy money of inflating values for unethical loan "officers"
Your comments on Obama did make me laugh, some uninformed and spoon fed nonsense as laughable as possible.
Barack Obama took over with the worst economy since the Great Depression. He took over 2 wars that were not his doing.
That is what caused the majority of the deficit rising further, your "statistics" are garbage with zero analysis.
Barack Obama did a fine job, if you could not be successful in the last 6-7 years, you never will be successful = he was a million times better than the raging dumpster fire we have now.
Which brings us to the current raging dumpster fire.
Your "heroes" had a chance to lead the way and show us that they were "CONSERVATIVES" and that, after 8 years of bullshitting us about the DEFICIT, they were going to be "different"
Instead, they punted and were ultra-liberals, repeating the Duhbya fiasco & doing far worse - giving a temporary income tax cut, while increasing spending and giving the ultra rich & giant corporations HUGE tax breaks ( it will be changed back again soon). Blowing up the deficit with FAR LARGER amounts than what they are saying ( shitting out)
I tried to help you
I do agree with you on a fair amount of what you have said. I agree the banks were definitely to blame. They should NOT have been bailed out. People who were stupid and spent more than they should have, get no sympathy from me. Many in the loan and real estate industries share blame.
I have no hero's in government. I am more of a libertarian then anything,a believer in smaller government. Where we part is that Obama was a fine President. Agreed he had a lot to deal with. I have much nicer things to say about Obama, than anything leftist have to say about Bush, and especially Trump. I could list a multitude of vindictive things Obama did to the Americans he didn't like, but we are talking economic policy here so I will let that go for now.
You really can't belive that adding more debt than every previous President combined was a proper, and sound solution to a repression. No legitimate economists would endorse such reckless governance. With the debt Obama added we could have given every man, woman , and child over 30,000$'s.
As far as the tax brakes, virtually all Americans outside of the top tax bracket is receiving a fairly good cut. The corporate tax break brings us in line with most of the industrialised nations. We are now in line with even the most progressive countries like Denmark, and Norway. Lower corporate tax rates create jobs, and investment in the community.
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