Only a few out there, and these guys don't seem to be one of them.
Don't think any company would recommend running their machine at 5k
Don't think any company would recommend running their machine at 5k
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Looking for CO2 Oil Consultant!
- Thread starter tman26
- Start date
whereisbrianV.
Active member
Any pressure over 3500 psi is a waste all the extra yeild is undesirable and the aromatic quality is ruined.
Also your extract will not be decarbed more than 20% from a 5000 psi run unless you are needlessly heating the oil in the seperator like the waters machine.
I have recently made a 800 gram order for the largest edible companies in WA. They wanted the oil completely raw and unwinterized which I was happy to do. It tested at 55% total with 5.5% terps which is pretty good for a trim run.
I have yet to meet someone with a solid grasp on extracting using Co2. Even the experts have little real world experience testing a wide variety of materials in Co2. I can to WA expecting to be schooled but it is a sad state of affairs when it comes to Co2 extraction. Why someone will pay waters to have them pay thar to build a machine is crazy. Thars pumps dont flow near enough to justify the price, .5 liter/per min is just not going to get it done.
Also your extract will not be decarbed more than 20% from a 5000 psi run unless you are needlessly heating the oil in the seperator like the waters machine.
I have recently made a 800 gram order for the largest edible companies in WA. They wanted the oil completely raw and unwinterized which I was happy to do. It tested at 55% total with 5.5% terps which is pretty good for a trim run.
I have yet to meet someone with a solid grasp on extracting using Co2. Even the experts have little real world experience testing a wide variety of materials in Co2. I can to WA expecting to be schooled but it is a sad state of affairs when it comes to Co2 extraction. Why someone will pay waters to have them pay thar to build a machine is crazy. Thars pumps dont flow near enough to justify the price, .5 liter/per min is just not going to get it done.
whereisbrianV.
Active member
1000 grams of material yeilding around 100 grams of oil every 2.5 hours from our 5000psi 5l apeks.
I wouldn't suggest a Apeks to anyone for anything. The machines in all available configurations are dangerously inefficient and cost around $40 a cycle to run. Every stroke of the gas booster leaks a little more than the stroke before it and the electrical compressor is going to need the valves rebuilt when extract that blows through the seperators come into contact with the valve seats.
I wouldn't suggest a Apeks to anyone for anything. The machines in all available configurations are dangerously inefficient and cost around $40 a cycle to run. Every stroke of the gas booster leaks a little more than the stroke before it and the electrical compressor is going to need the valves rebuilt when extract that blows through the seperators come into contact with the valve seats.
You do realize that Waters owns Thar right? Generally waters handled small ones up to the double 5L and Thar did anything bigger although I heard waters will be doing 20L(havnt checked recently). They have a wide variety of pumps and can make you pretty much any configuration it is just about how much you want to spend. People go with Thar/waters because they are the #1 scfe company in the world. Most of the large factories in the world were done by them. There is a reason for this. They know what they are doing. Check out how much business they did first quarter of this year alone. Big difference in price though. My experience with them was very pleasent compared to when I dealt with Eden and Apeks who were both incredibly unprofessional.
What do you think of scientific investigations such as Sustainable Production of Cannabinoids with Supercritical Carbon Dioxide Technologies?
Digital Man
Member
6 months after the fact but what would YOU buy today then ?
whereisbrianV.
Active member
If I had to buy a machine today I would buy a 20 liter MRX machine.
They know plenty but what you don't know is that they are also your competition. They have offshoots that make extracts. Why would they make you smart and producing oils that are better than theirs.
whereisbrianV.
Active member
I read the study over and it seems like the same old same old. Doing studies in a lab making a few grams or extract all at supercritical with stupid low flow rates. There is a disconnect with studies trying to make pharma grade cannabinoids and companies making extractions for the consumers to use.
Supercritical is a red-herring and just leads to more post-processing. Liquid Co2 with high flow rates gives you the clarity of a distillate with the terpene profile of a rosin. Problem is that Liquid Co2 takes some heavy cooling power to maintain liquid levels and a supercritical Co2 machine just doesn't have the cooling power to make it work.
Supercritical is a red-herring and just leads to more post-processing. Liquid Co2 with high flow rates gives you the clarity of a distillate with the terpene profile of a rosin. Problem is that Liquid Co2 takes some heavy cooling power to maintain liquid levels and a supercritical Co2 machine just doesn't have the cooling power to make it work.
teejay5150
New member
I run two MRX 20L and one MRX 100L i could give you a consult.
The most amazing oil I have ever had was co2 extracted.
Some cats from new York showed up middle of the night years back with some Dutch treat oil that had near no color and a consistency I've yet to see again.
I've seen and tries many oils. Thag ditch treat oil to this day was by far the best. Nothing ever compares. I didn't know how good it was when I got it until years later
Now here I am constantly reminded and trying to figure out how to go about making something so beautiful.
It had zero throat/lung constriction upon inhaling and exhaling. All the bho dabs and even "raw" "clear" super critical or short path oils give u a horrible lung/throat constriction. Very unpleasant to inhale I do not see how people enjoy it
I feel blessed to have experienced that co2 oil just once so I know better.. they barely wanted to let any of the oil go lpl but we're nice enough to let a G go lol
Where is brain v, I'm very interested in liquid co2 extraction. It sounds like everything I've been trying to figure out
Some cats from new York showed up middle of the night years back with some Dutch treat oil that had near no color and a consistency I've yet to see again.
I've seen and tries many oils. Thag ditch treat oil to this day was by far the best. Nothing ever compares. I didn't know how good it was when I got it until years later
Now here I am constantly reminded and trying to figure out how to go about making something so beautiful.
It had zero throat/lung constriction upon inhaling and exhaling. All the bho dabs and even "raw" "clear" super critical or short path oils give u a horrible lung/throat constriction. Very unpleasant to inhale I do not see how people enjoy it
I feel blessed to have experienced that co2 oil just once so I know better.. they barely wanted to let any of the oil go lpl but we're nice enough to let a G go lol
Where is brain v, I'm very interested in liquid co2 extraction. It sounds like everything I've been trying to figure out
whereisbrianV.
Active member
Extract.guru is my blog PM me for my contact information. I have some dutch treat oil on hand for you.
Hey brain
Super glad u chimed in I was hoping u would in time.
I see lots of speculation and people doubting u with the co2 oil.
Ime it's the best. I met some guys who blessed me w the experience of high terp super clean oil that was simply like smoking flowers yet largely amplified à u say.
People that have yet to experience on extract of this quality are still thinking bho is good and is where it's at... can u say hack up a lung man no extracts are good unless made w co2 ime lol...
Super glad u chimed in I was hoping u would in time.
I see lots of speculation and people doubting u with the co2 oil.
Ime it's the best. I met some guys who blessed me w the experience of high terp super clean oil that was simply like smoking flowers yet largely amplified à u say.
People that have yet to experience on extract of this quality are still thinking bho is good and is where it's at... can u say hack up a lung man no extracts are good unless made w co2 ime lol...
whereisbrianV.
Active member
Some extractors chase a consistency..
Others obsessively chase high lab test..
I focus solely on flavor, it is the most subjective feature of a extraction. The focus is not on what I like or dislike but on matching the flavor and aroma of the extracted material.... for better or for worse.
We have found several parameters that greatly affect the solubility of terpenes in Liquid Co2 extractions. This has allowed us to create more true to life terpene ratios in the extractions.
Others obsessively chase high lab test..
I focus solely on flavor, it is the most subjective feature of a extraction. The focus is not on what I like or dislike but on matching the flavor and aroma of the extracted material.... for better or for worse.
We have found several parameters that greatly affect the solubility of terpenes in Liquid Co2 extractions. This has allowed us to create more true to life terpene ratios in the extractions.
Beautiful
I'm curious if some strains have extra ordinary terp profiles, or if most strains average the same terp concentration?
Does Dutch treat have a uniquely high terp profile? And does the high terp profile make the oil darker or lighter than lower terp profile oils? Or does the color mainly depend on harvest time?
I wonder how certain terps affect consistency...
I'm curious if some strains have extra ordinary terp profiles, or if most strains average the same terp concentration?
Does Dutch treat have a uniquely high terp profile? And does the high terp profile make the oil darker or lighter than lower terp profile oils? Or does the color mainly depend on harvest time?
I wonder how certain terps affect consistency...
Sergey SLO
New member
Hello from Slovenia.
I try to to do subcritical CO2 hemp.
During the half year I will collect a large machine CO2 subcritical (80 liters - 15 kg of hemp)
Sergey SLO
New member
View attachment ML-1843-16-TEHLA_DRAFT.pdf
How do you assess the test result? I am interested in your opinion
How do you assess the test result? I am interested in your opinion
We use a Waters as well. I personally hate the thing. But we use it literally for the same reason. We know its clean. The only other thing that might be in the oil is organic alcohol if we winterize. Also the only and i really mean only good think about Waters is the terpene retention capability it has. I checked out an IES and was blown away. Its next level
BlackestofOps
Member
IES is not a good production level system, IMO. I got a demo of one of their machines, then I went to another lab for a different piece of equipment demo, they had an IES in a corner gathering dust. The owner hated it.
They use a needle valve and orifice that is probably in violation of Apeks' patent. It is also powered by air compressor-driven pumps, which we do not like at all.
I don't see any innovation coming from them, unless Apeks makes something cool they can rip off again.
For a machine that is using super high flow rates, and crazy chilling power, look at Vitalis ET.
I have done techno-economic analysis of 6 different makes of CO2 extractors. By total cost per gram of cannabinoid processed, Waters was the worst, Vitalis was the best (by far). The Vitalis also had the only case we've seen of actual cyclonic separation (Apeks makes this claim, but it has not been our experience in several years of use), and the coldest separation out of machines tested.
Qualitatively, a skilled technician can get good results from almost any machine, if they are free to hack away at it.
They use a needle valve and orifice that is probably in violation of Apeks' patent. It is also powered by air compressor-driven pumps, which we do not like at all.
I don't see any innovation coming from them, unless Apeks makes something cool they can rip off again.
For a machine that is using super high flow rates, and crazy chilling power, look at Vitalis ET.
I have done techno-economic analysis of 6 different makes of CO2 extractors. By total cost per gram of cannabinoid processed, Waters was the worst, Vitalis was the best (by far). The Vitalis also had the only case we've seen of actual cyclonic separation (Apeks makes this claim, but it has not been our experience in several years of use), and the coldest separation out of machines tested.
Qualitatively, a skilled technician can get good results from almost any machine, if they are free to hack away at it.
BlackestofOps
Member
MRX is the most overpriced junk available today. $750k plus about $150k in necessary accessories, all to partially extract 80 lbs a day. You still have to use ethanol extraction to get the rest of the cannabinoids out, as per their own sales pitch.
