Broad mites: ID and Organic Antidotes that work!

FatherEarth · May 16, 2015

Avinash.miles said:
thanks retrogro

and FE, i just finished reading the big soil little room thread, it's great and full of good info, just one question, what happened? seems like the thread ended.... rather suddenly without anyone taking note...
anyhow, whatever happened in little rooom full of big soil, I'm thankful for your input on the site.

Part 2 w the 12 gavitas came down on day 48 due to a shady partner.
Long story short i saved the drama. No need to scab a good thread. Ill pick up on it again this winter most likely...

FatherEarth · May 17, 2015

K uptake trumped by High Ca stimulated by Si

K uptake trumped by High Ca stimulated by Si

MJ,

milkyjoe said:
Downloading now....thanks FE.

I have no clue on uptake other than john claims the plant has limited cation and anion uptake just like soil. And then nova says a plant can take up 50% more nitrate than it can use. Is K the same way...I don't know.

I use sea shield to supply si along with adding it to the soil.

So I was looking at some sap analysis papers and came across something that may answer the question about the potassium silicate and K uptake.. Not sure if Notice what the chart says about applying Si to tomatoes..

Si:Stimulates Ca uptake, firm leaves. Decreases PM, Botrytis,Yellow calyxes and calyx fungi

:up to now no disadvantges in tomato, in soft fruits
K uptake will be lower caused by high Ca uptake

Your thoughts?

probably should post this in the plant sap thread as well...

milkyjoe · May 17, 2015

And K antagonizes it...so net affect ?

I could use it indoors but my K is less than 2%

Permacultuure · May 31, 2015

Love this thread bro!

After talking with Dave at Everwood Farms, my swirski plug, he sounded pretty pumped on the PFR-97. He mentioned they had done in house testing with it and are very impressed. They are going to be offering it online starting monday.

Did you implement it into your ipm? If so any feedback?

We should link in the gate soon....

nofriend · May 31, 2015

Botanigard/Mycotrol-O

Botanigard/Mycotrol-O

Ive said it before:

BOTANIGARD
BOTANIGARD
BOTANIGARD

http://www.bioworksinc.com/products/botanigard-es.php

I used to waste time with heat treatments. But I eliminated my BM problem by spraying Botanigard every 3 days for 2 weeks. Now I spray every couple weeks or so as preventative. I still order swirski satchets from Everwood around week 2 or 3 of 12/12. They have an organic production version of this product called Mycotrol-O for about 50% more.

The PFR-97 sounds great! I will order some when its available.

TheOutlawTree · Jun 27, 2015

Is there any chance of this PFR-97 working outdoors here in California? I would assume its to hot and dry here... But maybe if you sprayed in the evening it would work?

I would like to start using PFR-97 as part of an IPM for outdoor growing but I'm unsure if it would work.

The OG biowar didn't touch the root aphids I had a while back. The one thing I hate about the OG Biowar is that talc carrier. It makes it kind of hard to water in. I accidently watered in a little bit of the talc carrier on my indoor and it clogged up the coco pots pretty good.

TheOutlawTree · Jul 1, 2015

And what exactly is the difference between met-52 and PFR-97? I understand they both act in the same manner.

I know that an 8oz bottle of Met-52 liquid costs around 60$ and dosage for foliar application is 2.5-12.5 ML per gallon. With 29.5 ml in an OZ- this means the 8oz bottle of met-52 will make 18.8 gallons assuming you are using the 12.5ml per gallon dosage.

I saw some PFR-97 for sale- It was 5lb bag for 130$. Instructions-
More frequent application at low rate (e.g. 14-16 oz/100 gal every 3 to 5 days) is more likely to improve results than using higher rates at low frequency (e.g. 28 oz/100 gal every 10 days). Use higher rates (24-28 oz/100 gal) when applying to large or dense plant canopies to ensure complete coverage.

So PFR-97 has more bang for its buck, which we have already established a while back- but how do they compare to each other in effectiveness, and do they work in the hot California sun outdoors?

panick503 · Jul 1, 2015

The difference is different fungi that do the killing. Whether one is more effective than the other is open to debate, as neither has been researched a lot in regards to broad mites. All research I have seen has shown similar rates of efficacy. Also similar requirements in regards to humidity and temperature. I found the most luck googling the acual fungi instead of the brand name of the product (metaharzium anisopolae as opposed to met 52 for example), and the scientific name of broad mites as well. There are some published studies, but the results are some what inconsistent based in differing variables in the experiments..

Mikell · Jul 1, 2015

Beneficial fungi/bacterial pest control typically requires high humidity. Some companies (the maker of PFR-97) claim high RH for 8-10 hours is sufficient, but I've never seen anything else to back that up. Though to be honest I haven't looked hard on that point. Most recommendations advise raising RH during the entire treatment phase of 7-14 days.

FatherEarth · Jul 1, 2015

Yea we have used and are using it outdoors on large plants. Not for broad mites but for thrips and as preventative. Spraying before it sunset and letting me set overnight. We also mix it in with AEA foliar feeding on a weekly schedule...

the fungal spore germinates in the 8-10 hrs of high RH The fungal hyphae penetrate the insect exoskeleton and begins the mummification process drawing moisture out of the insect and colonizing the body with its mycelium. So once it germinates on the insect its on autopilot...

moses wellfleet · Jul 1, 2015

Horticultural oils also worked for me, I used half the recommended dosage to avoid the emulsion from clogging up the plants stomata!

FatherEarth · Jul 19, 2015

Im under the impression that stomata are self cleaning and that they generally cant be clogged. I think that came out of a study from nova crop control but I could be mistaken on that...

On another note... Im fairly sure Ive whipped the BM's..

I have some plants that show the curled leaf tips from the digestive enzymes, but I cannot find a BM or an egg anywhere. I am still finding PFR mummies of mites( including two spotted ) with the microscope despite having stopped spraying it over a month ago.

So I went at least 3 weeks without a single IPM application.. LOL came back and BM's are gone, now I find two spotted spider mites!? WTF, lol.. Ill gladly trade for two spotted anyday its just kinda odd... Makes me wonder if two spotted mites dont eat BM's like swirskis? Ill keep looking for signs of BM's but you would think that after 3 weeks with no IPM that you would be able to find a healthy population if they were there...

Respect,

FE

Permacultuure · Jul 21, 2015

Congrats!! What did your ipm consist of. Currently using Grandevo and pfr-97 along with beauvarian bassiana as a soil drench. Swirskii and cucumeris by the thousands

moses wellfleet · Aug 13, 2015

moses wellfleet said:
Horticultural oils also worked for me, I used half the recommended dosage to avoid the emulsion from clogging up the plants stomata!

OK I have been using this method for a while now with great results.

The product is Pyrol by Neudorff. I have been using the concentrate but there is also a ready to spray option. Do an Internet search if you are interested.

The broads are extremely sensitive to this stuff. It is completely organic, mainly canola oil. I use it half to quarter strength and it works. At higher dosages leaves get burned and it leaves an oily residue but as I said it's not necessary to go above half strength.

I hope this helps peeps out there as these fuckers cause nothing but misery!!!

Mikell · Aug 13, 2015

IPM is a program, not the action of spraying a plant or other means of directly controlling a pest (changing environment, introducing predators, etc). I'm not sure why there is any confusion (and there most definitely is) in this other than that none of you understands what the acronym means.

http://www.epa.gov/opp00001/factsheets/ipm.htm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Integrated_pest_management

Take note that control (the process of reducing pest populations) is but one facet of a broad system.

moses wellfleet · Aug 13, 2015

Yes I have been using the predator mites as well and I have posted a lot about it but I was forced to go the spraying route because I also have regular spider mites and they are not prayed on by Swirkii mites.

So in other words I was forced to kill two birds with one stone!

FatherEarth · Aug 14, 2015

lol I totally understand what IPM means.. not sure what you are referring to exactly, mikell...

fsttimes81 · Aug 14, 2015

Best Organic solution I have found is FIRE! Burn that chit to the ground!!!!!!!!

moses wellfleet · Aug 14, 2015

I always thought that IPM was another buzzword created by organic nazis so they could look down on anyone who wasn't in their clique. ROLS is another example, it is reusing medium that's all. It gets a fancy name and a lot of hype. I guess it's part of today's hipster culture.

In my case I spray my plants, I don't do anything else because I don't need to. If that makes me uncool, well then...

Avinash.miles · Aug 14, 2015

moses wellfleet said:
I always thought that IPM was another buzzword created by organic nazis so they could look down on anyone who wasn't in their clique. ROLS is another example, it is reusing medium that's all. It gets a fancy name and a lot of hype. I guess it's part of today's hipster culture.

In my case I spray my plants, I don't do anything else because I don't need to. If that makes me uncool, well then...

I'm pretty sure you are wrong about IPM being a "buzzword by organic nazis". It's a horticultural term, used by many professionals growing all kinds of crops.
no, i am sure you are wrong about "IPM" being part of "hipster culture".

not needing to spray your plants doesn't make you uncool, but posts like your last one in this thread may just.

funny how people refer to the organic nazi's... but i don't see them around much nowadays, i know there was a time in the organic section where there was lots of strife, but i just... dont see it now.

Broad mites: ID and Organic Antidotes that work!

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