~PIFF~ A.K.A. Uptown Haze/Frankies/Church. Preserving a Heritage...

JJ-NYC · Jun 2, 2008

ARTofMAKINGfire said:
The Lineage:

The parents of Uptown Haze are unknown. Period. But these seeds came from HIGH GRADE Uptown. Church, Frankies, Brown, WTF?! This is Uptown Haze. Period. Call it what you want, those that live in NYC and surrounding areas KNOW. These seeds came from THE BEST Uptown I've ever come in contact with. I've come in contact with more than most as I used to transport. The growers of this strain DO NOT give it out. I know some personally. They are PISSED I AM DOING THIS!

I've been smoking the NYC Haze since the early 90's, so I know a little about it. It's rumored the strain is NL5 X Haze(old school). There are a few different versions of the strain. Some were greenish and others were brown or yellow(the best) I would love to have that cut. What you say is true, they are very tight with that strain. Good luck finding a keeper or a male to breed with as those seeds are probaly hermed-out and did not come from a true breeding. But you never know until you try.

imnotcrazy · Jun 2, 2008

Hey Art, FYI I've seen pure males come out of "Feminized" seedstock as well. A good example of this is the father used in Cocktail Frank's BPP cross. The father was from Rez's Feminized Absive Kushaze. You tried some, it's pretty good. Frank lucked out and we saw minimal herm's from that cross, so anything is possible.

asher1er · Jun 2, 2008

Art you gotta love that haze :joint:

20 days of 12/12 hopefully they come out nice

i hope them seeds put out how you plan, will be nice to flood the scene with them :joint:

ARTofMAKINGfire · Jun 2, 2008

imnotcrazy said:
Hey Art, FYI I've seen pure males come out of "Feminized" seedstock as well. A good example of this is the father used in Cocktail Frank's BPP cross. The father was from Rez's Feminized Absive Kushaze. You tried some, it's pretty good. Frank lucked out and we saw minimal herm's from that cross, so anything is possible.

Ahhhh. Thank you for that information! Hopefully there's a little more luck in store for the FUCKEM crew...

Brother_Monk · Jun 2, 2008

Males from fem seeds are very possible. Very rare though.

I went to work tonight, thinking about this thread for some reason. I was thinking about commercially grown NYC ganja, and I kept coming to the same conclusion. Usually any seed that comes from prematurely harvested sativas, are from stress factors. I doubt the clone would be kept around if it showed balls early.

Pollen can and will travel great distances, under the right conditions. But more than likely, it only drifts, at most, a few hundred meters. So to me, it sounds like you will be growing feminized seeds. S1...not F1. If you wanna make seeds with the mother, choose a stable, proven IBL, then backcross 4 or 5 times to stabilize. Selecting of course for your desired traits.

Or, perhaps instead of going through all the trouble, you could take a shortcut, and do a sex reversal of the resulting clone, and make feminized beans? Much less pollen, which means smaller amount of seeds, but the seeds are 99% female.

:ying:

ARTofMAKINGfire · Jun 3, 2008

That was my thinking as well. Seeing as how this weed has been the same for years, I doubt they would keep a clone around that hermied in early flower.
And again, while I understand the possiblilty of pollen from an outside source, I feel it is VERY HIGHLY unlikely.
So if I'm starting with S1 seeds, I can MAKE an F1 cross if I get a male and a female correct?
And if I don't get a male (which is likely) what are examples of stable IBL's? Please, for the love of GOD, no Diesel... It's a great spectrum of the palate, but its getting played out. I'm giving it a break so I don't ruin it for myself.
I want to do this the RIGHT way, no matter how long it takes. I can build whatever needs to be built, buy any equipment that need to be bought, and dedicate all my time to this. I have no job but this...

barletta · Jun 3, 2008

ART - Rather than ONLY 'f2'/S1 these plants, why not also cross with a haze/nl or something similar? I'm not trying to break your balls, but creating stability may take years. An initial outcross to something similar would most likely produce some very pif-leaning plants (AND some very 'outcross' leaning 1's)

ARTofMAKINGfire · Jun 3, 2008

Uptown Haze

Uptown Haze

UPTOWN #1

UPTOWN #2

They are both about a week old...

fjällhöga · Jun 3, 2008

S1 = f2

f2 x f2 = f3

most likely you will make f3's , but the probability to hit both genders is shocking small

Fj

asher1er · Jun 3, 2008

lookin good art :joint:

xOOx · Jun 3, 2008

art,

nice little babies there .. pifflings?

rub the fan leaf or the main stem (ever so gently) and sniff yer finger.

any odor=?

xoox

Brother_Monk · Jun 3, 2008

ARTofMAKINGfire said:
So if I'm starting with S1 seeds, I can MAKE an F1 cross if I get a male and a female correct?
And if I don't get a male (which is likely) what are examples of stable IBL's? Please, for the love of GOD, no Diesel...

Lol! Like any diesel is a true IBL
:bashhead:

You are correct! But don't count on getting a male from these S1's. As stated before, males from these type of seeds are rare. And if you could find a good stable haze, I would agree that should be a starting point for a cross. The only problem I have with that idea, is Haze was originally a 3-4 way cross. I don't remember the exact details, but it is a crazy poly hybrid. Do some research to see if anyone has done extensive work with a haze line to stabilize it. Fj would be a good one to ask. A solid sativa in my experience, would be a sturdy Super Silver Haze. My KaliMist aint too bad either, but I think that would muddy up the pool, for what you are looking to do. Perhaps a plain 'ol mexi, or a proven Thai? You're just gunna hafta experiment with a few crosses, 'till you hit the nail.

Speaking of Fj :wave:

hey bro! Do me a favor huh buddy....can you explain to me how S1=F2?

The best example of a solid IBL is one I have from HTC. It's Skunk IBL. One of the best breeding tools I have in my arsenal.

:ying:

spadedNfaded · Jun 3, 2008

Hey Art, i'm glad that you got the balls to bring this shit out. I just got up to date on this thread and am truely happy for you bro. If you can get a couple ladies or a lady and a male you could do wonderful things.

I've had uptown haze before, i'd had downtown haze, haze that sucks, haze that rocks and my favorite, that yellowish haze that makes your mouth numb and is so hazey is almost tastes sweet.
I hope you get the ladder and i hope that whoever is threatening you learns that marijuana is for everyone not just people who choose to believe that they "own" a strain. If i sold a bag wit a seed in it, then it now belongs to the possessor.

I've very pleased with the progress so far, they are looking very nice for being a week old and i wish you all the best through your trials with this lady.

I can really only imagine what this haze could be like if grown in the right (your) hands.

Keep your chin up man, and if you run into any snags then you got the FUCKEM crew behind you. no doubt.

Keep it green and take care of those ladies, they might make history.

- SubN

barletta · Jun 3, 2008

Oh christ, PLEASE don't have the s1/f2 argument HERE. THE SEEDS ARE FROM AN UNKNOWN POLLEN SOURCE. PERIOD. I want to see this grow, and where it goes, as I miss the pif like the desert miss the rain lol. 25% chance of m/f assuming (not)selfed seeds, both live, no outside influences on the sex (high/low, N,P, hot/dry, etc..)

I have read both BMonk and Fj's threads and seen your plants, and I have the utmost respect for you guys. Let's get this bad bitch stabilized and out there!!

ARTofMAKINGfire · Jun 3, 2008

How do you know these seeds came from an unknown pollen source?

Way before an F1, S1, F3, Piff, Brown, Church, stray pollen, or selfed, there was a plant that grew outside and had a tell tale odor that our early man knew was special. I'll just take that approach.

ARTofMAKINGfire · Jun 3, 2008

fjällhöga said:
S1 = f2

f2 x f2 = f3

most likely you will make f3's , but the probability to hit both genders is shocking small

Fj

I don't know too much about breeding, but I can intellectualize why an S1 would be an F2.
Perhaps because the pollen that is the result of a hermie still carries the same DNA and the same potential for different phenotypes to be displayed.
Much like using the pollen of a male of the same strain?
So the result would amlost be like taking the first F1 (Uptown Haze Female Clone) and crossing it with the second F1 (Pollen from Uptown Haze Hermaphroditic Stamen) creating an F2...

Am I way off?

strained · Jun 3, 2008

the guy who is threatening you is like monsanto who sue farmers who make make seeds from monsanto gmo crops without paying again. theres even companies who make plants that produce sterile seeds to protect the copyright of the plant. their called "the terminators" . lol

Grat3fulh3ad · Jun 3, 2008

ARTofMAKINGfire said:
I don't know too much about breeding, but I can intellectualize why an S1 would be an F2.
Perhaps because the pollen that is the result of a hermie still carries the same DNA and the same potential for different phenotypes to be displayed.
Much like using the pollen of a male of the same strain?
So the result would amlost be like taking the first F1 (Uptown Haze Female Clone) and crossing it with the second F1 (Pollen from Uptown Haze Hermaphroditic Stamen) creating an F2...

Am I way off?

Not off at all... you're exactly right.

homozygous strains when self pollinated breed true...

hybrids (heterozygous plants)when self pollinated produce the same variations present in any f2 (or poly-hybrid) generation...

Brother_Monk · Jun 3, 2008

barletta said:
Oh christ, PLEASE don't have the s1/f2 argument HERE.

Who's arguing? Back up a few steps dude, I asked a relevant question, to a respected breeder, concerning a conversation we were politely having. I'll gladly take my leave if this turns into a troll fest.

GratefulHead said:
homozygous strains when self pollinated breed true...

hybrids (heterozygous plants)when self pollinated produce the same variations present in any f2 (or poly-hybrid) generation...

I understand now...thanks Head! You always know how to put it in perspective for me.

Please Art....continue with the piff show. I'm interested in this grow because I smoked some uptown once,(well all I know is that's what he called it) but it had all the requirements you mentioned. First time I ever puked from smoking. We smoked a small J between the both of us. I was not expecting the visuals and auditory effects that I got. So yeah, keep it up!

:ying:

Rainman · Jun 3, 2008

First off this is a great thread and I hope Art comes through with his project. The thing that really sticks out in my mind though is that Art has seeds but no way of even knowing where they came from. Many on this thread have professed to getting many different versions/colors/looks of the PIFF, so within pool you are picking from it sounds like it could be anything. To breed something out as if you know the origin when you don't, is shooting in the dark at best! You say the seeds came from a guy who is one of your distrbtrs/ off a block of brick Piff but, have no way way of knowing if the seeds were just a couple he threw to keep you cool or what. As far as I can tell you don't know what you are growing 'yet' as it can't be verified by anyone so to assume it is the PIFF and just announce that you are saving the PIFF heritage is just way overshooting the scientific method. Too many unknowns and variables. What if the people hassling you got that info about you growing PIFF from your friend somehow and had him throw you a couple of bs seeds to see what your next move is? NYC is grimy like that and cats will protect turf and product in many covert ways. If you grow this out and it gives you the results you looked for then your hunch was well played. But anything up until the flowers are harvested and you know if it is what you are looking for, is just speculation and conjecture. But like I said good luck and want to see this be successful. Peace!!

~PIFF~ A.K.A. Uptown Haze/Frankies/Church. Preserving a Heritage...

Member

There is ALWAYS meaning to my madness ®

Active member

Grinding extra.

Brother_Monk

Grinding extra.

Bandaid

Grinding extra.

HazeAddictedFanatic

Active member

Active member

Brother_Monk

Active member

Bandaid

Grinding extra.

Grinding extra.

Member

The Voice of Reason

Brother_Monk

The revolution will not be televised.....