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Hydro DWC issues.. w/ pics

Δ9-THC

Δ9-THC

Member
Hi. I will do my best to explain what I've got and whats up.

Growing 'The Pure' in top dripped recirc DWC buckets under 1000w hortilux using GH w/ Lucas Formula. Plants were put into the system as clones, started rez at 300ppm lucas working up to 1000ppm(EC) over 4 weeks time (where I am now). Plants show very little root growth and horrible foliar growth. New leaves become spotted and die within 4-5 days. pH dipped to 4.9 for one day, and has been 5.9-6.1 the rest of the time, temp ranges from 65-70. All rez water is mixed from RO/DI water. Foliar fed 0.05% micro three times and stopped. This is the second grow in this system that has had this sort of problem, with four different strains.

The other part: I have an IDENTICAL 6 bucket system that is filled from the exact same batch of nutrients as the one with the problems, run with the same techniques, but it started from Sour D clones.

Any insight would be greatly appreciated. I apologize for the poor white balance, the last pic is photoshopped to correct the HPS.







 
SensiMilla024

SensiMilla024

Member
So are your other 6 buckets with the sourD's experiencing the same problems?

I'd say Calcium and Manganese diffiency. If nothing has happened to the sourd

and your using the same nute/water. . . . .I would say this strain is a heavy

feeder of cal. . . .need more info. Did the spots start on the tips and work

it's way down or from the base of leaf to tip? Where did it start, Top of plant

or bottom?


Also, Check your roots, get a pic up if you can.


My last grow I encountered a weird "sucking" out of N from my plant.

Started from the bottom leaves and worked it's way to the top, till all my

big fan leaves were gone. I came to the conclusion it was 1 of 2 things.

The strain. Or Hygrozyme that gave me a weird buildup on my roots.

It came off easily, but my roots were stained brown.
 
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H

Haps

stone fool
Veteran
What is your air set up? Have you calibrated your meter? What color are your roots?
H
 
Δ9-THC

Δ9-THC

Member
SensiMilla:
Sour D are NOT experiencing any problems at all. The previous crop (GDP) in the sour D system also did not see any problems at all.
Spots start at tip of leaves and eventually cover the entire leaf.
Spotting starts all over, neither top nor bottom preferentially.
The roots look healthy to me, just extremely stunted for 4 weeks of veg. I'm hesitant to think this is a deficiency, given that I'm using the Lucas formula, which has been extremely widely used with good success. This system has had the same results with Master Kush, Romulan and Power Plant.... though not nerely as severe as this case.

Haps:
Air setup is a 6" airstone per bucket, though I don't feel this is entirely necessary since it's top-drip & recirc, but run airstones nonetheless. Check out these root pics, they look healthy to me. Both meters I use are calibrated.




 
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Kr@kEn

Kr@kEn

Member
I think you are overfeeding. The plants don't seem big enough for that high PPMs. You may have a magnesium defciciency but it may be related to lockout due to overfeeding so I would try lowering the PPMs to 700 until they get bigger.

Also when you foliar feed, do it once every 2 weeks or so with a solution no stronger than 400ppm. More than once every couple of weeks damages the leafs outer invisible layer of protection. It's best to foliar feed during the first few hours of the light cycle. Make sure the plants dry off completely before powering the light back on. And like I said try to wait 2 weeks before foliar feeding again.
So in conclusion I would lower the PPMs and see if you get some healthy new growth.
Grow on
 
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Δ9-THC

Δ9-THC

Member
Kr@ken: Thanks for the response. I stopped foliar feeding because I ended up getting powdery mildew. I agree, the plants aren't big, but we started the nutes at 400ppm and worked up over now 5 weeks. I had no choice but to switch to 12/12, I can't wait any longer for "The Pure" to start growing. I'm going to try a small addition of CalMag and perhaps dilute the nutrients a bit.
 
G

Guest

I had a problem like this once. Some bad plants when everything else was the same. Tried all kinds of stuff. Ended up changing the buckets..wa la...problem gone. apparently the one bucket that was having the problem was leaching some plastic toxins int o the ferts...
 
Δ9-THC

Δ9-THC

Member
Really... that's really interesting, thanks for sharing. That would be a pretty slim chance, all 12 buckets were purchased from the store with the big orange sign all at the same time. Also, many water changes have taken place that I would have thought would dilute out any 'toxin'. How can anyone know whether the next bucket is any less toxic than the last?
 
G

GreenFriend

New member
Hey there bud sorry to see your troubles.Id say you got your self a calcium deficiency going on there along with overfeeding.Gh is not really formulated for soft water and since you are using ro your ladies are needing more calcium.Your nutrient strength is to much for the underdeveloped root system to take in.id bump your ppm back to around 800ppm and get yourself some calmag or other calcim supplements to get you back on track..

GoodGrowing
 
Δ9-THC

Δ9-THC

Member
Greenfriend: Awesome man, thanks for the input, that's exactly what I've done. Things are slightly improved, but time will tell if that is/was the issue.
 
KUSHEATER1

KUSHEATER1

Active member
lucas is for hard water but I say your overfeeding change rez with straight tap water for 2 days and slowly add you gh nutes I overfeed my katsu bubba and I can tell that she won't really thicken up this round so I'll kick it down a notch to see if I can dail her truly in,even with the overfeeding she is still a beast had a 40 day test nug and she is off the charts.
 
H

Haps

stone fool
Veteran
I think these chaps have it about right, try lower, add cal mag, keep ph in the zone. I will say that I have had poor results with flowering gals that were not in grow mode, hope you do better. I have seen roots like that turn around and take off, and in the same crop others that never got much better, and I still do not know the reason. Perhaps we will learn from your resolution of the issue.
H
 
L

LumpStatus

Lucas is NOT FOR HARDWATER.

Lucas formula is based on a starting ppm of NEAR ZERO.

I have successfully used the lucas formula with RO water and with hard tap water. However, if you have OVER 300ppm over 8ph I would recommend using hard water micro from gh OR getting a RO system.

I see that you have some roots that are "dried up". This indicates to me that your water level may be too low. You want to keep most of your roots in the water until a really good root system is formed. I also see some brown "sludge" on your net pot, may indicate root rot. How high are your water temps?

I disagree that your plants cannot handle the lucas formula (1300ppm). A clone with a decent root system should be able to handle it no problem. In fact, I recommend as does lucas that you keep ppm 1100-1500 at all times throughout the growth (veg and flower) allowing it to fluctuate in that range.

I don't know why everything has gotten confused with the lucas formula. Very simple. There is no veg/bloom formula. Only one formula for BOTH veg and bloom. There are different ratios/ppm for plants under less intense light.

Any question you could ever have about the lucas formula and more can be answered here:

https://www.cannabis-world.org/cw/showthread.php?t=892
 
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Δ9-THC

Δ9-THC

Member
Lumpstatus: The 'dried up' roots are from the last grow, no cause for concern there. Water temps are 65 ºF, also no cause for concern.

Hence... you've offered no suggestion as to the cause of my issues. Clearly the Lucas formula is not flawless. It's been 6 weeks now and the plants look like crap still. Splotching of the leaves and eventually they fall off.

CalMag didn't really seem to help at all.
 
Blunt_69

Blunt_69

the keeper of the creeper
Veteran
Lucas is NOT FOR HARDWATER.
Click to expand...

Uh I tend to disagree as i have use lucas in many types of water.It works in all types as long as you are maintaining proper ph and PPM levels.

I disagree that your plants cannot handle the lucas formula (1300ppm). A clone with a decent root system should be able to handle it no problem. In fact, I recommend as does lucas that you keep ppm 1100-1500 at all times throughout the growth (veg and flower) allowing it to fluctuate in that range.
Click to expand...


No no no.. 1300ppm... are you freaking kidding me.. Lucas or not this is way to high of a value for smaller plants.I keep my rez in between 500-700 ppm when my plants are as big as posted. I also gradually max my strain out at 1200ppm.Some strains can handle more, mine however will burn and fry anything over this value. Alll strains are diffrent on what they can handle I think it's simple they are being overfed with such a small root system.
 
Δ9-THC

Δ9-THC

Member
Blunt_69: I'll post some more root pics when I get a chance. In my opinion, they SHOULD be able to handle atleast 1200ppm at this point.

Please also keep in mind that the numbers I have posted are in EC, not TDS. I max my strains at ~2000 EC
 
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