Seedling Phase: I Really Suck at it

BetaGrow · Jan 20, 2016

Sup IC.

I've been back lurking the boards after a few seasons on the low. Consider myself a intermediate grower, I have a progressive neuromuscular disease and a medical need. Anyways, I really suck at the seedling phase. Which is weird, because I'm great at germing, never lose anyone, but after like day 3 I just suck.

I'm using peat+coco/perlite. Got a bunch of nutes, even mycorrhizae, enzymes, beneficials, etc.

My temps have been low in my veg area, I've rectified that situation. But I think I may be overwatering? Giving the seedlings each like 30-50mL per day of straight water. Yesterday I switched to a 600 ppm nute solution. We'll see how that goes, I have some gals popping right now.

My basic problem is half of these homies are dying before the third or fourth true set. And the growth is just slow in general. Until about week four of veg.

Is 70-75F on 24/0 too low? Heating mats? What specific watering and feeding techniques should I use with my resources? Always thought straight water was best.

Thanks

jesbuds · Jan 20, 2016

Pictures are worth a thousand words, hard to say why some are dying from the description but temps in that range are fine.

Honestly I've never killed a seed by watering it with the same feeding solution I use on other plants. Don't treat seeds all that different from older plants save for watering less.

Bobby_Stainless · Jan 20, 2016

Warm, humid, and rapid rooters are what my seedlings like. Head formula from the get go. Germ in wet paper towels.

Lester Beans · Jan 20, 2016

600 ppm is too much for seedlings. Sounds like the seedlings are damping off due to over watering. Let the media dry out before each watering. Also a fan blowing gently, not directly on the plants, but so the plants just slightly move is a good way to get airflow on the media to avoid damping off.

BetaGrow · Jan 20, 2016

I've seen a few coco growers, like DJM, recommend the 600 ppm flush for seedlings. Like I said before though, I usually do straight water.

I got no problems germing. 100% success. Forgot to mention I'm usually doing like 20-30 seedlings because I run regular seeds.

As far as damping off goes, this never happens to me with my four weeks plus plants. People here say every day, every other etc. It seems like my soil mix takes about 3-4 days in my veg area to get close to "dry". More perlite?

BetaGrow · Jan 20, 2016

jesbuds said:
Pictures are worth a thousand words

use your imagination it's not necessary seedlings look the same. weak growth, small. etc. is too much light a possibility? they're 6 inches under 8000 lumens of CFL

jesbuds · Jan 20, 2016

Small/weak growth are subjective terms which mean very little online, have fun in your growing.

chronosync · Jan 20, 2016

600ppm nute solution.
Whats in it?
City, well, or RO?

Why not just feed them a light base, like .4 - .6ec or around 200ppm to start.

I just burnt up and stalled some very well rooted cuts by feeding them 600ppm

As far as damping off, you said you have no problem with plants more than a month old. Theres your solution. Seedlings arent four weeks strong, go easy and if your doing everything mentioned in post #4 everything should be gold. Easy.

BetaGrow · Jan 20, 2016

jesbuds said:
Small/weak growth are subjective terms which mean very little online, have fun in your growing.

You 're 100% absolutely correct.

I appreciate the advice, from everyone, I'll try 200 ppm instead of like 10 ppm or 600 ppm. There's just no point in the photos, it's embarrassing. I should probably just kill them and start over.

TerpeneDream · Jan 20, 2016

New grower here…Exceptional results from seed thus far…

I do a 48 hour water soak (until taproot starts to split)

Fill a 1 or 2 gallon 3/4 of the way with soil and vermiculite (for water retention. About 1/3 Verm.)

Sprinkle a little Xtreme Micorhizal fungi on top (lightly mix it in near top)

Drop seedling 1/2 inch from top in a little hole. Lightly sprinkle loose soil over the seed.

2-5 days later you'll have your seedling.

Water lightly every 3-5 days, or so.

You can go a nearly a month without feeding any food, given your soil is nice.

Goodluck

chronosync · Jan 20, 2016

Dont kill anything and dont give up! Whatever you do dont give up. Just use clones until you get your seedling technique down. Sounds like you just need to try it some with a different approach.

Daddysdank · Jan 20, 2016

I would say possibly. Over watering may be some of the cause,as I dnt see feeding everyday as I usually only feed every 4-5 days because when you plant that seed it's tap root shoots dwn to the bottom in a matter of a day maybe 2 and then secondary roots starts to search out for water,if that tap rot ends up sitting in water it will surely slow root growth and slowly start dampening off..I really try ta let the medium dry out as much as possible without affecting the plant/roots.let those roots stretch far and wide as possible before watering them..this will also help establish a strong root system early on in the plants life.. hope this helps you and you continue to have bttr results with your seedlings..

thesloppy · Jan 20, 2016

I'm not exactly great at the seedling phase either, despite years and years of experience by now, so I feel your pain. 600ppm is too strong for seedlings in my opinion, and 200-300ppm sounds pretty good for the first couple weeks. Really the nute strength is probably the least of your worries, one way or the other, if they're dying between a week or two....they could probably live that long (though relatively poorly) without any nutes or twice as many, and it's probably not the cause of your problems if they're not even making it that long. Likewise, I think 70-75 degrees is fine.

Overwatering definitely sounds like your best bet, and I had similar problems fine tuning my watering with coco in the early stages. I think you have to pretty much treat coco like soil for the first couple weeks, until the root system gets established and can take multiple (or even single) daily waterings. Let it get dry to the touch before you water it, let it sit for a day or two between waterings...your plant will show obvious signs of wilting before it gets in any kind of danger, so don't worry about starving it.

For whatever it's worth all my moms are little bonsais in coco-filled solo cups, and even as established moms I still water them only every 3-4 days...I probably could water them twice a day if I wanted to, and they'd respond with greatly improved vigor, but I don't need my moms to be pushing their limits like bodybuilders like you do with plants intended for harvest, so I can pretty much treat them like soil plants. My point just being that you can safely water your coco plants much less than you may be comfortable with, and your seedlings at least will likely improve with less watering until they've established a larger root system. Good luck! :tiphat:

Aksala · Jan 21, 2016

After gemrinating I put my seeds in a 50/50 mix of perlite and worm castings and drop a little mycorrhizae powder in the hole. Works really well.

bigdad41296 · Jan 21, 2016

thesloppy said:
I'm not exactly great at the seedling phase either, despite years and years of experience by now, so I feel your pain. 600ppm is too strong for seedlings in my opinion, and 200-300ppm sounds pretty good for the first couple weeks. Really the nute strength is probably the least of your worries, one way or the other, if they're dying between a week or two....they could probably live that long (though relatively poorly) without any nutes or twice as many, and it's probably not the cause of your problems if they're not even making it that long. Likewise, I think 70-75 degrees is fine.

Overwatering definitely sounds like your best bet, and I had similar problems fine tuning my watering with coco in the early stages. I think you have to pretty much treat coco like soil for the first couple weeks, until the root system gets established and can take multiple (or even single) daily waterings. Let it get dry to the touch before you water it, let it sit for a day or two between waterings...your plant will show obvious signs of wilting before it gets in any kind of danger, so don't worry about starving it.

For whatever it's worth all my moms are little bonsais in coco-filled solo cups, and even as established moms I still water them only every 3-4 days...I probably could water them twice a day if I wanted to, and they'd respond with greatly improved vigor, but I don't need my moms to be pushing their limits like bodybuilders like you do with plants intended for harvest, so I can pretty much treat them like soil plants. My point just being that you can safely water your coco plants much less than you may be comfortable with, and your seedlings at least will likely improve with less watering until they've established a larger root system. Good luck!

I fully agree with sloppy on everything he has said. :tiphat:

thesloppy · Jan 21, 2016

bigdad41296 said:
I fully agree with sloppy on everything he has said.

It had to happen someday!

chronosync · Jan 21, 2016

It true. Coco is tricky at first. At field capacity it is the perfect place for roots. Mature roots want it wet tho. Op doesnt use coco. Could try it its greeeeaaaat.

chronosync · Jan 21, 2016

Oops yea you do. DTW?

BetaGrow · Jan 21, 2016

Yeah, I'm using coco+peat/perlite. I've been hand watering for a few seasons. It'd be cool to go back to DTW, though. Just need to get this seedling shit down to a science first!

chronosync · Jan 21, 2016

You can drain to waste by hand too.
Id like to recirculate myself with ebb and flow? But i feed by hand they get fed every day whether they need it or not.

Seedling Phase: I Really Suck at it

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