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Does a Male or Female Pass On More genetics to Their Offspring?
- Thread starter Burro Johnson
- Start date
I truly Have little understanding of what you say, I gave Nevile his Haze lines. They were from my Haze lines.
You do have strong opinions but they are based on few facts.
No Sacred Seeds were selfed, they were all with true males and females used as parents to make seeds. I did not even have clones in 1975.
"The guy in Oregon is indeed running circles around said company on a small farm with his brother not just talking he producing seed across spectrum cbd cbg cbcv etc and the only person doing so."
What can I say? Ask him who did it first? He is very friendly to me, and my earlier work that I licensed.
BTW I am not a partner and I have no shares in the company.
I will not be taking more pictures just because you want me to.
I agree about true breeding Cannabis varieties, but that is the way it is, you can try and make one if that is what you want to do. When I started my first seed biz in the 1970's I only sold true breeding varieties so growers could buy seeds once and then just make their own. Today all female Autos are what is sold in the EU, sort of the opposite.
-SamS
You do have strong opinions but they are based on few facts.
No Sacred Seeds were selfed, they were all with true males and females used as parents to make seeds. I did not even have clones in 1975.
"The guy in Oregon is indeed running circles around said company on a small farm with his brother not just talking he producing seed across spectrum cbd cbg cbcv etc and the only person doing so."
What can I say? Ask him who did it first? He is very friendly to me, and my earlier work that I licensed.
BTW I am not a partner and I have no shares in the company.
I will not be taking more pictures just because you want me to.
I agree about true breeding Cannabis varieties, but that is the way it is, you can try and make one if that is what you want to do. When I started my first seed biz in the 1970's I only sold true breeding varieties so growers could buy seeds once and then just make their own. Today all female Autos are what is sold in the EU, sort of the opposite.
-SamS
Do you want the truth or what you think is the truth???
-SamS
-SamS
Ut Oh —- clean up in aisle two stat.....
As the sacred seed catalogue list “ Haze “ as selfed offering. So who am I speaking with again ????
Why listed as selfed? Your other offerings sold not listed this way afghani pure , acl gold etc etc it’s in green and black
So your excuse can’t be crossed against itself
Again proof is in the off spring and Neville’s said you did not sell him his line. And his line did produce greatness indeed but your line in your words only 10% keepers . Correct ??
So your excuse can’t be crossed against itself
Again proof is in the off spring and Neville’s said you did not sell him his line. And his line did produce greatness indeed but your line in your words only 10% keepers . Correct ??
Get over it you are just wrong, no selfed plants were ever used with Sacred Seeds. Post the specific catalog if you can, I will try and remember if I can, but regardless none were ever selfed.
Where do you think Neville got his Haze, he admits it in his early catalogs, seeds from me. I have all his catalogs including the pre color first ones when his seeds were .25 cents each and he was not making them, he just collected them to sell by post from coffee shops from imported weed.
-SamS
Where do you think Neville got his Haze, he admits it in his early catalogs, seeds from me. I have all his catalogs including the pre color first ones when his seeds were .25 cents each and he was not making them, he just collected them to sell by post from coffee shops from imported weed.
-SamS
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Wrong again, I had a Sacred Seeds catalog in each year in the second half of 70's and the first half of the 80's. I have zero idea which one you refer to. Show it.... They are all dated.
-SamS
-SamS
troutman
Seed Whore
its on floor ....
back on topic. every species male dominant that has male and female included. plant or animal. and the fact hemp is naturally dioecious also can't be disputed
and questioning fact fem or S1 lines lines produce more hermaphroditism no matter amount of deleted threads ..... look at franchise genetics total disaster
back on topic. every species male dominant that has male and female included. plant or animal. and the fact hemp is naturally dioecious also can't be disputed
and questioning fact fem or S1 lines lines produce more hermaphroditism no matter amount of deleted threads ..... look at franchise genetics total disaster
Natural high
Member
Absolutely wrong! I assume you get this idea from male animals being the more aggressive sex. In regards to genetics which is the current topic of this thread, males and females pass on their genes equally and the dominance of a gene is independent the sex of the parent donor.
male has x and y female only x .....
and plants can't reproduce without the males. females can't evolve without pollen unto next generation.. again speaking towards hemp that is always dioecious and will revert towards this state.
not some mish mash of whats found today in the canna community. never forget, hemp the very foundation of everything within said community
and plants can't reproduce without the males. females can't evolve without pollen unto next generation.. again speaking towards hemp that is always dioecious and will revert towards this state.
not some mish mash of whats found today in the canna community. never forget, hemp the very foundation of everything within said community
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There are pics of your greenhouses with the plants you grow here on icmag,
unless you have removed them, they can be found.
I have some of your stock, and one in particular stands out.
Thai Haze x skunk1.
I have selfed it and crossed it with males of other lines i maintain.
Very easy to observe what traits are contributed from each of the P1's.
Outstanding in all aspects.
You and I have discussed the Thunk on a few occasions,
pepper scent lost and found, if you recall.
Thanks for your contribution to the community, and in regards
to the Sacred Seeds Catalogs, c1985, is also known as Cultivator's Choice,
please confirm.
I'll be back, lots to discuss.
and what's the deal with kankakee, did you kill his dog or something, lol.
Kankakee,
Wrong again, if from 1985 it is a Cultivators Choice catalog, maybe the same to you but it is not a Sacred Seeds Catalog. That is why I had no idea what you are talking about. Cultivators Choice sold more Hybrids then true breeding varieties, like Sacred Seeds only sold.
Read it again, you say only the Haze was listed as "selfed" but that is not true, Orange is listed as "selfed", Early Girl is listed as "selfed", Indi-Sat is listed as "selfed" and Original Haze is listed as "selfed"
None of these are "selfed" as you think, they are all using male and female parents, as I have been telling you.
Selfed meant not hybridized with another variety. By "selfed" we mean crossed with its own kind as the catalog clearly states...
I am frank about quality in the varieties offered in my 1985 Cultivators Choice Catalog, maybe you take that for varieties that are no good? I was just trying to be honest with my opinions at the time.
This is the Haze seeds that Neville got from me. He found a decent one and hybridized it with Northern Lights, that restored vigor to the line that increased yield, and potency, it also altered the high a bit
and his hybrid was not as clear or ceilingless as pure Original Haze can be if you can find a potent Great Original Haze. I know this as I have smoked both side by side 30 year ago.
I am the one that suggested to Neville to use Original Haze as a parent for a hybrid as that did restore lost vigor to the line. The original line was reproduced by the "Haze Brothers" in Santa Cruz for a decade before I started to work with it, by then it was fairly inbred as they used very few parents and Cannabis being an Dioecious Obligate Outcrosser requires a bigger population to keep all the genes intact, see:
Crossa, J. et al. 1993. Statistical genetic considerations for maintaining germ plasm collections. Theoretical and Applied Genetics 86: 673-678.
This shows that to keep all the genes intact in a Cannabis variety a minimum of 1000 females and 1000 males is required each reproduction.
I kept the Original Haze as I got it, as I really thought it was great cannabis just hard to find a really great one because of inbreeding with the line. I am glad I did it. I did not want to improve it by watering down the Haze content with something like Northern Lights that would improve yield and potency, as I liked the pure Original Haze as it was much better, you just needed to grow maybe 10 time as many plants to find a keeper, I was clear about that.
Neville got Original Haze from me in 1984, promised to not knock it off, or knock off any of my varieties if I would sell him seeds, then proceeded to knock-off all my varieties, so much for his word.
I was hesitant to sell him my work if he was going to just knock them off to make more money himself, my seeds were less then $1 each but he wanted to make more money and broke his promise and handshake, that is the kind of guy he is. It is water under the bridge, more then 30 years ago, but what I say is true.
I hope to in the next few years to grow 75,000+ Original Haze so I can pick just the very best dozen to use for improvement, when this is done I will have clones that can reliably produce great progeny, I will clone and progeny test all the selected elite parents, female and male. As well as allow the 75,000 to freely pollinate the whole crop.
This should help maintain and select great new Haze parents to use in the future by others. I can do this legally outdoors in an area that allows the work and the weather is warm and the season long enough before cold or rains. It may well be my last work, I am getting old.
-SamS
Wrong again, if from 1985 it is a Cultivators Choice catalog, maybe the same to you but it is not a Sacred Seeds Catalog. That is why I had no idea what you are talking about. Cultivators Choice sold more Hybrids then true breeding varieties, like Sacred Seeds only sold.
Read it again, you say only the Haze was listed as "selfed" but that is not true, Orange is listed as "selfed", Early Girl is listed as "selfed", Indi-Sat is listed as "selfed" and Original Haze is listed as "selfed"
None of these are "selfed" as you think, they are all using male and female parents, as I have been telling you.
Selfed meant not hybridized with another variety. By "selfed" we mean crossed with its own kind as the catalog clearly states...
I am frank about quality in the varieties offered in my 1985 Cultivators Choice Catalog, maybe you take that for varieties that are no good? I was just trying to be honest with my opinions at the time.
This is the Haze seeds that Neville got from me. He found a decent one and hybridized it with Northern Lights, that restored vigor to the line that increased yield, and potency, it also altered the high a bit
and his hybrid was not as clear or ceilingless as pure Original Haze can be if you can find a potent Great Original Haze. I know this as I have smoked both side by side 30 year ago.
I am the one that suggested to Neville to use Original Haze as a parent for a hybrid as that did restore lost vigor to the line. The original line was reproduced by the "Haze Brothers" in Santa Cruz for a decade before I started to work with it, by then it was fairly inbred as they used very few parents and Cannabis being an Dioecious Obligate Outcrosser requires a bigger population to keep all the genes intact, see:
Crossa, J. et al. 1993. Statistical genetic considerations for maintaining germ plasm collections. Theoretical and Applied Genetics 86: 673-678.
This shows that to keep all the genes intact in a Cannabis variety a minimum of 1000 females and 1000 males is required each reproduction.
I kept the Original Haze as I got it, as I really thought it was great cannabis just hard to find a really great one because of inbreeding with the line. I am glad I did it. I did not want to improve it by watering down the Haze content with something like Northern Lights that would improve yield and potency, as I liked the pure Original Haze as it was much better, you just needed to grow maybe 10 time as many plants to find a keeper, I was clear about that.
Neville got Original Haze from me in 1984, promised to not knock it off, or knock off any of my varieties if I would sell him seeds, then proceeded to knock-off all my varieties, so much for his word.
I was hesitant to sell him my work if he was going to just knock them off to make more money himself, my seeds were less then $1 each but he wanted to make more money and broke his promise and handshake, that is the kind of guy he is. It is water under the bridge, more then 30 years ago, but what I say is true.
I hope to in the next few years to grow 75,000+ Original Haze so I can pick just the very best dozen to use for improvement, when this is done I will have clones that can reliably produce great progeny, I will clone and progeny test all the selected elite parents, female and male. As well as allow the 75,000 to freely pollinate the whole crop.
This should help maintain and select great new Haze parents to use in the future by others. I can do this legally outdoors in an area that allows the work and the weather is warm and the season long enough before cold or rains. It may well be my last work, I am getting old.
-SamS
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Hemp is selected by man, the foundation of Cannabis is wild varieties pre mans use and selection, man may have selected for drug or seed or fiber first in different areas from different populations. See Cannabis Evolution and Ethnobotany by RC Clarke.
Cannabis can and does reproduce with out male plants, it does need at least some male flowers on the female plants to do so. Or use STS for pollen.
Except in a lab they can evolve and reproduce with female Somatic fusion of two female plants.
example:
Process for plant cells
The somatic fusion process occurs in four steps:
The removal of the cell wall of one cell of each plant using cellulase enzyme to produce a somatic cell called a protoplast
The cells are then fused using electric shock (electrofusion) or chemical treatment to join the cells and fuse together the nuclei. The resulting fused nucleus is called heterokaryon.
The somatic hybrid cell then has its cell wall induced to form using hormones
The cells are then grown into calluses which then are further grown to plantlets and finally to a full plant, known as a somatic hybrid.
-SamS
Cannabis can and does reproduce with out male plants, it does need at least some male flowers on the female plants to do so. Or use STS for pollen.
Except in a lab they can evolve and reproduce with female Somatic fusion of two female plants.
example:
Process for plant cells
The somatic fusion process occurs in four steps:
The removal of the cell wall of one cell of each plant using cellulase enzyme to produce a somatic cell called a protoplast
The cells are then fused using electric shock (electrofusion) or chemical treatment to join the cells and fuse together the nuclei. The resulting fused nucleus is called heterokaryon.
The somatic hybrid cell then has its cell wall induced to form using hormones
The cells are then grown into calluses which then are further grown to plantlets and finally to a full plant, known as a somatic hybrid.
-SamS
