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Stressed plants and can't figure out why.

Scott42012

New member
Hello everyone.
I'm new to growing and my garden is having some issues. I've done a bit of research and can't figure it out. I have help from friends who have a lot more experience than me and we can't narrow it down either. I'll be as descriptive as possible. If I leave out any information let me know.

We are using Botanicare Readygrow Aeration. My friends and I are in agreement that the medium isn't drying out very fast. I didn't feed for 6 days and the dirt still felt moist and inch down. One friend who has had more than a few successful grows with it says he's never seen it drain this slow.

We are using CO2 with levels of 1100ppm during the day and off at night. We had the levels at 1500ppm for a couple of weeks, then we dropped them to 1100 on advice from other growers.

The temps in the room are 73-76 during the day and 70-73 during the night. We dropped the humidity down to around 35-40% to try and dry them out. They still dry out super slow.

We are using well water that is high in iron but everything I've read said that shouldn't be a problem. I don't have enough experience, but if the water was the issue wouldn't they stress when we watered them in the cubes prior to transplant? We watered them for a few days in the cubes and they were that nice green color with no yellow.

Then we transplanted them moved them from a tent to a room. Put them under 3 600watt bulbs that were 60" away. They started to yellow after 2 or 3 days. I wasn't keeping a proper journal at that time. So the exact time isn't known.

We fed them this recipe the first week. Some friends said it this that stressed them.
40gal water 320ml Micro(cutting edge)
100ml Grow
100ml Bloom
80ml Liquid Karma
200ml MaxiCrop
80ml Protech
40ml RootsExcel
160ml CalMag
20tsp Great White(misread directions and used the soil mixture instead of hydro. called manufacturer and they said it wouldn't hurt anything)
40tbsp B-1
240tps Tappin Roots
320ml Hydrazene
40oz Maxicrop
ph 5.8

We fed with this over the course of 11 days before switching to another recipe on advice from a more experienced grower. Growth seemed slow to me and the coco wasn't drying out fast at all. Water wouldn't soak into it very fast either... Sometimes 20 seconds or so before it would drain down into the pot.

The new recipe is 40gal water
360ml micro
40tbsp B-1
40ml CalMag
40oz Maxicrop
240tsp Tappin Roots
50ml Verde
20ml RootsExcel
ph5.8

We fed them going by weight of the pots for 5 days and they bounced back. Greened up some and seemed to grow faster. We added in the more nutrients on the sixth day.
120ml Bloom
80ml Liquid Karma
80ml Protech
40ml RootsExcel
4tsp GreatWhite
120ml CalMag
ph5.8

We let them dry out really good before we fed them heavy with that and they loved it. Greened up and seemed to lose weight quick over the first night. It's been two days since then and they look like they are going back to yellowing. The coco is also not drying out.

Any advice would help. Any criticism too. They've been in the room for 21 days and seem a bit short. The Grape Ape I know is a short strain. The Dream Queen is a a little taller. Growth is slow if they are stressed and they are very stressed it seems.
 

panick503

Member
If it was me I'd get the temperature up to at least 78 or 80 for the veg during the day. I think they like this temperature better, and things will certainly dry out quicker. And if you're running gas, you can really have the temp up around 85, and things will really start humming.
 

Scrappy-doo

Well-known member
A pic is worth a thousand words brotha, you're gonna get much better advice with a few at least. Are they currently in flower? That will be very relevant to what your options are.

So the obvious issue is that they aren't drinking. Not drinking means a root problem. How long have they been in their current containers? Have you taken a look at the roots? If not that's the first place you need to look. Put a hand on the top soil to support and turn your plant upside down, then gently work the pot off and have a look. They should be white and hairy. If they're brown and soggy they are dead and that is your problem. You need healthy roots to have a healthy plant. If they look good then you move to the next possible issue.
 

Mikell

Dipshit Know-Nothing
ICMag Donor
Veteran
^Panicks on point. Just as there is a sweet spot for your humidity/temperature ratio, the same goes for temperature/CO2. Spurr has a fairly comprehensive thread on this site if you search it out, more than likely the source for that recommendation of 1100ppm as well.

What size pots? What EC are these mixtures? You flipped when you put them in the new room/transplanted? re: 21 days since flip.
 

Lester Beans

Frequent Flyer
Veteran
Need pics and info like age of plants, stage they are in, pH, etc..

First that is a massive amount of nutrient.

I would flush the media very well with properly ph'd plain water.

Then I would feed at half strength a combo of veg and bloom base only.

Kill the co2.

You could foliar feed if you have the balls, but I wouldn't add the extra variable.

When they bounce back, mix your res by adding additives as specified on the bottle and then topping up to proper ppm/EC with base nutrient.

Less is more, always.

More info and we could offer more specific help.
 

Scott42012

New member
Hmmmm... I put pics on the original post. I did have the album set to private though. I'm running bottles. They are vegging still. They have been in 1 gallon pots since January 30th. We got them on the 27th and had them in a tent till the 30th. EC is around 880-900. Last night I turned up the temp to 82, went to bed at midnight-ish. Got up at around 7 and checked on them. They look better already. Pots feel dryer too, could be just in my head. They look like they are bouncing back. I'll grab a quick pic of them this morning. Thanks everyone for the advice.
 

stihgnobevoli

Active member
Veteran
are you sure the coco isn't drying out? like i mean even new coco with nothing in it for aeration should dry out in a couple days with nothing in it. but a plant that big in comparison to the size of the pot under 3x600w you should be having to water several times a day. at least once a day.

Hard to tell much about the environment from the pics, but those leaves are saying K def, and Mag Def, and Cal Def. but all those don't usually come together. you either are feeding too much too high EC/PPM or you're letting the pots either stay wet too long or dry out too fast.

Coco breaks down to K so you should never be seeing those unless you're watering too often and letting it dry out too much which would cause there to be a rapid build up of salt in the media. or overfeeding.

based on what you tell me the only thing that could be wrong is that your roots aren't fully grown into that pot. the top dries fast, the bottom stays wet.

me personally i would back off the nutes, drop em like 50%. then after that water once real good with plain water. wash all the old nutes through with the plain water. then i would let them dry out, only water enough to keep the top half inch moist. like you really don't even need to water water, just cover the tops of the pots with mulch or a cover. but if that's not an option just do a light spray with a sprinkler, or mist. looks like you got a whole tray setup so you prolly wont be able to easily just mist the top of the coco.

but that's what i see going on here based on the information you've given.
 

Scott42012

New member
We jacked the temp up to 82-85. They looked better this morning, just went in to take the these pics and the co2 was way high. What the hell??? Took care of that. This is the first run of this room. I know it has to be dialed in but damn. Stressed plant stress me.

Hey Ghostmade, I haven't been venting at night. It does turn off and we let them eat what's left. Should I be?

Also, they dried out more last night than they usually do over two or three days. That's good right? It's just plain coco. Everyone I've spoken to says that's weird and that I should be having an issue with them being too dry. Maybe when the sun comes up tonight they will be dry enough. I should hit them with a lighter dose of nutes right? Can I cut my current mixture with water or just start over with a new build?

these are from this morning.
 

stihgnobevoli

Active member
Veteran
if you have a meter then you can just add water to dilute it. no point in wasting a buncha nutes by flushing down the drain.
 

Mikell

Dipshit Know-Nothing
ICMag Donor
Veteran
Drop total EC (not ppm. Giving ppm isn't useful without the conversion scale) to 1.0-1.2 and keep watering by weight. Head over to Coir sub-forum for more specific advice on retooling your feed mixture based on what you have. Lesters on it, for a first grow stick to base nutrient with very few additive if any.
 

stoned40yrs

Ripped since 1965
Veteran
You screwed them up by letting the coco get dry after you had an established root system. Lockout city:biggrin: when you let them dry. You should have been watering them multiple times per day with that mix. You don't feed by the weight of the container after roots are established. You aren't in soil. Coco is a whole nother ballgame.Looks like 50% or more perlite. Plus it's got worm casings so how do you factor that with the other nutes #s. You have a complicated mix for a medium and a crap load of nutes and additives, and never used coco before. Is this the stuff you are using? sounds like hempy bucket mix:
"ReadyGro Aeration Formula (4 to 6 waterings daily) is specifically designed for automated hydrogardens and self-watering planters with small to midsize plants. This blend is lighter and contains higher air content than the moist formula. It is virtually impossible to over-water plants with this formula. Plants can sit in ReadyGro with 1 to 2 inches of water and, through the process of capillary feeding, hydrate and feed as needed."
 

stihgnobevoli

Active member
Veteran
^^^ that's actually sounding like what i use. 50%+ coco, 10% EWC, the rest is perlite. anywhere from 10%-25%

water it like you would coco. use chem nutes or organics. but water it like coco. needs to stay moist. so does soil. but coco dries out real fast. pretend like it's sandy soil.
 

Cat Jockey

Member
We are using well water that is high in iron but everything I've read said that shouldn't be a problem. I don't have enough experience, but if the water was the issue wouldn't they stress when we watered them in the cubes prior to transplant? We watered them for a few days in the cubes and they were that nice green color with no yellow.

You have nutrtient/pH/lockout-toxicity issues. Maybe I missed it, but what is the starting pH and ppm of your well water before you add anything to it? From there, it isn't just the 'how much' of the ppm and pH, it is also the 'what the hell is exactly in it' factor, as well. Also, things like the buffering capacity and alkalinity of it.

Bottom line, some get lucky, but well water can really jack up some things in your nutrient solution, like precipitating certain nutrients out of the solution as well as causing some lockout conditions.

From there, I'm going to load another bowl and not do the math concerning your proportions of each component of your Witches Brew you are fertilizing with, but wonder, as I fire that bowl up, how far you are straying with each one from the recommended dosage on the label, and if so, why?

I won't just yet tell ya how I feel about Bontanicare stuff, and how they don't (maybe they fixed this in the years since I have used their stuff) provide good blends for Sweet Lady Jane farming without giving them a bunch more money for their crap. To each their own, but I'll tell right now, since you are new, co-co substrates suck-suck.

It ain't some magic shit that grows 'better' weed. It is the result of someone scratching their head while looking at a big pile of coconut husks - a by-product (trash) of the coconut food/oil industry, and saying "What the fuck am I goign to do with all of this shit, and since I am a business wo/man, is there a way I can package it up and actually sell this crap?"

Some poor asshole in India is making a couple pennies a day, husking coconuts like a mudder fugger 7 days per week to feed his wife, 10 kids and his parents in a 2 room shack. People like Botanicare come along and take the rewards of that sweat labor and sell it to You. They call it 'Earth Friendly', etc., to make you feel all warm and fuzzy inside about using the labor of that poor Indian asshole to grow your weed.

It is a pain in the ass, as well. Concerning the flushing of it that must be done, variances of that process in different batches, Cal and Mag lockout issues, etc. Anyone that says it grows the 'Best' weed is an intermediate grower at best and doesn't know wtf they are talking about. Okay, that's harsh, but there isn't a 'Best' substrate, There are some shitty ones, though ...

I'm a jackass, but a helpful jackass. I'll share more and go through your nutrient regime with you and give you my opinion, but let's start with the ppm & pH readings on the well water, 'cause that can really screw things up bad, before you ever start, depending upon your specific well water, and it could take a few days to show signs ...
 
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