Natural high
Member
Does this mean clones or seeds from the original Cindy99 parents are still available?
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The NEW C99 brother Grimm
- Thread starter Kinkao
- Start date
~star~crash~
Active member
here is the original C99
here is the original C99
this is the F1 from 1999 ... this is Cindy ...she's extinct in seed,but must lurk as a clone somewhere ....
here is the original C99
this is the F1 from 1999 ... this is Cindy ...she's extinct in seed,but must lurk as a clone somewhere ....
FrozenFire
Member
So no purple, and double serrated leaves. I really wish I knew where the new seed stock is picking up the purple leaves and calyxes that show up late in bloom...
Happy Times
Well-known member
I was wondering the same thing, where does the purple come from? Was lucky to be able to grow some P88 from seed back around 1999 and never noticed any purple.
Don’t mean to knock the new version, just seems different from the old-school
Cccc-hhh—aaaa-nnn-ggg-eee-sss
Don’t mean to knock the new version, just seems different from the old-school
Cccc-hhh—aaaa-nnn-ggg-eee-sss
~star~crash~
Active member
it's a %50 c99 copy & the purple is coming from whatever the unidentified male was used in the initial replication attempt from 2015 ...they re-released the copy in 2016 ...shame on BG for not being straight-up about it & implying that its identicle to the original ... i've run F3's that had more c99 in it then the current BG c99 does ... kudos to them for cashing in on the old reputation for c99
CrushnYuba
Well-known member
I grew out a fair amount of the new brothers grim stock and i was pretty happy with it. A ton of vigor. Fast flowering. Some interesting phenos. Probably wouldn't do it again as outdoor from seed. The pinaple phenos were to common and they are unfortunately less desirable in my market. There was a couple really great cheesy, pork smelling phenos. They had smallish less spread out leafs a couple shades darker then typical phenos.
M/f ratio was really good. About 70% female.
M/f ratio was really good. About 70% female.
I've said it before and I'll say it again. Tricloud Genetics works with LEGITIMATE F1 Bross Grimm stock in their lines.
I have Grapefruit C99 F1 clone x Digi Bx1 seeds.
There are original stock isolated clones and parents still being kept from several lines, including A11 and P75.
dank.Frank
I have Grapefruit C99 F1 clone x Digi Bx1 seeds.
There are original stock isolated clones and parents still being kept from several lines, including A11 and P75.
dank.Frank
zombywolf7
New member
I have the original C99 from 2000. The seeds are tiny, at least 1/2 to 2/3rds smaller than reg seeds. Soul must have something different in the mix if the seeds are big.
FrozenFire
Member
Frank- thanks for the heads up on the tricloud genetics. I'll do some research on their stuff for future grows.
Star crash- I agree, smells like a cash grab and a little shady.
My personal opinion is they should be honest about lineage for the price they are charging. It undermines my faith in a breeder when there isn't any transparency in what you are spending hard earned money on. For what it's worth I like the new genetics as the plants themselves are solid. Fast finishing, dense sativa nugs, great pineapple terps, and very vigorous. I wish they would have changed the name and let the new cross stand on its own merit.
Star crash- I agree, smells like a cash grab and a little shady.
My personal opinion is they should be honest about lineage for the price they are charging. It undermines my faith in a breeder when there isn't any transparency in what you are spending hard earned money on. For what it's worth I like the new genetics as the plants themselves are solid. Fast finishing, dense sativa nugs, great pineapple terps, and very vigorous. I wish they would have changed the name and let the new cross stand on its own merit.
IntotheGreen
Active member
From what I gather, Princess has been kept alive as a clone, and Soul retrieved her from friends for the new production run of C99. He then grew out a bunch of original Cinderella seeds and selected a new male to be the father of the new issue of C99 (with Princess as the mother.)
While Bros. Grimm claim the new seeds are "identical" to the originals, this is not entirely true. From what I can tell, going by Soul's own descriptions of the Cinderella breeding process, and the BG Instagram page, the observed differences between the old C99 and the new are owing to a different father plant. In fact, if I'm interpreting correctly, the old Cindy (the seeds they first sold as C99) was actually the P.94 generation (~94% Princess genes, the result of the 3rd backcross of of Princess's male progeny to herself, so [Princess x P.88]). The NEW issue of Cinderella 99 appears to be an actual 4th backcross, in which an original P.94 male was grown out and selected to pollinate Princess and produce the new seeds for sale, which would now be P.97. It seems that Mr. Soul became enamored with this particular male due to its impressive structure and floral production, and used it in the reissue of C99 as well as several other of their new/old crosses. Here is a picture of the father from the BG's Instagram page:
So while the new issue is technically still original genetics, and theoretically closer to Princess genetically than the old version (P.97 vs. P.94), the new seeds do NOT contain an identical gene pool as the old ones. Soul himself states in the above IG post that he's NEVER seen a male like that before, so in a strain that has already been cubed to produce more or less stable, uniform plants from seed, choosing a male that clearly had enough outlying genes among that 6% of variation to produce a unique phenotypical expression was bound to shift the avg. phenotypical expression of the offspring compared to the prior issue.
While Bros. Grimm claim the new seeds are "identical" to the originals, this is not entirely true. From what I can tell, going by Soul's own descriptions of the Cinderella breeding process, and the BG Instagram page, the observed differences between the old C99 and the new are owing to a different father plant. In fact, if I'm interpreting correctly, the old Cindy (the seeds they first sold as C99) was actually the P.94 generation (~94% Princess genes, the result of the 3rd backcross of of Princess's male progeny to herself, so [Princess x P.88]). The NEW issue of Cinderella 99 appears to be an actual 4th backcross, in which an original P.94 male was grown out and selected to pollinate Princess and produce the new seeds for sale, which would now be P.97. It seems that Mr. Soul became enamored with this particular male due to its impressive structure and floral production, and used it in the reissue of C99 as well as several other of their new/old crosses. Here is a picture of the father from the BG's Instagram page:
So while the new issue is technically still original genetics, and theoretically closer to Princess genetically than the old version (P.97 vs. P.94), the new seeds do NOT contain an identical gene pool as the old ones. Soul himself states in the above IG post that he's NEVER seen a male like that before, so in a strain that has already been cubed to produce more or less stable, uniform plants from seed, choosing a male that clearly had enough outlying genes among that 6% of variation to produce a unique phenotypical expression was bound to shift the avg. phenotypical expression of the offspring compared to the prior issue.
Natural high
Member
Got any pics?
I call bullshit bro, she is not in any way extinct in seed form like you claim...
that’s bold bro.
I personally hold seed stock made from original Cindy99 that is over 10 years old.
No clones , just seeds..
There is a big , big world of cannabis out there besides what you read about on the internet.
Trust me Cindy99 is well represented in seed form on real farms that you will never read about on ICmag.
So yes is the real answer. The real Cindy is out there, don’t worry. Just gotta find it, or already have it
Natural high
Member
Got any pics?
Hardly - its a 6-7 weeker with a speedy "effect" and no body hit.
The redeeming trait was a distinct Grapefruit aroma, thats it.
I grew the original along with A11 back in the early 2000s and if its anything like the best C99 of old, its no holy grail. A interesting curiosity at best.
Holy grail applies to the best Hazes and purest indicas, not a quick flowering, spidery sativa dom hybrid with no stone to it.
Natural high
Member
Mr Soul wrote the following about Princess and the breeding of C99.
To back up my point, I have a sativa dominant Jack Herer clone that grows dense resinous buds that smell of pineapple and spices, that are ready in 49-53 days, and has a soaring sativa high. Sounds fairly similar to princess if you ask me.
.
I tend to disagree with Mr Soul about it being legitimately HIS work, his creation. He found seeds in a Sensi Jack Herer bud which are most likely to be an F2 of Jack Herer. So "princess", the plant he strove to reproduce in seed form, was probably a Sensi Jack Herer pheno; and he used a male from the same seeds in the breeding process to create C99.
To back up my point, I have a sativa dominant Jack Herer clone that grows dense resinous buds that smell of pineapple and spices, that are ready in 49-53 days, and has a soaring sativa high. Sounds fairly similar to princess if you ask me.
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bigbadbiddy
Active member
Urm, when someone grows a pack of Sensi's Jack and finds/selects a special mum and dad and then breeds with them and stabilizes the line and comes out with something that could not be found in the original line, then how is that not actual breeding work?
Far as memory serves, Mr. Soul found an early finishing female in his Sensi Jack that, in his oppinion, didn't loose anything compared to the other Jacks. Meaning potency etc. all still there, just finishing much sooner than the other Jacks.
He found a male that seemed similar and bred with them and the end result was C99. Pure Jack Herrer by all acounts but selected and bred/bottlenecked towards short flowering without losing desired attributes of the original Jack it came from.
He stabilized the whole thing to the extend that others who bought these seeds from him found the same, ealry finishing plant that had all the (or most) desirable attributes of the Jack.
That is definitely solid breeding work and also why it was so popular back then.
But it looks like that has been lost in time, the new ones, no matter if from BG or other sources, seem to definitely lack a lot of desirable attributes, not the least of which being the potency/punch of the Jack Herrer. What has been retained, it seems, is the early finishing characteristic and the grapefruit and pineapple terps.
I personally only grew a hand full of C99 from peakseeds and the 2 ladies I flowered out were nice plants but had a considerable lack of potency in common.
Either way, opinion on the new C99 being as it may, let us not detract from the fact that what it used to be was true breeding work and deserved its place in the cannabis hall of fame.
It's kinda funny how everyone salivated and tried to find a good C99 all those years and now that the re-release by the original breeder is out and left people disappointed suddenly you hear everywhere "maaaan, C99 ain't shit and never was shit".
Far as memory serves, Mr. Soul found an early finishing female in his Sensi Jack that, in his oppinion, didn't loose anything compared to the other Jacks. Meaning potency etc. all still there, just finishing much sooner than the other Jacks.
He found a male that seemed similar and bred with them and the end result was C99. Pure Jack Herrer by all acounts but selected and bred/bottlenecked towards short flowering without losing desired attributes of the original Jack it came from.
He stabilized the whole thing to the extend that others who bought these seeds from him found the same, ealry finishing plant that had all the (or most) desirable attributes of the Jack.
That is definitely solid breeding work and also why it was so popular back then.
But it looks like that has been lost in time, the new ones, no matter if from BG or other sources, seem to definitely lack a lot of desirable attributes, not the least of which being the potency/punch of the Jack Herrer. What has been retained, it seems, is the early finishing characteristic and the grapefruit and pineapple terps.
I personally only grew a hand full of C99 from peakseeds and the 2 ladies I flowered out were nice plants but had a considerable lack of potency in common.
Either way, opinion on the new C99 being as it may, let us not detract from the fact that what it used to be was true breeding work and deserved its place in the cannabis hall of fame.
It's kinda funny how everyone salivated and tried to find a good C99 all those years and now that the re-release by the original breeder is out and left people disappointed suddenly you hear everywhere "maaaan, C99 ain't shit and never was shit".
Natural high
Member
It could be found because he found princess. He aimed to reproduce princess in seed form, just with stronger stems.
How can he decide that it didn't compare to any other Jack's? JH was released as an F1 with a large variation of possible phenotypes. I have one that finishes in 7 weeks so they obviously exist.
~star~crash~
Active member
the 1999 Cindy seed stock was just about my fav plant ever
