EastCoast710
Active member
In coco I start with a phed flush 3 weeks from chop. checking ppm of the runoff seems to match my last flower.. then just phed water the rest . and by the chop everything should be pretty yellow.
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Different buds, different flush
- Thread starter sourkush
- Start date
The black ash thing bugs me too.
This is my theory based on experience and testing.
I've experienced plants grown in the ground fed nothing, that faded out and burned perfectly, that grew next to a clone of the exact same variety, that burned not so good with a darker ash, less clean favor, and had less of a fade at harvest.
The clone that smoked not as nice never really performed as well as it's sisters, slightly smaller stature, less bushy, fewer buds sites. I put this down to a weaker root system and slower metabolism maybe.
So because it had a slower metabolism, it was less able to deplete the medium of nutes (the ground) or maybe just didn't process the nutes as well as the better performing ones.
Remaining nutes in the medium or plant itself is the cause of black ash and reduced quality. It's also important to note that the more resinous and dense the texture of the bud, the whiter the ash will be, provided as few nutes remain as possible.
Peace
This is my theory based on experience and testing.
I've experienced plants grown in the ground fed nothing, that faded out and burned perfectly, that grew next to a clone of the exact same variety, that burned not so good with a darker ash, less clean favor, and had less of a fade at harvest.
The clone that smoked not as nice never really performed as well as it's sisters, slightly smaller stature, less bushy, fewer buds sites. I put this down to a weaker root system and slower metabolism maybe.
So because it had a slower metabolism, it was less able to deplete the medium of nutes (the ground) or maybe just didn't process the nutes as well as the better performing ones.
Remaining nutes in the medium or plant itself is the cause of black ash and reduced quality. It's also important to note that the more resinous and dense the texture of the bud, the whiter the ash will be, provided as few nutes remain as possible.
Peace
i agree with your theory.
I'm not sure i'll do the "showering the soil" thing again. The ones i did are the slower to yellow. They were the darker to begin with, that's why i did it, but it doesn't seem to make them yellow faster.
I'd like to have RO water, i think it will be more efficient but i don't wanna invest in a kit and set it up it seems like a hassle.
I'm not sure i'll do the "showering the soil" thing again. The ones i did are the slower to yellow. They were the darker to begin with, that's why i did it, but it doesn't seem to make them yellow faster.
I'd like to have RO water, i think it will be more efficient but i don't wanna invest in a kit and set it up it seems like a hassle.
S
sourpuss
How long u guys flush your veggies? Not sure the last time i heard my apples werent flushed??
Internet is fully of dumb ideas..
Internet is fully of dumb ideas..
S
sourpuss
If a plant puts on the most weight in the last 2 weeks also known as producing more plant tissues does an enviroment of zero nutrients sound like a good idea to you? Or does feeding a plant as close to the right amount at the right time sound right? Is there any point in your life where 2 to 3 weeks of just water would be beneficial to your life? Or does eating just enough of the right foods to maintain a healthy diet sound right to you?
Did you ever eat an apple that tasted like it wasnt flushed??? Lol
Did you ever eat an apple that tasted like it wasnt flushed??? Lol
i've never tried an apple that tasted unflushed but i've definitely tried many buds that did.
Also i think fruits and veggies taste like shit in the supermarkets.
Anyway i'm not trying to argue about flushing or not, let me be dumb and flush my buds, i'm satisfied with my yields anyway so i don't care about getting these last 5% of weight that you might get from feeding til the end. Maybe we don't grow for the same reasons. If i wanted highest yields i wouldn't go veganic.
When you hear guys like aaron from dna saying "when you're leaves are crispy dying yellow, that's when you made a good job", i would trust him more. And that's not just him, every one says it except some people on forum boards.
And if you're harvesting fully green plants and have perfect buds then congrats, you have a competitive advantage over the dumb flushers!
Maybe you're the one who is right and it's not unflushed buds that burn black and taste harsh but then please share you're scientific knowledge about what does this
Also i think fruits and veggies taste like shit in the supermarkets.
Anyway i'm not trying to argue about flushing or not, let me be dumb and flush my buds, i'm satisfied with my yields anyway so i don't care about getting these last 5% of weight that you might get from feeding til the end. Maybe we don't grow for the same reasons. If i wanted highest yields i wouldn't go veganic.
When you hear guys like aaron from dna saying "when you're leaves are crispy dying yellow, that's when you made a good job", i would trust him more. And that's not just him, every one says it except some people on forum boards.
And if you're harvesting fully green plants and have perfect buds then congrats, you have a competitive advantage over the dumb flushers!
Maybe you're the one who is right and it's not unflushed buds that burn black and taste harsh but then please share you're scientific knowledge about what does this
Douglas.Curtis
Autistic Diplomat in Training
Cannabis with excess nutrients (hydro or soil, doesn't matter) contributes to low blood pressure. Headrushes and ischemic strokes. Anyone who doesn't know this has limited experience with cannabis. It also burns darker/blacker and leaves a heavier/harder ash behind. Period.
Cannabis is NOT a vegetable or a fruit, it's a dynamic/hyper accumulator plant. Comparing cannabis to veggies or fruit is ignorant. The fruits and veggies in the store taste like shit because they're grown for hardiness, not flavor and nutrition.
Feeding a cannabis plant excess nutrients will produce cannabis which no amount of flushing will cure. Hydro and organic produces the same results.
Lower 'larf' is not getting as much light, cannot process as strong of a nutrient solution/soil amendment strength, and will become over nutriented. Since cannabis packs on elements 'outside the passive ionic uptake' (see dynamic/hyper accumulator plants) it's extremely important to only allow it what it needs, when it needs it.
Excess kills quality and quantity.
Cannabis is NOT a vegetable or a fruit, it's a dynamic/hyper accumulator plant. Comparing cannabis to veggies or fruit is ignorant. The fruits and veggies in the store taste like shit because they're grown for hardiness, not flavor and nutrition.
Feeding a cannabis plant excess nutrients will produce cannabis which no amount of flushing will cure. Hydro and organic produces the same results.
2-3 weeks after switching to 12/12, cut away all bud sites which are growing a stem to reach for more light. All the remaining sites are within the optimal light range and will mature at the same rate.
Lower 'larf' is not getting as much light, cannot process as strong of a nutrient solution/soil amendment strength, and will become over nutriented. Since cannabis packs on elements 'outside the passive ionic uptake' (see dynamic/hyper accumulator plants) it's extremely important to only allow it what it needs, when it needs it.
Excess kills quality and quantity.
good to know, i'll check about dynamic/hyper accumulator plants
Still hard to do when you have 16 dif strains under one 600w cause they consume water and nutrients all at a different rate and i'm not going to mix a precise nutrient mix for every single plant but i make an average, the tallest/biggest/fastest ones are a little underfed and the smallest/slowest/less healthy roots get a little overfed. I can't have it all perfect with so many different strains.
Still hard to do when you have 16 dif strains under one 600w cause they consume water and nutrients all at a different rate and i'm not going to mix a precise nutrient mix for every single plant but i make an average, the tallest/biggest/fastest ones are a little underfed and the smallest/slowest/less healthy roots get a little overfed. I can't have it all perfect with so many different strains.
A hyperaccumulator is a plant capable of growing in soils with very high concentrations of metals, absorbing these metals through their roots, and concentrating extremely high levels of metals in their tissues. The metals are concentrated at levels that are toxic to closely related species not adapted to growing on the metalliferous soils. Compared to non-hyperaccumulating species, hyperaccumulator roots extract the metal from the soil at a higher rate, transfer it more quickly to their shoots, and store large amounts in leaves and roots. The ability to hyperaccumulate toxic metals compared to related species has been shown to be due to differential gene expression and regulation of the same genes in both plants. Over 500 species of flowering plants have been identified as having the ability to hyperaccumulate metals in their tissues.
Next question is, can they get rid of the excess metals they have stored (by flushing to get them to use what they stored) or once the metals are in the plant material, they can't be used anymore?
Next question is, can they get rid of the excess metals they have stored (by flushing to get them to use what they stored) or once the metals are in the plant material, they can't be used anymore?
S
sourpuss
Id consider last 2 weeks same as body building... more mass... needs input... things people swear are gospel make me laugh... from experiance the flushed weed gives me a headache and is blacker ash lol.. theres a difference between flush and fade... learn to fade... in no way does dna say water only... so how else do yyou make a plant yellow?? Hmmm... 
Douglas.Curtis
Autistic Diplomat in Training
I've read where it was believed the cannabis plant was capable of directly binding excess nutrients/elements to tissue. I would imagine any free moving, non-bound metals would move during a flush.
I'm more interested in how excess elements degrade quality so quickly. Cannabis uses additional pathways to absorb elements in the root zone. The 'Passive Ionic Uptake' which organics relies on is only one pathway for cannabis. The additional pathways make balance and nutrient/amendment strengths much more important to consider.
Do you know if it's all of the metallic elements that can accumulate in plant matter (N,P,K, others?) or only some of them?
And the ones that accumulate, are they all responsible for quality degradation? Or should you really avoid a N excess more than a P or K excess or the other way around?
And the ones that accumulate, are they all responsible for quality degradation? Or should you really avoid a N excess more than a P or K excess or the other way around?
N excess = black ash, P excess = sparkles and hissing when burning and nasty odor.
Peace
Peace
S
sourpuss
Note the words excess...
Douglas.Curtis
Autistic Diplomat in Training
I've read cannabis can absorb toxic levels of cadmium from "Cadmium Safe(tm)" soil. As for the other metals I don't know any details, I only know it does happen.
I avoid excess of anything. (Sourpuss is right on the money)
Think of it like this:
Any excess of anything (in the root zone of the cannabis plant) can be absorbedpainted directly onto the surface of cells within the plant. Once 'painted' it's not going to go anywhere, including flushing or fading. This is not the regular absorption and use of nutrients the organic gardening crowd is familiar with. As far as quality goes, cannabis cares not if you're using bottled nutes or organic amendments, excess is excess and it greatly decreases quality.
The key is to find a balanced nutrient profile. One without excess for the strains and environment you're in.
Another reason cannabis crackles and sparkles is excess magnesium. I personally believe you should be able to cut cannabis at any time in flower, quick dry it, and get zero crackling or sparking when it's burned. Any sign of crackling or sparking, at any time during flower, and you're using too much magnesium. Again, just my personal opinion.
Douglas.Curtis
Autistic Diplomat in Training
Try growing and flushing with R/O water next time.
I had a friend who thought he knew how to flush, he turned the weed into something that wasn't very good. It had little taste, grey ash and gave me a small headache, he thought I was thinking it was too strong but really it was just not good smoke. He thought he could mix his own nutrients and knew the process of flushing down to a t but really he had too many pH swings, poor quality source water (hard water with excess magnesium and calcium) but did not do much to correct it and at times nothing to correct it. Combine this is too fast of a dry and it turned to worse, proper feeding, which to me also means proper flushing and proper drying all contribute to the white ash at the end, my opinion is you add molasses at the end flushing to help the plant to stop up taking as much nutrients and use up reserves.
S
sourpuss
Try growing and flushing with R/O water next time.
Great point. I have done that and it resists burning freely. Not saying i didnt fuck up somewhere else along the way. I def gonna try 1 plant sometime that way... i agree with the statement that u should be able to cut a bud at any point in flower and it should burn clean. Means your doing it right...
Douglas.Curtis
Autistic Diplomat in Training
Most likely overfed at some point or an excess of something, yeah. R/o grown, R/o faded... I have zero burning issues.
